Ben's Road Woes

[Psycho Ward 86]

2015/2016 on the Road:

Completion %: 64.4%
Yards: 4,003
Yards/Attempt: 7.9
TD: 14
INT: 17
QB Rating: 83.8

2015/2016 at Home:

Completion %: 68%
Yards: 3,754
Yards/Attempt: 8
TD: 36
INT: 12
QB Rating: 107

I feel like we can talk about this until we're blue in the face but it's still one of the elephants in the room that needs to be talked about. I, like many steelers fans, have had very little confidence in Ben the past 2 seasons and change when we play on the road. Why the crazy discrepancy in effectiveness on the road? Sure, playing on the road is always harder, but a lot of great QB's around the league just dont have this problem the way Ben does the past few seasons. He's a 4x pro bowler, 2 time super bowl champion, future 1st ballot HOFer, one of the toughest dudes to ever play, and 14 year veteran. How could this guy be rattled by anything like a trip down country into enemy territory? Clearly it isnt a physical deficiency because hes still been a man possessed when were at Heinz Field. What do you guys think is going on here and what should be done to right the ship?

Interestingly enough, Ben has been pretty even in most of his past seasons between his road/home splits (referenced in terms of QB rating):

2014 home: 114.8
2014 road: 91

2013 home: 94.6
2013 road: 89.8

2012 home: 97.2
2012 road: 96.8

Hard to believe, but his current 2 seasons stretch of poor road play isnt even close to being his biggest disparity in a single season..

2011 home: 107.1
2011 road: 77.5

Go back any further than this and were probably turning too many pages to be searching for trends, but theres even seasons where hes been better on the road than at home (2004, 2007-2009)

They say the superbowl window is closed once Ben retires, but as far as I'm concerned, its already been closed until his road play returns up to par. Thoughts?

[BurghBoy412]

I think Ben has lived off of his past accomplishments long enough. I think it's time for Steeler Nation to face the music. The days of Ben putting the team on his back and winning a game are gone.

[SteelMayhem72]

Yep...ive always thought that he is probably our weak link on offense

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[SteelMayhem72]

Last couple seasons i mean

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[DesertSteel]

Yep...ive always thought that he is probably our weak link on offense

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Last couple seasons i mean

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Glad you amended that before I flamed you lol.

[teegre]

2015/2016 on the Road:

Completion %: 64.4%
Yards: 4,003
Yards/Attempt: 7.9
TD: 14
INT: 17
QB Rating: 83.8

2015/2016 at Home:

Completion %: 68%
Yards: 3,754
Yards/Attempt: 8
TD: 36
INT: 12
QB Rating: 107

I feel like we can talk about this until we're blue in the face but it's still one of the elephants in the room that needs to be talked about. I, like many steelers fans, have had very little confidence in Ben the past 2 seasons and change when we play on the road. Why the crazy discrepancy in effectiveness on the road? Sure, playing on the road is always harder, but a lot of great QB's around the league just dont have this problem the way Ben does the past few seasons. He's a 4x pro bowler, 2 time super bowl champion, future 1st ballot HOFer, one of the toughest dudes to ever play, and 14 year veteran. How could this guy be rattled by anything like a trip down country into enemy territory? Clearly it isnt a physical deficiency because hes still been a man possessed when were at Heinz Field. What do you guys think is going on here and what should be done to right the ship?

Interestingly enough, Ben has been pretty even in most of his past seasons between his road/home splits (referenced in terms of QB rating):

2014 home: 114.8
2014 road: 91

2013 home: 94.6
2013 road: 89.8

2012 home: 97.2
2012 road: 96.8

Hard to believe, but his current 2 seasons stretch of poor road play isnt even close to being his biggest disparity in a single season..

2011 home: 107.1
2011 road: 77.5

Go back any further than this and were probably turning too many pages to be searching for trends, but theres even seasons where hes been better on the road than at home (2004, 2007-2009)

They say the superbowl window is closed once Ben retires, but as far as I'm concerned, its already been closed until his road play returns up to par. Thoughts?

That is some OUTSTANDING data collection.

It backs up the "eye test" that we've all seen for ourselves. As I stated elsewhere, a few years ago, there wasn't another QB whom I'd take over BB. Not. One.

That said, currently, BB at home is still great. But, it's a coin toss (as the TD:INT ratio shows, it is literally almost 50/50 odds) whether "good Ben" or "bad Ben" shows up on the road.

[tube517]

In addition, look who Ben has been missing:

Heath Miller since last year
Hines Ward since 2011

I think this is part of the problem not the whole issue because Ben has been off target alot on the road.

He no longer has those 2 rock solid reliable receivers to get 1st downs. He said recently he has been forcing the ball to AB.

Bryant, Rogers, Juju, Hunter, Outlaw, Xman, McDonald need to step it up to be the reliable #2/#3 receiving option.

Ben definitely needs to really step it up.

[vasteeler]

I will laugh at this thread by the end of the season. Like Aaron Rodgers said RELAX. Ben will be fine

[Mojouw]

Rivers, Manning, and Ben have all been struggling to one degree or another the past few seasons. All 3 are slow out of the gate this year.

I hate to say it, but for the entire "Big 3" of that draft class it is time to seriously talk about their record versus father time.

I do not think Ben is done, but he needs to make an honest appraisal about wtf is going on and determine if he needs to make any adjustments to his game and/or prep.

At this point, he looks to be best positioned to have a career much longer than his draft mates. Eli looks done (and the stats argue that outside of SB wins, he wasn't ever as good as Rivers and Ben). Rivers has even more of a physical toll extracted from him then Ben.

[Born2Steel]

Even this version of Ben is still better than 80% of what's out there. Prime Ben was 90 percentile easy.

[BurghBoy412]

I love how Ben talks about needing to play better. Then turns around and takes an extra day off. Right Ben.

[Born2Steel]

LOL!

[86WARD]

He’s been awful in every game. If not for Brown, some of his throws would’ve been interceptions. If he doesn’t get his shit together, they’re doomed.

[RunNGun]

He’s been awful in every game. If not for Brown, some of his throws would’ve been interceptions. If he doesn’t get his shit together, they’re doomed.

Agreed. The way this season goes rests on his shoulders. If he doesn't step it up then this team is no better than 10-6, possibly worse. The excuse that he doesn't have his rock solid guys is invalid. Every good QB loses a favored target sooner or later through retirement, free agency, or trade. The great ones move forward.

[Born2Steel]

:rofl2:

[teegre]

I will laugh at this thread by the end of the season. Like Aaron Rodgers said RELAX. Ben will be fine

At home, yes. :nod:

On the road, the last two seasons (16 games): 14 TDs / 17 INTs :scared:

SUMMATION:
Home field advantage for the playoffs is HUUUUUGE!!!

[BurghBoy412]

Agreed. The way this season goes rests on his shoulders. If he doesn't step it up then this team is no better than 10-6, possibly worse. The excuse that he doesn't have his rock solid guys is invalid. Every good QB loses a favored target sooner or later through retirement, free agency, or trade. The great ones move forward.Agreedl

[vasteeler]

At home, yes. :nod:

On the road, the last two seasons (16 games): 14 TDs / 17 INTs :scared:

SUMMATION:
Home field advantage for the playoffs is HUUUUUGE!!!

I'm the eternal optimist ....that all ends this Sunday 48-0 Steelers

[Psycho Ward 86]

I will laugh at this thread by the end of the season. Like Aaron Rodgers said RELAX. Ben will be fine

i wouldnt be worried if he was Aaron Rodgers but thats not the case. Ben has been anything but fine on the road, and if doesnt step it up the best were going to see during the Twilight Ben era is getting into the playoffs and making a routine exit via the Patriots

[st33lersguy]

Steelers aren't going to the Super Bowl if Ben doesn't improve his play on the road (that's probably pointing out the obvious). They won't get home field advantage if Ben doesn't improve his road play and they'll be in trouble if they have to go on the road.

Ben has definitely take a step back and is a part of the reason for offensive struggles.

[teegre]

I'm the eternal optimist ....that all ends this Sunday 48-0 Steelers

On a realistic level, I'll take 6 more road wins. Period.

3 in the regular season, to win the division... followed by 2 road wins in the playoffs, to get us to the SuperBowl... and then that final road win in Minnesota on Feb. 4, 2018.

[vasteeler]

On a realistic level, I'll take 6 more road wins. Period.

3 in the regular season, to win the division... followed by 2 road wins in the playoffs, to get us to the SuperBowl... and then that final road win in Minnesota on Feb. 4, 2018.:

Sounds good to me:drink:

[Neversatisfied]

I'd like to see the Steelers go all in for next years draft and get a QB who has a tremendous skill set (in the 1st round). It would be a great benefit to have Ben for a final year to help get the future QB comfortable and acclamated to the system

[fansince'76]

I'd like to see the Steelers go all in for next years draft and get a QB who has a tremendous skill set (in the 1st round). It would be a great benefit to have Ben for a final year to help get the future QB comfortable and acclamated to the system

Will there be any QBs in next year's draft that will actually be worth burning a first round pick on? I don't follow college ball, personally.

Taking a QB in the first just to take one is kinda how we wound up with Mark Malone...

[BlackAndGold]

Will there be any QBs in next year's draft that will actually be worth burning a first round pick on? I don't follow college ball, personally.

Taking a QB in the first just to take one is kinda how we wound up with Mark Malone...

It's still early, but the QB's in the 2018 draft class are not living up to the hype.

Us fans better hope Dobbs takes big steps in developing, or they sign Cousins via free agency(if Ben retires after the season).

[Craic]

Will there be any QBs in next year's draft that will actually be worth burning a first round pick on? I don't follow college ball, personally.

Taking a QB in the first just to take one is kinda how we wound up with Mark Malone...

Yeah, I'd actually be willing to trade out of the first round for a first round the following year plus extra stuff, then either stick with Ben another year. Ben's good for at least 3-4 road wins. That puts us around 9-11 wins a year and gets us into the playoffs. From there, as it is said, anything can happen.

[DesertSteel]

This has been stated already but I'd rather have Cousins, A. Smith or Brees if Ben retires than a draft pick at the bottom of the 1st.

[SteelMayhem72]

I love how Ben talks about needing to play better. Then turns around and takes an extra day off. Right Ben.Yeah he seems to take an extra day off through the week every week

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[SteelMayhem72]

Id bet a whole paycheck that ben retires after this season. Last 2 seasons I havent liked his body language... something is up

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[86WARD]

Id bet a whole paycheck that ben retires after this season. Last 2 seasons I havent liked his body language... something is up

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I’ll take that $5.50 bet!

;)

[vasteeler]

Road Ben looking good so far today

[fansince'76]

Road Ben looking good so far today

Yep, despite more drops by his receivers not named Brown. Guess he has to catch them for them too.

And therein lies the biggest difference between the Pats and Steelers. When Brady hits his guys in the hands they catch them, pretty much without fail.

[43Hitman]

Yep, despite more drops by his receivers not named Brown. Guess he has to catch them for them too.

And therein lies the biggest difference between the Pats and Steelers. When Brady hits his guys in the hands they catch them, pretty much without fail.
Yep, I really only saw one horrible ball, and that was the overthrow to Bryant. And even though you can't miss that throw, it wasn't near being a turnover.

[BlackAndGold]

Passing attack still isn't good.

[AtlantaDan]

Passing attack still isn't good.

The one drive at the end of the first half with the Ju Ju TD was the only time it looked in sync for an extended period

[Psycho Ward 86]

Road Ben is still alive and well. Lots of missed wide open touchdowns. He definitely gets a pass for that shoddy "interception" call.

The next 4 weeks are going to be a hilarious cavalcade of Ben alternating between his Jekyll and Hyde form

Jaguars
@Chiefs
Bengals
@Lions

Cant wait to get excited for 2 of those and rip my hair out for the other 2

[st33lersguy]

Thank god Le'Veon finally decided to show up

[Craic]

Ben didn't look his best today, but he looked better than he has. Hey, if we get an average performance in the first half of the season ramping up to a great performance in the second half of the season, I'll be ecstatic.

[lipps83]

Ben didn't look his best today, but he looked better than he has. Hey, if we get an average performance in the first half of the season ramping up to a great performance in the second half of the season, I'll be ecstatic.

Ben seems to take about a half season to warm up the last couple of years, so he should be back to his old self by weeks 8-10. He is also a year older, so weeks 10-12 at the latest. Just in time for playoffs.

[86WARD]

Ben didn't look his best today, but he looked better than he has. Hey, if we get an average performance in the first half of the season ramping up to a great performance in the second half of the season, I'll be ecstatic.

I thought the same. He missed some throws and reads but I thought he was better than earlier in the season. That missed Brown read and the over throw on Bryant were brutal...that was 12-16 points they left on the table...

[teegre]

I thought the same. He missed some throws and reads but I thought he was better than earlier in the season. That missed Brown read and the over throw on Bryant were brutal...that was 12-16 points they left on the table...

Indeed. Much better. Not as good as "at home", but he was on the positive side of the TD/INT ratio: 1/0. (I don't count that BS reversal as an INT, let alone BB's fault.)

AB's tirade was SMH, but he wasn't "wrong": the play was designed to confuse the secondary and get him open... and, it worked perfectly. Yet, for some reason, BB locked onto his second (third?) option. :huh:

Regardless, it was a win... on the road... in Baltimore, no less. :nod:

[BurghBoy412]

Indeed. Much better. Not as good as "at home", but he was on the positive side of the TD/INT ratio: 1/0. (I don't count that BS reversal as an INT, let alone BB's fault.)

AB's tirade was SMH, but he wasn't "wrong": the play was designed to confuse the secondary and get him open... and, it worked perfectly. Yet, for some reason, BB locked onto his second (third?) option. :huh:

Regardless, it was a win... on the road... in Baltimore, no less. :nod:Maybe that was just AB saying c'mon Ben play better. It's about time someone calls his piss poor play out. Hats off to AB. He didn't do anything wrong it's a passionate game and he showed some passion. He expects more from his QB. I like it!

[teegre]

Maybe that was just AB saying c'mon Ben play better. It's about time someone calls his piss poor play out. Hats off to AB. He didn't do anything wrong it's a passionate game and he showed some passion. He expects more from his QB. I like it!

I agree that AB had a right to ask: "WTF was that!?!"

I disagree that that he should have done his impersonation of OBJ.

[tube517]

I agree that AB had a right to ask: "WTF was that!?!"

I disagree that that he should have done his impersonation of OBJ.

He also impersonated Anquan Boldin when he yelled at Haley who was trying to calm him down. Never mind. Every WR seems to fight w/ Todd Haley. :chuckle:

[teegre]

Never mind. Every WR seems to fight w/ Todd Haley. :chuckle:

:lol:

[BurghBoy412]

I agree that AB had a right to ask: "WTF was that!?!"

I disagree that that he should have done his impersonation of OBJ.He could've handled it better no doubt. Unfortunately I've handled some things poorly myself. Glad there weren't cameras around to catch my foolish behavior. So who am I to judge.

Unfortunately this will be a topic of discussion all week. I wish we could go back to the days when the Steelers didn't get any National media hype.

[86WARD]

He could've handled it better no doubt. Unfortunately I've handled some things poorly myself. Glad there weren't cameras around to catch my foolish behavior. So who am I to judge.

Unfortunately this will be a topic of discussion all week. I wish we could go back to the days when the Steelers didn't get any National media hype.

Meh...that may not be the case as it seems to happen somewhere in the NFL on a weekly basis...

[Psycho Ward 86]

normally i would really resent AB's behavior for that missed TD opportunity, but at this point in time, im right behind him. someone needs to give Ben a wake up call, and AB is a fitting person to do it. AB has never been THAT angry at Ben during a game. Ben has been a let down for 2 and a quarter seasons of road games. This is the most talented defense we've had since the last time we've been to the superbowl. This is arguably the most talented offense the Steelers have EVER fielded in franchise history. We cant let this go to waste. Even the defense has had tons of great games on the road during the same span of time that Ben has been bad on the road. Same with our Leveon/Deangelo. Ben has had about 5-6 great games in about 24 road game opportunities since 2015 and thats nothing to worry about if were just happy to make it to the playoffs. Thats deeply concerning if you dont want to be the patriots whipping boy and have a real chance to win the superbowl though. This will probably hurt a lot of feelings but at this point in time we would still lose to the patriots and their leaky defense on the road. Come on Ben. You did it when you were just a kid, you can still do it now. Im still holding out faith in #7

[fansince'76]

He also impersonated Anquan Boldin when he yelled at Haley who was trying to calm him down. Never mind. Every WR seems to fight w/ Todd Haley. :chuckle:

https://media.giphy.com/media/Pef0tJAbbl6jC/200.gif

:chuckle:

[AtlantaDan]

normally i would really resent AB's behavior for that missed TD opportunity, but at this point in time, im right behind him. someone needs to give Ben a wake up call, and AB is a fitting person to do it. AB has never been THAT angry at Ben during a game.

FWIW Tony Dungy said in NBC pregame this evening the play was designed to go to AB - AB should not act out like that but if true it explains why AB went off.

With Bryant appearing to be back in form, Bell having a good game and Ju Ju moving Rogers out it looks like the offense is ready to roll once the QB is

[teegre]

FWIW Tony Dungy said in NBC pregame this evening the play was designed to go to AB


It 100% was.

The crossing route's sole purpose was to get AB open. And, it worked perfectly... except for, well, the throw.

[Psycho Ward 86]

FWIW Tony Dungy said in NBC pregame this evening the play was designed to go to AB - AB should not act out like that but if true it explains why AB went off.

With Bryant appearing to be back in form, Bell having a good game and Ju Ju moving Rogers out it looks like the offense is ready to roll once the QB is

Man, that is just terrible. Ben's cerebral game has really taken flight from 2013-2016. Its strange to see him play like he has regressed so dramatically so far this season. Even young Ben made better decisions than this

[BurghBoy412]

Man, that is just terrible. Ben's cerebral game has really taken flight from 2013-2016. Its strange to see him play like he has regressed so dramatically so far this season. Even young Ben made better decisions than thisI'm convinced the regression is due to laziness on Ben's part. Lack of preparation, lack of diligence in the film room, plus arrogance. I don't know if those things are true but it makes me wonder.

[teegre]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkadY5Fa4ik

Ignore the tantrum.


Beautifully designed play.


Perfectly executed... except for, you know, the throw.

[BurghBoy412]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkadY5Fa4ik

Ignore the tantrum.


Beautifully designed play.


Perfectly executed... except for, you know, the throw.



I don't think AB's been that wide open ever. Ben is slipping. They won the game but it wasn't because of #7. If this team gets put in a position where Ben needs to win a game. They're in trouble.

[Craic]

I'm convinced the regression is due to laziness on Ben's part. Lack of preparation, lack of diligence in the film room, plus arrogance. I don't know if those things are true but it makes me wonder.

:doh: Are we really regressing to the "Ben doesn't spend enough time preparing" argument again?

[fansince'76]

:doh: Are we really regressing to the "Ben doesn't spend enough time preparing" argument again?

And he rides motorcycles without a helmet too! :chuckle:

[Psycho Ward 86]

:doh: Are we really regressing to the "Ben doesn't spend enough time preparing" argument again?

this is different because Ben has already shown a propensity for a long time for being great. His physical skills are all clearly still there. His cerebral has become very advanced in the past 3-4 seasons. Through 4 games he's been locking onto receivers like a rookie, not going through his progressions, and missing easy throws. What else would explain Ben's play so far?

[BurghBoy412]

this is different because Ben has already shown a propensity for a long time for being great. His physical skills are all clearly still there. His cerebral has become very advanced in the past 3-4 seasons. Through 4 games he's been locking onto receivers like a rookie, not going through his progressions, and missing easy throws. What else would explain Ben's play so far?That's all I was saying. What else could it be? Oh, oh, I know it's Haley's fault right? I mean he makes the throws and all. I swear Ben is like Jesus to some fans. The guy can do no wrong and they'll defend it regardless of how ignorant it makes them appear.

[Psycho Ward 86]

That's all I was saying. What else could it be? Oh, oh, I know it's Haley's fault right? I mean he makes the throws and all. I swear Ben is like Jesus to some fans. The guy can do no wrong and they'll defend it regardless of how ignorant it makes them appear.

yeah i agree, as if critiquing a player means you arent grateful to have him. People are definitely going to try to change the narrative to defend Ben. i for one never really thought pre-2013 Ben was a lazy guy who didnt do film study or anything of that sort at all. I just felt that he just hadnt risen to that level yet. He has risen to that level for many years now. For him to make the bizarre decisions he is right now, theres only so many conclusions one can draw and yours make sense.

[BurghBoy412]

yeah i agree, as if critiquing a player means you arent grateful to have him. People are definitely going to try to change the narrative to defend Ben. i for one never really thought pre-2013 Ben was a lazy guy who didnt do film study or anything of that sort at all. I just felt that he just hadnt risen to that level yet. He has risen to that level for many years now. For him to make the bizarre decisions he is right now, theres only so many conclusions one can draw and yours make sense.Thank you. It's not like I'm saying " Ben sucks he should retire". I'm not saying all that lame crap. I'm simply holding Ben to his own standard. You and I both know how great he can be out there. Right now he's not that great. No, he's not terrible either but capable of so much more.

[DesertSteel]

Thank you. It's not like I'm saying " Ben sucks he should retire". I'm not saying all that lame crap. I'm simply holding Ben to his own standard. You and I both know how great he can be out there. Right now he's not that great. No, he's not terrible either but capable of so much more.
Ben played a good game today. Tough fought. It was a sweet victory.

- - - Updated - - -


I'm convinced the regression is due to laziness on Ben's part. Lack of preparation, lack of diligence in the film room, plus arrogance. I don't know if those things are true but it makes me wonder.
So you're convinced of something that you don't know is true??? How does that work?

[SteelMayhem72]

I’ll take that $5.50 bet!

;)Ok you are on...lol...but if 5.50$ is all you want of what i make a week then i wont argue if you win.. lol

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[Count Steeler]

So, now that preseason 2.0 is over, let's see what the Steelers are all about. The first 4 games have become preseason for the veterans it seems. It took Bell 4 games to get game ready (not bad considering no OTA, no TC). Seems the O Line is also coming around. Now let's see if the other skilled players can put it together for the "regular season". I'll take 3-1 coming out of the gates.

[BurghBoy412]

Ben played a good game today. Tough fought. It was a sweet victory.

- - - Updated - - -


So you're convinced of something that you don't know is true??? How does that work?So you're ok with how Ben is playing. That's cool. To each his own.

[EzraTank]

normally i would really resent AB's behavior for that missed TD opportunity, but at this point in time, im right behind him. someone needs to give Ben a wake up call, and AB is a fitting person to do it. AB has never been THAT angry at Ben during a game. Ben has been a let down for 2 and a quarter seasons of road games. This is the most talented defense we've had since the last time we've been to the superbowl. This is arguably the most talented offense the Steelers have EVER fielded in franchise history. We cant let this go to waste. Even the defense has had tons of great games on the road during the same span of time that Ben has been bad on the road. Same with our Leveon/Deangelo. Ben has had about 5-6 great games in about 24 road game opportunities since 2015 and thats nothing to worry about if were just happy to make it to the playoffs. Thats deeply concerning if you dont want to be the patriots whipping boy and have a real chance to win the superbowl though. This will probably hurt a lot of feelings but at this point in time we would still lose to the patriots and their leaky defense on the road. Come on Ben. You did it when you were just a kid, you can still do it now. Im still holding out faith in #7

Then do it in private or quietly on the sideline. You you imagine if Ben threw a perfect pass and AB dropped it, then Ben went to the sidelines and attacked a water cooler? AB doesn't know what Ben saw back there or what the pass rush was like. I'm more ticked at plays like the one where he DID see Bryant wide open an missed poorly. But still you deal with that shit quietly.

[AtlantaDan]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkadY5Fa4ik

Ignore the tantrum.


Beautifully designed play.


Perfectly executed... except for, you know, the throw.





Thanks for the video

Dan Fouts - "Roethlisberger looking the other way"

Play supposedly designed to go to AB as primary receiver and Ben never looked in his direction? - WTF

[steel striker]

Ben played good football yesterday sure he missed a sure TD 10 MB & just did not see AB which play plays would have been huge still he played well.

[Mojouw]

Maybe it has something to do with attempting 9 passes in preseason games. 9.

I really don't care how many drills you do in practice, standing in against a live opponent is a totally different story.

To be fair to Ben and the Steelers, Brady attempted 18 and Rodgers 13 - so it isn't like Pittsburgh is the only team that kept its older vet QB in a bubble. But, I think this is a serious part of why the offense is out of sync.

Also why I argue that very few useful conclusions can be drawn from September football.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Thanks for the video

Dan Fouts - "Roethlisberger looking the other way"

Play supposedly designed to go to AB as primary receiver and Ben never looked in his direction? - WTF

Yeah, IDK how Fouts gets that he was the primary receiver on a slow developing pick play where AB runs a shallow cross and then turns it out to the corner.

Ben was more accurate than last week. Showed comfort in the pocket and the O line did a good job of containing the rush. The offense goes thru #7, #26 and #84, so yesterday Bell took the load and Ben did well to compliment the attack. His numbers may not show it as well, but I thought Ben played well.

[DesertSteel]

Maybe it has something to do with attempting 9 passes in preseason games. 9.

I really don't care how many drills you do in practice, standing in against a live opponent is a totally different story.

To be fair to Ben and the Steelers, Brady attempted 18 and Rodgers 13 - so it isn't like Pittsburgh is the only team that kept its older vet QB in a bubble. But, I think this is a serious part of why the offense is out of sync.

Also why I argue that very few useful conclusions can be drawn from September football.

The great news is that we are 3-1 and Ben is healthy and likely to vastly improve over the next 3-5 weeks...

- - - Updated - - -


So you're ok with how Ben is playing. That's cool. To each his own.

He hadn't won in Baltimore since 2010, I believe. Am I happy with how he played yesterday? Let me count the ways... 26-9.

What exactly is a QB's job? To pad fantasy stats or win games?

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

What exactly is a QB's job? To pad fantasy stats or win games?

I agree! He made most of the right decisions and threw the ball on time nicely to Bryant a few times. The TD to JuJu was a solid job of being calm in the face of a rush and having to goto his 3rd or 4th read.

If Ben played this well last week, the team is 4-0. I thought he played poorly last week, Phil Simms confirmed those thoughts on the broadcast and I give full credit for bouncing back and getting an impressive road win against a division opponent.

IMO, complaining about the QB in a road win against the #1 rival likely means that you never had to watch Kent Graham, Cliff Stoudt or Mike Tomczak start at QB for the Steelers.

[BurghBoy412]

The great news is that we are 3-1 and Ben is healthy and likely to vastly improve over the next 3-5 weeks...

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He hadn't won in Baltimore since 2010, I believe. Am I happy with how he played yesterday? Let me count the ways... 26-9.

What exactly is a QB's job? To pad fantasy stats or win games?So 1 game and everything is all peachy? Hopefully he doesn't have another bad game. If he does I hope you keep your positive thinking to yourself. 1 game doesn't make me trust Ben. Besides Baltimore is one of the worst teams in the league.

[BurghBoy412]

1 decent game. I wish I was so easy to please.

If any of you had read my previous posts and had some level of comprehension then you would understand my criticism. Let's ignore all of that and just come to Ben's Defense. This is laughable.

[BurghBoy412]

Let's all Celebrate Ben's Mediocrity!

[Born2Steel]

Let's all Celebrate Ben's Mediocrity!

Not sure what you saw yesterday that can be explained as "Ben's mediocrity". We have a well established history, through MANY posts last week, about the difference in Ben's game at home vs away. So, if you're still on about that, that's one thing. But you sound like you're complaining about the win on the road over the Ravens. That's a game to celebrate actually. We got 'Good Ben' on the road, and in Baltimore. Good job Ben!

[BurghBoy412]

New England Patriots Standard = Demand Excellence

Pittsburgh Steelers Standard = Celebrate Mediocrity

[Mojouw]

New England Patriots Standard = Demand Excellence

Pittsburgh Steelers Standard = Celebrate Mediocrity

Would that be the excellence that left Devin Funchess running free all day? Are you honestly confusing/conflating fan reaction with whatever it is that goes on behind closed doors at the Steelers facility?

I bet Ben is going to work extra hard this week and Haley and Tomlin are going to rewrite the playbook because some dudes got grumpy on a message board.

[Born2Steel]

New England Patriots Standard = Demand Excellence

Pittsburgh Steelers Standard = Celebrate Mediocrity

WOW! That's got extra stupid all over it. There is NOTHING mediocre about winning in Baltimore.
(Not getting into the Patriots with you. That is just more stupid on stupid.)

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

The Steelers have the 3rd best winning record in the NFL in the past 10 years. http://www.foxsports.com/nfl/gallery/every-nfl-teams-10-year-record-ranked-32-1-010417

Keep celebrating that Pittsburgh Steelers Mediocrity. :rofl:

[BurghBoy412]

Would that be the excellence that left Devin Funchess running free all day? Are you honestly confusing/conflating fan reaction with whatever it is that goes on behind closed doors at the Steelers facility?

I bet Ben is going to work extra hard this week and Haley and Tomlin are going to rewrite the playbook because some dudes got grumpy on a message board.No, I was talking strictly about the fan base and the difference between the two. I cannot comment on what goes on in the locker room. It would be foolish to make that assumption. However as far as fan bases are concerned. Steeler fans are much more apt to celebrate the "meh" performance.

[BurghBoy412]

It really doesn't matter what I say at this point. The Defense of Ben is in full flight.

[BurghBoy412]

The Steelers have the 3rd best winning record in the NFL in the past 10 years. http://www.foxsports.com/nfl/gallery/every-nfl-teams-10-year-record-ranked-32-1-010417

Keep celebrating that Pittsburgh Steelers Mediocrity. :rofl:How many championships has that produced?

[DesertSteel]

New England Patriots Standard = Demand Excellence

Pittsburgh Steelers Standard = Celebrate Mediocrity
Let's just focus on this season. Who's 1-2 at home and lucky not to be 0-3? Steelers always play their best football down the stretch. To be 3-1 is a very good start. Especially since we are 2 games up in the division.

And did I mention that we have the NFL's #2 ranked defense.

But then again, let's focus on the negative.

[BurghBoy412]

Let's just focus on this season. Who's 1-2 at home and lucky not to be 0-3? Steelers always play their best football down the stretch. To be 3-1 is a very good start. Especially since we are 2 games up in the division.

And did I mention that we have the NFL's #2 ranked defense.

But then again, let's focus on the negative.The only negative I posted about was Ben. They were criticisms. I didn't say bench him, I didn't say he should retire. All I said was, he isn't playing his best football and he needs to improve. I also stated that I'm tired of giving him the benefit of the doubt. I don't think 1 decent game in Baltimore means he's fixed. It's cool it's cool. I'll be the one who's got "problems". I can handle being wrong. Or being viewed wrongly.

[Mojouw]

No, I was talking strictly about the fan base and the difference between the two. I cannot comment on what goes on in the locker room. It would be foolish to make that assumption. However as far as fan bases are concerned. Steeler fans are much more apt to celebrate the "meh" performance.

That's my exact point. Fan expectations have ZERO impact on the decisions, performance, and evaluation standards of an NFL franchise. They really don't give a crap what the fans think on a week to week basis.

Sure, if the franchise stinks for years and the fans stop coming to games, that'll get a reaction. But that is a reaction that is going to come no matter what, assuming your owner isn't a member of the Brown family!

Whatever barometer you are using to measure "fan expectations" is a bunch of made-up nonsense. We, as fans, can talk and piss and moan as much as we want, but it has next to no impact on the strategic decisions of our favorite teams.

Like, do you honestly think that somehow the Pats win actual NFL games because their coaches, players, and executives sit around worrying/thinking about "fan expectations"?

Dude, you post a lot of good and interesting stuff on here. I truly enjoy your contributions - but this one is out to lunch.

[DesertSteel]

The only negative I posted about was Ben. They were criticisms. I didn't say bench him, I didn't say he should retire. All I said was, he isn't playing his best football and he needs to improve. I also stated that I'm tired of giving him the benefit of the doubt. I don't think 1 decent game in Baltimore means he's fixed. It's cool it's cool. I'll be the one who's got "problems". I can handle being wrong. Or being viewed wrongly.
Clearly there is now a Road Ben and a Home Ben. He played well for Road Ben. Sometimes it is what it is. Everybody wishes they had Tom Brady but they don't. The reality is that there are only 10-12 good QBs in the whole world, and we have one of them, even if he's in the middle of that pack (upper middle, I contend).

[teegre]

IMO, complaining about the QB in a road win against the #1 rival likely means that you never had to watch Kent Graham, Cliff Stoudt or Mike Tomczak start at QB for the Steelers.

Mathematically speaking, Road Ben is Mike Tomczak.

Tomczak's Steelers career TD / INTS is 88 / 106.

Before yesterday, Road Ben was 14 / 17.

14 x 6.2 = 87 TDs
17 x 6.2 = 106 INTs

Crazy... right?

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

How many championships has that produced? 2 appearances and 1 championship. What is your point? In that timeframe, the Giants have won 2 championships. Maybe you want to become a Giants fan?

How do you judge your satisfaction as a Steeler fan? Is it championships, playoff appearances, total wins, week to week win?

I don't know of another NFL team with more Super Bowl wins, so I am trying to understand what your measure of "mediocrity" is. :huh:

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Mathematically speaking, Road Ben is Mike Tomczak.

Tomczak's Steelers career TD / INTS is 88 / 106.

Before yesterday, Road Ben was 14 / 17.



14 x 6.2 = 87 TDs
17 x 6.2 = 106 INTs

Crazy... right?
Ben has only thrown 14 tD's on the road in his career?? I am surprised by the stats.

[teegre]

Ben has only thrown 14 tD's on the road in his career?? I am surprised by the stats.

Sorry... no. My bad.

That is his TD / INT ratio for the past two seasons (2015, 2016).


Early on (specifically 2005) he was insanely good on the road.

[teegre]

He played well for Road Ben.

Bingo!!!!!

[BurghBoy412]

That's my exact point. Fan expectations have ZERO impact on the decisions, performance, and evaluation standards of an NFL franchise. They really don't give a crap what the fans think on a week to week basis.

Sure, if the franchise stinks for years and the fans stop coming to games, that'll get a reaction. But that is a reaction that is going to come no matter what, assuming your owner isn't a member of the Brown family!

Whatever barometer you are using to measure "fan expectations" is a bunch of made-up nonsense. We, as fans, can talk and piss and moan as much as we want, but it has next to no impact on the strategic decisions of our favorite teams.

Like, do you honestly think that somehow the Pats win actual NFL games because their coaches, players, and executives sit around worrying/thinking about "fan expectations"?

Dude, you post a lot of good and interesting stuff on here. I truly enjoy your contributions - but this one is out to lunch.I think something is getting lost in translation here. I understand completely that the fans have ZERO impact on the operation of a football franchise. It just feels like Steelers fans are much more willing to accept "mediocre" play as "good" play nowadays. Especially when it pertains to Ben. That's all.

[fansince'76]

It just feels like Steelers fans are much more willing to accept "mediocre" play as "good" play nowadays. Especially when it pertains to Ben. That's all.

Unless we get supremely lucky with his eventual replacement, when Ben's gone, it will become clear why. Especially if QB play like this (11-28, 154 yds, 1 TD, 3 INTs) becomes the standard bill of fare (again) post-Ben...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQ9TtEPbW8U

[polamalubeast]

The problem of Roethlisberger right now is his lack of accuracy in his deep ball.Ben has overthrow Bryant twice in the last 2 games, one on the first play of the game in Chicago, the other is in the 4th quarter yesterday ...

If Roethlisberger hit his 2 deep ball and he sees when Brown was wide open yesterday for a 60 yards touchdown, his numbers would be different.

[Mojouw]

I think something is getting lost in translation here. I understand completely that the fans have ZERO impact on the operation of a football franchise. It just feels like Steelers fans are much more willing to accept "mediocre" play as "good" play nowadays. Especially when it pertains to Ben. That's all.

Fair enough. But I guess we just define "mediocrity" differently - which is also totally valid.

From what I saw of the game, missed about 1/3 of it or so because being an adult sucks, I saw a QB who really missed two big throws - the one to AB and the one to Bryant. That is 14 points. Add back the missed field goal - what are we at now? 46 to 49 points or so? So for a matter of relative inches, we are talking about a 50 burger on supposedly one of the "premier" D units in the league. Add back in a few drops, and you have a QB who threw one made up INT and missed on about 4-5 passes. On the road. Against a pretty darn good defense.

I mean what more do you want?

[Psycho Ward 86]

2 appearances and 1 championship. What is your point? In that timeframe, the Giants have won 2 championships. Maybe you want to become a Giants fan?

How do you judge your satisfaction as a Steeler fan? Is it championships, playoff appearances, total wins, week to week win?

I don't know of another NFL team with more Super Bowl wins, so I am trying to understand what your measure of "mediocrity" is. :huh:

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Ben has only thrown 14 tD's on the road in his career?? I am surprised by the stats.

The point is that Ben isnt the reason were winning on the road the past couple of seasons. Those super bowl wins are a product of strong collective efforts made up of owners, coaches, and PLAYERS like Ben. Word around the grapevine is that quarterback is the most important position on a team so naturally some of us are concerned. Why thats such a huge deal is beyond me.

I tend to defend the crap out of Ben to all of my friends that are fans of other teams that seem to egg on him. But this Ben is untouchable rhetoric is really bizarre to me.

The amusing thing is that based on the past 2 seasons, the arguments on these types of threads are going to be pretty similiar: Ben is generally going to light it up at home and be mediocre on the road and theres going to be a back and forth between: Ben needs to get better on the road and Ben is awesome and everybody needs to be thankful.

[86WARD]

Despite Ben’s flaws in Baltimore, the game was a victory. This team may not be that lucky if they are playing in New England or Kansas City and he makes the same mistakes...

[polamalubeast]

Despite Ben’s flaws in Baltimore, the game was a victory. This team may not be that lucky if they are playing in New England or Kansas City and he makes the same mistakes...

Ben was not bad yesterday ... his interception was a bad call by the referee

If he don't misses a wide open Bryant and Brown, his numbers would have been very different.His 2 misses had nothing to have to the fact he was on the road ...

He was much better than you had predicted before the game too... You had predicted a disastrous game for Ben in Baltimore.

[Mojouw]

Even with the missed throws and drops, we are left with a QB who led his team to 32 points (Boz honking one had to surprise everyone) on the road against a good defense.

Better yet, aside from the phantom INT deployed by the refs, he wouldn't have turned the ball over - a common "road Ben" problem.

I think that criticizing Ben or anyone else on the Steelers is more than fair game and should be something that is not viewed as impossible.

But, I do think we need to agree on reasonable benchmarks and metrics for evaluation.

Personally I feel that putting about 30 points on the Ravens at home is more than mediocre. But I will readily agree that there were 20 or more points left on the field as well. Drives were not finished and that needs to happen, particularly after turn-overs.

[DesertSteel]

Forget Road Ben and Home Ben... I just want to see Playoff Ben come back! That dude used to be clutch is clutch gets in the playoffs until the last drive against GB in the Super Bowl.

[teegre]

Forget Road Ben and Home Ben... I just want to see Playoff Ben come back! That dude used to be clutch is clutch gets in the playoffs until the last drive against GB in the Super Bowl.

At the end of XLV, I truly thought that we were going to see a repeat of the last-second win against GB from the season before.

Alas...

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Sorry... no. My bad.

That is his TD / INT ratio for the past two seasons (2015, 2016).


Early on (specifically 2005) he was insanely good on the road.

OK thanks.

I was wondering if Tomczak CAREER stats compare to Ben CAREER road stats. :huh: Isnt really a fair comparison, but rather more selective choosing of statistics.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

I think something is getting lost in translation here. I understand completely that the fans have ZERO impact on the operation of a football franchise. It just feels like Steelers fans are much more willing to accept "mediocre" play as "good" play nowadays. Especially when it pertains to Ben. That's all.

I personally am objective with all players. I said last week that Ben needed to be better and should shoulder the blame for not beating the Bears. This week he played better and gave the team a chance to win. He wasn't anywhere near a 140 rating, but didn't need to be and made some timely throws.

What I never get is the unreal expectations of fans that players on THEIR team should put up amazing stats each week, yet the OPPOSING team players should be held to minimal stats. In the NFL, they are all professionals and are all good players and are all trying each week. Nobody is scheduling Bethune-Cookman for homecoming, so if a player has an average or mediocre game one week its not that unexpected IMO.

Ben hasn't played great yet all season, but he's done enough to win 3 games and if he did more last week, they are undefeated. He doesn't walk on water with me, but those that expect him to throw for 400 yards a game a 3TD's likely have been spoiled by good QB play and either never saw, or forgot how inconsistent the likes of Maddox, Stewart, Graham, Tomczak, Brister, Malone, Woodley, Stoudt were.

[Psycho Ward 86]

I personally am objective with all players. I said last week that Ben needed to be better and should shoulder the blame for not beating the Bears. This week he played better and gave the team a chance to win. He wasn't anywhere near a 140 rating, but didn't need to be and made some timely throws.

What I never get is the unreal expectations of fans that players on THEIR team should put up amazing stats each week, yet the OPPOSING team players should be held to minimal stats. In the NFL, they are all professionals and are all good players and are all trying each week. Nobody is scheduling Bethune-Cookman for homecoming, so if a player has an average or mediocre game one week its not that unexpected IMO.

Ben hasn't played great yet all season, but he's done enough to win 3 games and if he did more last week, they are undefeated. He doesn't walk on water with me, but those that expect him to throw for 400 yards a game a 3TD's likely have been spoiled by good QB play and either never saw, or forgot how inconsistent the likes of Maddox, Stewart, Graham, Tomczak, Brister, Malone, Woodley, Stoudt were.

hyperbole. this team isnt even putting up solid stats on offense collectively let alone "amazing." 18th in PPG, 21st in total yards, 16th in passing yards, 21st in rushing yards with probably the most talented offensive roster in franchise history? that would be disconcerting if you werent worried.

by all means, please tell me how does the mediocrity of Maddox, Stewart, Graham, and all of the other listed wannabe QB's directly pertain to Ben's play on the road the past 2 and a quarter seasons? Ben's been an elite QB for a while, but concurrently going back to 2015, there are about a dozen, maybe more quarterbacks i would choose over him on a road game. posted it literally at the beginning of the thread but ill reiterate it again: I think this is a mysterious phenomena because Ben used to be awesome on the road and he's a tough dude. rarely do you ever see an actual breakdown of "hmm, wonder whats going on with Ben on road games the past 2.25 years of games." That was the point of the thread. Unfortunately it keeps derailing into a "Ben cant be perfect, but hes better than mediocre so stop being mean" thread with counteractive circular discussions leading nowhere

[43Hitman]

hyperbole. this team isnt even putting up solid stats on offense collectively let alone "amazing." 18th in PPG, 21st in total yards, 16th in passing yards, 21st in rushing yards with probably the most talented offensive roster in franchise history? that would be disconcerting if you werent worried.

by all means, please tell me how does the mediocrity of Maddox, Stewart, Graham, and all of the other listed wannabe QB's directly pertain to Ben's play on the road the past 2 and a quarter seasons? Ben's been an elite QB for a while, but concurrently going back to 2015, there are about a dozen, maybe more quarterbacks i would choose over him on a road game. posted it literally at the beginning of the thread but ill reiterate it again: I think this is a mysterious phenomena because Ben used to be awesome on the road and he's a tough dude. rarely do you ever see an actual breakdown of "hmm, wonder whats going on with Ben on road games the past 2.25 years of games." That was the point of the thread. Unfortunately it keeps derailing into a "Ben cant be perfect, but hes better than mediocre so stop being mean" thread with counteractive circular discussions leading nowhere
I honestly think he tries to be to careful and therefore starts aiming his passes. And when that eventually leads to a pick he starts pressing, and viola another pick. Its a mental block that only him playing through will fix imo.

[Psycho Ward 86]

I honestly think he tries to be to careful and therefore starts aiming his passes. And when that eventually leads to a pick he starts pressing, and viola another pick. Its a mental block that only him playing through will fix imo.

Do you mean as a body of work from 2015-currently or just this season? Interesting thing about Ben ever since Haley has been here is that our offense seems really different from year to year. I remember around 2012-2013 we were playing a ton of small ball and had one of the best (maybe even the best?) 3rd down offenses in the league. 2014 showed a lot more balance. 2015 saw Ben probably throw as many deep balls as we've ever seen, but we also ran a ton in the red zone to complement it. 2016 i recall Ben had the most deep passes for TD's in the league or something similar to that which was pretty remarkable considering he was injured for a big chunk of the season and didnt have his #2 and #3 for pretty much the entire season.

if your observation pertains only to the 4 games thus far in the season, im not sure im seeing what you're seeing. Ben was ignoring wide open receivers underneath in game 1 and 2 a lot. Against the ravens he kind of did the opposite. Its not like Ben is turning the ball over at some kind of alarming rate either. He'll have 8 picks and 4 lost fumbles if we prorate his turnovers to a 16 game season. Thats actually pretty damn good, ill sign up for that

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

hyperbole. this team isnt even putting up solid stats on offense collectively let alone "amazing." 18th in PPG, 21st in total yards, 16th in passing yards, 21st in rushing yards with probably the most talented offensive roster in franchise history? that would be disconcerting if you werent worried.

by all means, please tell me how does the mediocrity of Maddox, Stewart, Graham, and all of the other listed wannabe QB's directly pertain to Ben's play on the road the past 2 and a quarter seasons? Ben's been an elite QB for a while, but concurrently going back to 2015, there are about a dozen, maybe more quarterbacks i would choose over him on a road game. posted it literally at the beginning of the thread but ill reiterate it again: I think this is a mysterious phenomena because Ben used to be awesome on the road and he's a tough dude. rarely do you ever see an actual breakdown of "hmm, wonder whats going on with Ben on road games the past 2.25 years of games." That was the point of the thread. Unfortunately it keeps derailing into a "Ben cant be perfect, but hes better than mediocre so stop being mean" thread with counteractive circular discussions leading nowhere

What were the winning percentages of the teams that the Steeler played on the road the past 2 seasons, compared to the teams they played at home in that timeframe? Did they host poorer performing teams at home, while playing more challenging opponents on the road in places like Seattle, KC, Denver, New England, etc?

Are we really questioning that playing on the road, in a visiting stadium with crowd noise and other factors is not more difficult than playing at home?

Are we also forgetting that the Ben of the past 2 years is a guy closer to retirement with diminishing skills than that of 5-10 years ago? If you want to create a label of "road Ben" for the sake of debate, then have fun. I guess I just choose to accept the fact that Ben, along with the other guys in his draft class like Philip Rivers and Eli Manning are nearing the end of their careers as skills decline and the fact is that its always tougher to play on the road than at home anyways.

[DesertSteel]

Are you guys who are critiquing Ben watching the coaches' film? Or are you basing this off of TV and replays? I try and watch a few coaches films through the year on Rewind but so far have only caught parts of one.

[43Hitman]

Are you guys who are critiquing Ben watching the coaches' film? Or are you basing this off of TV and replays? I try and watch a few coaches films through the year on Rewind but so far have only caught parts of one.
I try to, however this years NFL Pass is a damn mess. It doesn't work half the time.

[BurghBoy412]

Sometimes I wonder if all the hits he took earlier in his career are starting to catch up with him. Physically he looks alright. I just wonder if maybe he's a little cloudy at his advanced state. It's funny to say he's at an advanced state when where the same age.:huh: I mean Ben is Brett Favre tough or maybe Brett Favre was Ben tough IDK. Regardless Ben has taken a lot of nasty hits in his career some that would've ended other guys. Now I'm remembering why he's been my favorite player since he put on a Steeler Jersey.

[polamalubeast]

Sometimes I wonder if all the hits he took earlier in his career are starting to catch up with him. Physically he looks alright. I just wonder if maybe he's a little cloudy at his advanced state. It's funny to say he's at an advanced state when where the same age.:huh: I mean Ben is Brett Favre tough or maybe Brett Favre was Ben tough IDK. Regardless Ben has taken a lot of nasty hits in his career some that would've ended other guys. Now I'm remembering why he's been my favorite player since he put on a Steeler Jersey.

At one point, Roethlisberger was almost a lock to be the most sacked QB in NFL history.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/pass_sacked_career.htm

Fortunately, this is not longer the case.

[Psycho Ward 86]

What were the winning percentages of the teams that the Steeler played on the road the past 2 seasons, compared to the teams they played at home in that timeframe? Did they host poorer performing teams at home, while playing more challenging opponents on the road in places like Seattle, KC, Denver, New England, etc?

Are we really questioning that playing on the road, in a visiting stadium with crowd noise and other factors is not more difficult than playing at home?

Are we also forgetting that the Ben of the past 2 years is a guy closer to retirement with diminishing skills than that of 5-10 years ago? If you want to create a label of "road Ben" for the sake of debate, then have fun. I guess I just choose to accept the fact that Ben, along with the other guys in his draft class like Philip Rivers and Eli Manning are nearing the end of their careers as skills decline and the fact is that its always tougher to play on the road than at home anyways.

these are excellent questions now were getting somewhere. im going to dig into those winning percentages later when i have time.

And of course its harder to play away from home. but why are you posing that question when my 1st post to start this thread acknowledges that? since you may have missed it, i noted that while its harder to play away games, Ben had shown a propensity for playing well on the road, even when he was very young. For him to all of a sudden lose his mojo on the road (and with consistency to boot) is very strange.

What makes you say Ben has diminishing skills? Ben shouldnt be any dumber if recent seasons are any indication. He has been playing the smartest football of his life for the past couple seasons. Even last season he acquitted himself really considering he didnt have his #2 and #3 receiver (with practice squad receivers like Hamilton and Ayers as replacements). Ben can still throw a monster deep ball, but theyre just significantly off target so far. Something doesnt seem to add up here. Usually the problem is much more obvious but im scratching my head so far and it looks like im not alone

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At one point, Roethlisberger was almost a lock to be the most sacked QB in NFL history.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/pass_sacked_career.htm

Fortunately, this is not longer the case.

He still seems like a lock to be #3

[86WARD]

Ben was not bad yesterday ... his interception was a bad call by the referee

If he don't misses a wide open Bryant and Brown, his numbers would have been very different.His 2 misses had nothing to have to the fact he was on the road ...

He was much better than you had predicted before the game too... You had predicted a disastrous game for Ben in Baltimore.

If the game were played tomorrow, I’d predict the same thing...I don’t put that all on Ben though...the O-Line hasn’t been great. However, I never said Ben was bad. He wasn’t great though. He missed a wide open Bryant, he missed a wide open Brown...missed the read totally and the play was supposed to go to Brown, he had two errant throws that could’ve easily been interceptions...but they weren’t. He wasn’t bad, but he wasn’t Ben Roethlisberger either.

I’ve also said multiple times that he was better yesterday than he’s been the first three weeks. The team is improving but they are far from the “high powered offense” that they are supposed to be.

[Psycho Ward 86]

Are you guys who are critiquing Ben watching the coaches' film? Or are you basing this off of TV and replays? I try and watch a few coaches films through the year on Rewind but so far have only caught parts of one.

I follow Kozora diligently and he uses coaches film. He seems to agree that Ben is missing a lot of throws

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

What makes you say Ben has diminishing skills?

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He still seems like a lock to be #3

Feet don't move as well as they used to, so don't scramble as much to extend the play. The knees, shoulders, etc from playing 10 years of NFL football and being sacked so many times can tend to add up. The desire to spend quality time with your kids is more prevalent than sacrificing your body to win the following week. Those are all diminishing skills and mindset.

Not many QB's went out on the top of their game. Generally a slide in production before they hang it up and this could be it for Ben. Honestly, I think his #2 WR on the depth chart hasn't practiced much with Ben in the past 2 years and his best receiving RB is rounding into form, but I think the decline of Ben is starting and he only has 1 or 2 more seasons in him at the most.

The 25 year old Ben that wanted to win at all costs is now 35 year old Ben who has 2 rings and has already started to think of life after football.

[teegre]

I follow Kozora diligently and he uses coaches film. He seems to agree that Ben is missing a lot of throws

Yep.

I follow quite a few "tape watchers" (e.g. The Mick Nartin). In a nutshell, their simplified explanation is that BB simply isn't going through his progressions.

[Psycho Ward 86]

Yep.

I follow quite a few "tape watchers" (e.g. The Mick Nartin). In a nutshell, their simplified explanation is that BB simply isn't going through his progressions.

Ben is confirming as much to. Heres his overly complicated explanation about him not going through his reads fast enough on the play that Brown was wide open: http://www.steelersdepot.com/2017/10/roethlisberger-explains-led-not-throwing-wide-open-brown/

Serious question. Who here actually feels CONFIDENT about Ben when he plays on the road the past 2 seasons through the rest of the season and if so, why?

[polamalubeast]

Ben is confirming as much to. Heres his overly complicated explanation about him not going through his reads fast enough on the play that Brown was wide open: http://www.steelersdepot.com/2017/10/roethlisberger-explains-led-not-throwing-wide-open-brown/

Serious question. Who here actually feels CONFIDENT about Ben when he plays on the road the past 2 seasons through the rest of the season and if so, why?

I do not have much confidence that Roethlisberger will play at an elite level on the road, but I have confident that the steelers can beat every AFC teams on the road except the Patriots.

The Steelers are not a one man team ....They can win with their running game and their defense and that Ben be just good enough.

[Psycho Ward 86]

I do not have much confidence that Roethlisberger will play at an elite level on the road, but I have confident that the steelers can beat every AFC teams on the road except the Patriots.

The Steelers are not a one man team ....They can win with their running game and their defense and that Ben be just good enough.

we absolutely can beat any team on the road besides the patriots. but we definitely wont. Tomlin has the worst record against teams under .300 among all active coaches. Take a look at where were playing on the vast majority of them. I wouldnt be surprised to see Ben have his best game by far this Sunday followed by his absolute worst the following week at Arrowhead.

[polamalubeast]

we absolutely can beat any team on the road besides the patriots. but we definitely wont. Tomlin has the worst record against teams under .300 among all active coaches. Take a look at where were playing on the vast majority of them. I wouldnt be surprised to see Ben have his best game by far this Sunday followed by his absolute worst the following week at Arrowhead.

We will not play against a bad team on the road in the playoffs.

Roethlisberger could have an average game against the chiefs and be able to beat them in their house.

It's just to say that the steelers are not a one man team and we need to stop worrying about Roethlisberger on the road when the steelers can beat the majority of the best AFC teams on the road.Roethlisberger is not awful on the road....He is just average right now.

[DesertSteel]

Ben is confirming as much to. Heres his overly complicated explanation about him not going through his reads fast enough on the play that Brown was wide open: http://www.steelersdepot.com/2017/10/roethlisberger-explains-led-not-throwing-wide-open-brown/

Serious question. Who here actually feels CONFIDENT about Ben when he plays on the road the past 2 seasons through the rest of the season and if so, why?
I will be fairly confident in Ben on the road this year. The main reason in that the D has improved and he's seeing the results. Sunday against the Ravens was the best example. I thought it was a solid game by Ben. He didn't try to do too much and didn't turn the ball over. I'm good with that road identity. I think he felt in '15 and '16 that he had to be the hero for them to win and he was pressed into mistakes. I'm happy with more of what I saw Sunday on the road. I think it will be good enough for 6-2 on the road.

[Psycho Ward 86]

Besides the obvious, Ben showing no ill signs ever since the Jaguars game.

Ben's road performance to close out the season has also been the best it has in years!

61.7% completion, 2035 yards, 7.8 YPA, 12:6 TD/INT, 91.7 QB Rating, and most importantly a 7-1 record

Very encouraging.

[polamalubeast]

Roethlisberger is now 61-39 in his career on the road.

Ben has not always been good on the road, but HOF QB like John Elway and Brett Favre ended their career with a losing road record!

http://www.footballdb.com/stats/qb-records.html?type=reg&alltime=1

[DesertSteel]

Roethlisberger is now 61-39 in his career on the road.

Ben has not always been good on the road, but HOF QB like John Elway and Brett Favre ended their career with a losing road record!

http://www.footballdb.com/stats/qb-records.html?type=reg&alltime=1
Great stat!