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Shoes
09-03-2017, 09:24 AM
Steelers scouts were on-hand to watch Wyoming QB Josh AllenSaturday according to this report ESPN’s Michele Steele.


http://www.steelersdepot.com/2017/09/steelers-send-scouts-watch-top-qb-prospect/

polamalubeast
09-03-2017, 09:26 AM
904322377840021506

Edman
09-03-2017, 09:28 AM
904322377840021506

Sounds like a Blake Bortles.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-03-2017, 09:37 AM
Why would the Steelers draft a QB in this years draft? They have already drafted Josh Dobbs. :thumbsup:

Born2Steel
09-03-2017, 09:42 AM
904322377840021506

We know it's about the long road, not the short. But that's a terrible start.

Edman
09-03-2017, 09:46 AM
Why would the Steelers draft a QB in this years draft? They have already drafted Josh Dobbs. :thumbsup:

Lol No. Nobody said Dobbs is the long term future or the answer.

The Steelers should go to any and all lengths to look for a QB and not rest on their laurels and think they have one right now after Ben.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-03-2017, 09:54 AM
Lol No. Nobody said Dobbs is the long term future or the answer.

The Steelers should go to any and all lengths to look for a QB and not rest on their laurels and think they have one right now after Ben.

But wont they be drafting too low at #32 to get a good QB in the draft?

Edman
09-03-2017, 10:00 AM
And in case anyone wonders what a Power 5 opponent is. It's a team from the big conferences (ACC, SEC, Big 10, Big 12, and Pac-12)

The Cowboys lost 52-17 to Nebraska last year, and just got smashed by Iowa yesterday 24-3.

Josh Allen vs Nebraska 2016: 16-32, 189 YDS, 1 TD, 5 INT

Josh Allen vs Iowa 2017 Saturday: 23-40, 174 YDS, 2 INT

- - - Updated - - -


But wont they be drafting too low at #32 to get a good QB in the draft?

Yes, but like the other topic, you're basing this all on assumptions.

teegre
09-03-2017, 10:05 AM
Sounds like a Blake Bortles.

It also sounds like BB's "4 INT game" against Iowa.

Born2Steel
09-03-2017, 10:14 AM
And in case anyone wonders what a Power 5 opponent is. It's a team from the big conferences (ACC, SEC, Big 10, Big 12, and Pac-12)

The Cowboys lost 52-17 to Nebraska last year, and just got smashed by Iowa yesterday 24-3.

Josh Allen vs Nebraska 2016: 16-32, 189 YDS, 1 TD, 5 INT

Josh Allen vs Iowa 2017 Saturday: 23-40, 174 YDS, 2 INT

- - - Updated - - -



Yes, but like the other topic, you're basing this all on assumptions.

What stands out the most to me is, that team threw the ball 40 times and only netted 174 yards. That's less than 5 yards per pass attempt. AND only 7 yards per completion.

st33lersguy
09-03-2017, 10:42 AM
All indication so far is that Allen (if he declares) will be a top 10 pick. I doubt he's available

st33lersguy
09-03-2017, 10:50 AM
It also sounds like BB's "4 INT game" against Iowa.

It should be noted though that he had 343 yards and 3 TDs against 1 INT against Iowa the year before in a close loss, a year Iowa went to the Orange Bowl

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/boxscores/2002-09-07-miami-oh.html

teegre
09-03-2017, 11:21 AM
The scouts should watch all of these QBs:

--Sam Darnold
--Josh Allen
--Mason Rudolph
--Luke Falk
--Josh Rosen
--Baker Mayfield
--Jake Browning
--Kyle Allen

Dwinsgames
09-03-2017, 11:26 AM
The scouts should watch all of these QBs:

--Sam Darnold
--Josh Allen
--Mason Rudolph
--Luke Falk
--Josh Rosen
--Baker Mayfield
--Jake Browning
--Kyle Allen


Darnold looked horrible

BurghBoy412
09-03-2017, 11:37 AM
Darnold looked horribleIt seems like all the teams at the bottom are already trying to get in position to draft him. I'll laugh my ass off when he decides to stay another year.

As far as Allen goes I think he's the classic boom or bust player.

My early favorite for a Steelers pick is Baker Mayfield. He's a bit on the small side but plays with great energy and is a very accurate passer. Accuracy is a must at the next level.

teegre
09-03-2017, 11:46 AM
Darnold looked horrible

My guys are Josh Rosen and Kyle Allen.

Josh Rosen
Rosen will (supposedly) drop, because he's an a$$hole. He taunts the opposing fans. Meh. He does not listen to the coaches' advice, because he thinks he's able to thread the needle. Meh (to a degree). He made a comment about academics and football. (Meh!!!). I'd say he's over-confident, but so was Elway, Favre, & pretty much every other great QB.

Kyle Allen
Three years ago, I stated that he'd be drafted by the Steelers in 2018. So, partially, I'm being stubborn. LOL Allen was the next in line for the "Texas A&M's QB factory". He didn't mesh well with their coaches/system. He transferred to Houston... and, if he has a good year, he could skyrocket up draft boards.

BurghBoy412
09-03-2017, 12:01 PM
Another guy I like is Wilton Speight from Michigan. He's a 6'5" 243lb monster. Has a big arm and is fairly accurate. He also played lacrosse so I assume he's pretty athletic for his size. He has all the physical attributes. However I read his decision making, pocket presence, and mechanics need work.

st33lersguy
09-03-2017, 12:09 PM
Another guy I like is Wilton Speight from Michigan. He's a 6'5" 243lb monster. Has a big arm and is fairly accurate. He also played lacrosse so I assume he's pretty athletic for his size. He has all the physical attributes. However I read his decision making, pocket presence, and mechanics need work.

Speight is horrible. He single-handedly let the Buckeyes hang around the Ohio State Michigan game with 2 INTs deep in Michigan territory (one returned for a TD) last year when Ohio State was doing little otherwise and Ohio State came back to win. Yesterday he also single handedly allowed Florida to hang around into the 4th quarter with back to back INTs returned for TDs (Michigan still won fairly comfortably because Florida doesn't have a competent offense). I want no part of Speight

BurghBoy412
09-03-2017, 12:14 PM
Speight is horrible. He single-handedly let the Buckeyes hang around the Ohio State Michigan game with 2 INTs deep in Michigan territory (one returned for a TD) last year when Ohio State was doing little otherwise and Ohio State came back to win. Yesterday he also single handedly allowed Florida to hang around into the 4th quarter with back to back INTs returned for TDs (Michigan still won fairly comfortably because Florida doesn't have a competent offense). I want no part of SpeightWell ok then. I'm going to see how/ if he progresses this year.

Speight is low on my list of players. I'd prefer Jackson, Mayfield, Schor.

st33lersguy
09-03-2017, 12:19 PM
Speight's Orange Bowl last year wasn't good either, less than 60% completion, barely over 4 yards per attempt and 1 TD against 1 INT

BurghBoy412
09-03-2017, 12:25 PM
Speight's Orange Bowl last year wasn't good either, less than 60% completion, barely over 4 yards per attempt and 1 TD against 1 INTWell we'll see if he turns it around.

Steeldude
09-03-2017, 12:28 PM
Lol No. Nobody said Dobbs is the long term future or the answer.

The Steelers should go to any and all lengths to look for a QB and not rest on their laurels and think they have one right now after Ben.

I hope he isn't the short term answer either.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-03-2017, 01:54 PM
And in case anyone wonders what a Power 5 opponent is. It's a team from the big conferences (ACC, SEC, Big 10, Big 12, and Pac-12)

The Cowboys lost 52-17 to Nebraska last year, and just got smashed by Iowa yesterday 24-3.

Josh Allen vs Nebraska 2016: 16-32, 189 YDS, 1 TD, 5 INT

Josh Allen vs Iowa 2017 Saturday: 23-40, 174 YDS, 2 INT

- - - Updated - - -



Yes, but like the other topic, you're basing this all on assumptions.

No, I am basing it on other people's misconceptions. Raiders found their franchise QB at #36, Seahawks drafted theirs at #75 and the Cowboys their starter at #135... so I don't see why the Steelers cant find their future QB at #32 this year.

- - - Updated - - -


Speight is horrible. He single-handedly let the Buckeyes hang around the Ohio State Michigan game with 2 INTs deep in Michigan territory (one returned for a TD) last year when Ohio State was doing little otherwise and Ohio State came back to win. Yesterday he also single handedly allowed Florida to hang around into the 4th quarter with back to back INTs returned for TDs (Michigan still won fairly comfortably because Florida doesn't have a competent offense). I want no part of Speight

I agree and I am a Michigan fan. Speight is not an NFL QB IMO.

I haven't broken down Baker Mayfield's game, but a lot of draft analysts like Matt Miller of Bleacher Report are not impressed by his game. Tony Pauline is a guy that I have respected his draft opinions for years and he only has Mayfield as a 5th round pick.

Mojouw
09-03-2017, 02:47 PM
No, I am basing it on other people's misconceptions. Raiders found their franchise QB at #36, Seahawks drafted theirs at #75 and the Cowboys their starter at #135... so I don't see why the Steelers cant find their future QB at #32 this year.

It can be done, but all 3 of those guys were a team being willing to look past the "conventional wisdom" and draft a guy. Carr had the stigma of his brother and being a gimmicky offense guy. Prescott had the concern of a DUI and just a system guy. Wilson was and is short.

Will Colbert and the other Steelers decision makers be able to look past the obvious to uncover an overlooked QB? Recent quotes by Colbert and the drafting of Dobbs suggest they will.

The question is "who is that guy?" I have no idea.

polamalubeast
09-03-2017, 02:57 PM
The worst thing the steelers could do is to reach on a QB, like the Vikings (Ponder), Jaguars (Gabbert) and the Titans (Locker) had done in 2011.

The Titans and Jaguars had the opportunity to select J.J Watt but they reached on a QB!

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-03-2017, 03:07 PM
It can be done, but all 3 of those guys were a team being willing to look past the "conventional wisdom" and draft a guy. Carr had the stigma of his brother and being a gimmicky offense guy. Prescott had the concern of a DUI and just a system guy. Wilson was and is short.

Will Colbert and the other Steelers decision makers be able to look past the obvious to uncover an overlooked QB? Recent quotes by Colbert and the drafting of Dobbs suggest they will.

The question is "who is that guy?" I have no idea.

You are correct that they all had some things that didn't say "this guy is a lock", but all players do. Some thought Carr was the best QB in the draft, while both Wilson and Prescott impressed scouts with great performances in their respective Senior Bowl performances.

As for "who is that guy?" ...we don't have to know, but the Steelers have been scouting all of these guys for a couple years now and if that guy is on the board at their pick, they will select him. I am saying that this year is likely the best in some time as there are so many potential NFL QB prospects that should be in the 2018 draft.

BurghBoy412
09-03-2017, 03:07 PM
All this QB talk makes me realize how much I'm not looking forward to Ben retiring. Finding a Franchise QB can be a long hard road. Ugh!

Mojouw
09-03-2017, 04:01 PM
I posted this in another thread - so apologies for spamming it. https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2017/8/31/16231484/quarterback-problem-evaluation-spread-dak-prescott-derek-carr

But I think it is a "must read" when having a conversation about drafting a starting QB in 2018.

The whole piece is worth reading, but here is Colbert's bit:

"You’re going to throw out about half his completions,” said Kevin Colbert, the Pittsburgh Steelers’ general manager. Colbert has spent the past few years studying spread quarterbacks and figuring out how to best evaluate them. This is an era of volume passing at every level of football, so there are more throws than ever to watch. But that’s not necessarily a good thing. The key, he said, is to eliminate all the easy stuff in the evaluation.
“If a kid is completing 70 percent of his throws and 90 percent of those are within 5 yards, is it really 70 percent?” Colbert said. He added that the Steelers have plenty of these gimme routes in their offense, but “any guy with a certain size or arm strength should be able to complete those. If I can’t throw the ball from here to the slot receiver, I shouldn’t even be looked at. But am I leading that receiver into the proper area of the field? Am I throwing him open?”
This year, Colbert said, the team made a concerted effort to divorce the player from the scheme and focus on three areas: physical skill, responsibility in the offense, and play in important matchups. “We wanted to evaluate physical talent: We can all do that. Guesstimate intellect: how much they were being asked to do. And big games—did he play in big games and did he win more than he lost?”
After using this smarts-and-big-game method, Colbert used a fourth-round pick on Tennessee’s Josh Dobbs, who can recite (http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/gene-collier/2017/08/07/Steelers-Joshua-Josh-Dobbs-quarterback-Collier-aerospace-alopecia/stories/201708060107) the first 48 digits of pi. (Although Dobbs is quick to dismiss much of a link between academic intelligence and football IQ. “They don’t entirely go together,” he said.)
The SEC, Dobbs added, was among the top conferences for deep balls and “explosive plays in the passing game, which correlates to the NFL.” The biggest transition for the former Volunteer was learning how to huddle. “In a game situation,” he said, “the mouthpiece can slow you down.” "

BurghBoy412
09-03-2017, 04:26 PM
No, I am basing it on other people's misconceptions. Raiders found their franchise QB at #36, Seahawks drafted theirs at #75 and the Cowboys their starter at #135... so I don't see why the Steelers cant find their future QB at #32 this year.

- - - Updated - - -



I agree and I am a Michigan fan. Speight is not an NFL QB IMO.

I haven't broken down Baker Mayfield's game, but a lot of draft analysts like Matt Miller of Bleacher Report are not impressed by his game. Tony Pauline is a guy that I have respected his draft opinions for years and he only has Mayfield as a 5th round pick.I prefer to break down players with my own eyes. I find it useless to use the opinion of another as my basis of analysis.

DesertSteel
09-03-2017, 04:26 PM
Why would the Steelers draft a QB in this years draft? They have already drafted Josh Dobbs. :thumbsup:
Josh Allen doesn't sound much better than Josh Dobbs.

DesertSteel
09-03-2017, 04:33 PM
All this QB talk makes me realize how much I'm not looking forward to Ben retiring. Finding a Franchise QB can be a long hard road. Ugh!
I like the volume approach. Draft a QB every year in the mid to late rounds and increase the odds of getting lucky. Works better than drafting then releasing long snappers.

BurghBoy412
09-03-2017, 04:36 PM
I like the volume approach. Draft a QB every year in the mid to late rounds and increase the odds of getting lucky. Works better than drafting then releasing long snappers.I've been wanting them to approach the secondary this way for years. In a pass happy league there shouldn't be a year when you're not drafting a DB. As far as QB I would have no problem with the same approach.

Cue the attacks on how stupid an idea this is... Action

Mojouw
09-03-2017, 04:54 PM
I've been wanting them to approach the secondary this way for years. In a pass happy league there shouldn't be a year when you're not drafting a DB. As far as QB I would have no problem with the same approach.

Cue the attacks on how stupid an idea this is... Action

They have been. http://pfref.com/tiny/TEKOR

They've taken between 1-3 DBs basically every draft since 2000.

QB every third year or so.

BurghBoy412
09-03-2017, 04:56 PM
They have been. http://pfref.com/tiny/TEKOR

They've taken between 1-3 DBs basically every draft since 2000.

QB every third year or so.And yet they need to utilize free agency to fill holes in the secondary? What the?

Mojouw
09-03-2017, 05:50 PM
And yet they need to utilize free agency to fill holes in the secondary? What the?

Hey, I never said they were any good at it...:)

polamalubeast
09-03-2017, 07:45 PM
904505227029733376

BurghBoy412
09-03-2017, 10:17 PM
Pretty sure Josh Rosen got himself a top 5 selection tonight!

Edman
09-04-2017, 05:29 AM
There is something we're all missing though...

The team around the QB. Do you seriously think 2004 Ben and Dak Prescott last year would've been as successful as they have been if the team around them were complete garbage? Ben had a great Offensive Line. Hines and Plax at WR. The Bus and Staley at RB, and a solid Defense filled with stars like Porter, Hampton, and of course Troy in the secondary.

Dak had Zeke, one of the best O-Lines in the league, Dez Bryant at WR, Witten at TE, and the Cowboys D was no seive either.

How good would Ben and Dak had been if they were drafted by a shitty team devoid of talent like the Jets or the Browns? Not very well I assume. With Ben, the 2013 Steelers started 0-4 and finished 8-8 after another 8-8 finish the year prior. Was it Ben's fault? The 2012-13 Steelers severely regressed in talent and were not that good. It doesn't matter how good your QB is, if the team around him is shit, he's not doing anything.

Could it just be that The Steelers had a hard time finding success after Bradshaw left, not because of the QB position, but because the teams they had were simply not that good to win a Super Bowl?

We know the 80's teams weren't that good, but could it be that we overrate the 90's teams? The 90's Steelers won 12 games only once in what was a very mediocre AFC, and if they were that good, they wouldn't have fallen flat on their face against the Chargers in 1994, no matter who was at QB.

polamalubeast
09-04-2017, 07:19 AM
The steelers were great between 1992 to 1997, although the steelers had an average QB in 4 of its years and a mediocre in 1996 and 1997.64-32 and the year that were at the super bowl in 1995, the steelers had dominated the entire second half but 2 killer interception killed the steelers.

It is true that a young QB needs to be in a very good situation and the 1990's Steelers, it would have been a very good situation for a young QB.

Many think the QB was less important in the 1990s, maybe it is true, but between 1992 to 1999, every super bowl winner had a HOF QB.

Edman
09-04-2017, 07:46 AM
Pretty sure Josh Rosen got himself a top 5 selection tonight!

Rosen was almost picked twice. One badly thrown ball went right through a defenders hands and into the receiver.

But I guess its better to be lucky than good.

Dwinsgames
09-04-2017, 09:29 AM
what those scouts came away with from their journeys ............ HEARTBURN

Drazo85
09-04-2017, 09:39 AM
When you are in a search for a franchise QB as a organisation you must have:
1. Stabillity
2. Great evaluators (GM, coaches, scouts, etc.)
3. Dumb luck.

BurghBoy412
09-04-2017, 09:46 AM
Almost intercepted doesn't count. Ben was "almost" intercepted in the Superbowl vs Arizona.

Edman
09-04-2017, 04:08 PM
Josh Allen has an injury in his non-throwing shoulder.

So for anyone who is high on the guy, his draft status may drop.

Bluecoat96
09-09-2017, 10:15 PM
It seems like all the teams at the bottom are already trying to get in position to draft him. I'll laugh my ass off when he decides to stay another year.

As far as Allen goes I think he's the classic boom or bust player.

My early favorite for a Steelers pick is Baker Mayfield. He's a bit on the small side but plays with great energy and is a very accurate passer. Accuracy is a must at the next level.Mayfield has lit up the Buckeyes tonight. Seems like a hell of a leader as well.

Sent from my XT1710-02 using Tapatalk

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-10-2017, 10:03 AM
Mayfield has lit up the Buckeyes tonight. Seems like a hell of a leader as well.

Sent from my XT1710-02 using Tapatalk

Mayfield isn't a traditional NFL QB prospect, but more in the category of an elusive smaller QB that evades his rushers to make plays. Kind of like a Johnny Manziel, without some of the other issues. That being said, I think what he has put on film like this video, shows he cant evade the rush at the next level.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ezjlgpg-9iw

st33lersguy
09-10-2017, 10:24 AM
Mayfield isn't a traditional NFL QB prospect, but more in the category of an elusive smaller QB that evades his rushers to make plays. Kind of like a Johnny Manziel, without some of the other issues. That being said, I think what he has put on film like this video, shows he cant evade the rush at the next level.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ezjlgpg-9iw

Yeah I agree that Mayfield best compares to Johnny Suckball on the field (and possibly off the field as well)

Born2Steel
09-10-2017, 01:52 PM
I keep hearing the biggest knock on most college QBs is that they play from shotgun and rarely take snaps from under center. I have watched a few games and most of the highlights from the top rated QBs this season and THEY ALL WORK FROM SHOTGUN. How do any of these guys separate or how do you explain the knocks?

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-10-2017, 11:09 PM
I keep hearing the biggest knock on most college QBs is that they play from shotgun and rarely take snaps from under center. I have watched a few games and most of the highlights from the top rated QBs this season and THEY ALL WORK FROM SHOTGUN. How do any of these guys separate or how do you explain the knocks?

True that the majority of college programs run from a shotgun, while there are some that do work in some sets from under center like Michigan, Indiana, etc. For me the thing to watch is how those QB's set their feet once getting the snap. Look at Lamar Jackson here in this clip and how once he carries our the play fake, then even steps up in the pocket he keeps his feet perpendicular to the WR and then drives off his back foot, then keeps his arms together on the football and then delivers the pass. Its like a baseball pitcher bringing the glove up and throwing from the stretch and delivering a strong throw.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84xLtHJbjoQ

Then you can take a look at a bunch of throws from Baker Mayfield here and he sometimes works from a read option. In that offense he doesn't often have time to gather his feet or else he just doesn't like to and he is throwing off his back foot or without as solid of a base of footwork. A college QB with inconsistent footwork leads to off balance throws and in the NFL where windows are smaller and players are faster, that can lead to missing throws and INT's.

IMO, that is what scouts talk about from guys that work from the shotgun and have never taken a 5 or 7 step drop in years, or are used to making reads from that drop and then redirecting their feet to the next target. The kids are used to read option and chuck it or run. Its a different game than a pro style offense.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDnTZWL97jo

Mojouw
09-10-2017, 11:32 PM
True that the majority of college programs run from a shotgun, while there are some that do work in some sets from under center like Michigan, Indiana, etc. For me the thing to watch is how those QB's set their feet once getting the snap. Look at Lamar Jackson here in this clip and how once he carries our the play fake, then even steps up in the pocket he keeps his feet perpendicular to the WR and then drives off his back foot, then keeps his arms together on the football and then delivers the pass. Its like a baseball pitcher bringing the glove up and throwing from the stretch and delivering a strong throw.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84xLtHJbjoQ

Then you can take a look at a bunch of throws from Baker Mayfield here and he sometimes works from a read option. In that offense he doesn't often have time to gather his feet or else he just doesn't like to and he is throwing off his back foot or without as solid of a base of footwork. A college QB with inconsistent footwork leads to off balance throws and in the NFL where windows are smaller and players are faster, that can lead to missing throws and INT's.

IMO, that is what scouts talk about from guys that work from the shotgun and have never taken a 5 or 7 step drop in years, or are used to making reads from that drop and then redirecting their feet to the next target. The kids are used to read option and chuck it or run. Its a different game than a pro style offense.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDnTZWL97jo

Wait - Baker Mayfield is being talked about to run an actual NFL franchise? You gotta be putting me on! That guy has no mechanics. Like zero. I don't know much more than jack squat about QB play, but I know just enough to get me into trouble. Mayfield's feet are a hot mess and what is with that weird hip rotation at the end of his throwing motion? Looks like he is trying to rotate out of the throw. Hardly any of those throws anticipated windows or routes. It is all reaction - nothing much looks planned.

Contrast that with Mahomes. If you watch his preseason stuff this year and even some of his college stuff, his feet at least look "right". Mayfield looks like someone never explained to him the mechanics of playing the position and just hoped his athleticism would get him by.

Edman
09-11-2017, 07:08 AM
Lamar Jackson and Josh Rosen look to be on the inside track to becoming the Top picks at QB in 2018. Mayfield, Darnold, and Allen are going to drop.

I'm not too high on LJ, as he looks like another Mike Vick, but Rosen has been impressive.

BurghBoy412
09-11-2017, 08:56 AM
You can over analyze a guys mechanics till your eyes bleed. The analysis doesn't mean Jack s*** until these guys actually play in a regular season NFL game. You can make all the predictions you like. Analyze. Have a bias. Kick a guy for his off field issues. None of that matters until they put on a uniform on Sunday and play in an NFL game. That is the only way to tell if a guy can play in the league. You also can't predict injuries. Analysis has become nothing but a fancy word for opinion. All that being said no matter how "NFL ready" a QB might be the chances are he is going to struggle for a few seasons. Ben was the rare acception to this rule.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-11-2017, 09:17 AM
Mojouw, yes Baker Mayfield is in the draft discussion because he will be in the Heisman discussion. One of the evaluators that I often agree with, Tony Pauline, has him as something like a 5th round prospect. Daniel Jerimiah believes Mayfield can be a valid #2 QB in the NFL, so maybe nobody is looking for him to be able to lead a franchise, but that will all sort out.

I just wanted to point out the detractors of a kid that played from shotgun can really relate to footwork , but teaching a young player how to work under center us just a bit more work than those if he hasn't done any of it. Even the handoffs and footwork from there is something to learn, although its not rocket science, but if a kid has done it, the development is just that much faster IMO.

DesertSteel
09-11-2017, 11:08 AM
Lamar Jackson and Josh Rosen look to be on the inside track to becoming the Top picks at QB in 2018. Mayfield, Darnold, and Allen are going to drop.

I'm not too high on LJ, as he looks like another Mike Vick, but Rosen has been impressive.
I just don't see it with Jackson. Great college QB. Ends there.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-11-2017, 11:12 AM
I just don't see it with Jackson. Great college QB. Ends there.

Ya know, I thought that last season but this year I am seeing something a bit more in terms of his willingness and ability to be a passer with some better mechanics. Kind of think he has been working on his craft in the offseason and would become a guy that can be every bit the passer of a Randall Cunningham type player from his Viking days.

Some people make the Vick comparison, as he is that explosive an athlete, but I see Jackson as a longer strider that takes a bit more time to get up to speed and a guy that is more slender that he doesn't want to meet up with LB's or Safety too often running the ball. We will see.

DesertSteel
09-11-2017, 11:14 AM
Ya know, I thought that last season but this year I am seeing something a bit more in terms of his willingness and ability to be a passer with some better mechanics. Kind of think he has been working on his craft in the offseason and would become a guy that can be every bit the passer of a Randall Cunningham type player from his Viking days.

Some people make the Vick comparison, as he is that explosive an athlete, but I see Jackson as a longer strider that takes a bit more time to get up to speed and a guy that is more slender that he doesn't want to meet up with LB's or Safety too often running the ball. We will see.

I haven't seen him play this year. I'm basing my opinion on last year. I'm sure I'll get the chance to watch him soon.

Mojouw
09-11-2017, 11:22 AM
Mojouw, yes Baker Mayfield is in the draft discussion because he will be in the Heisman discussion. One of the evaluators that I often agree with, Tony Pauline, has him as something like a 5th round prospect. Daniel Jerimiah believes Mayfield can be a valid #2 QB in the NFL, so maybe nobody is looking for him to be able to lead a franchise, but that will all sort out.

I just wanted to point out the detractors of a kid that played from shotgun can really relate to footwork , but teaching a young player how to work under center us just a bit more work than those if he hasn't done any of it. Even the handoffs and footwork from there is something to learn, although its not rocket science, but if a kid has done it, the development is just that much faster IMO.

I can see that. I just think that the powers that be for NFL teams have better start getting a handle on how to either adapt their game-plans to incorporate what "Spread" QBs can do, get better at figuring out which college guys can make the leap to NFL mechanics, or both. Either that or just give up on scouting powerhouse big-time programs and start pulling all the QBs league wide from second tier schools that run pro sets.

More and more I think college production is a bit of a red herring at the QB position. Maybe completion percentage - but even that is getting inflated. But these offenses are so slanted towards the accumulation of stats that I am not sure a QB winning the Heisman means anything related to NFL ability. I mean Landry Jones put up gaudy college #'s. :)

- - - Updated - - -


You can over analyze a guys mechanics till your eyes bleed. The analysis doesn't mean Jack s*** until these guys actually play in a regular season NFL game. You can make all the predictions you like. Analyze. Have a bias. Kick a guy for his off field issues. None of that matters until they put on a uniform on Sunday and play in an NFL game. That is the only way to tell if a guy can play in the league. You also can't predict injuries. Analysis has become nothing but a fancy word for opinion. All that being said no matter how "NFL ready" a QB might be the chances are he is going to struggle for a few seasons. Ben was the rare acception to this rule.

Valid points. But name me the high quality long term NFL starter with shit mechanics? At some point fundamentals matter. There is a reason that certain ways of doing things have been around for decades. They work. Your body is a relatively straightforward machine and can only move and accomplish ludicrous athletic feats, like completing 65% of NFL Passes, in certain ways. In the clip posted, Mayfield does not consistently show the basic tools needed to do that.

Does that guarantee that he can't? Of course not. But the percentages are working against him right now. But anything can be fixed, if a person works hard enough and is able to integrate a new way of doing things. By all accounts, Wentz has made great mechanical strides and had a darn good game yesterday. Long story short, Mayfield tries some of the stuff on that clip reel on Sundays and it is gonna end badly.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-11-2017, 12:00 PM
Moj, the NFL teams wont adapt game plans to what college spread offense QB's do. The last one they did that for was Bob Griffin and all that NFL defenses did was to call their friends in college and use their defensive schemes to defend the college offense that Shanny put in place for Bob. BTW, it involves disguising the read of the end and making the QB make the wrong choice to not hand it off....then it involves getting as many "hits on the QB as possible".

The hashmarks in NCAA are wider and the overall speed of defenses is slower, so RB's like Reggie Bush, or QB's like Bob Griffin can outrun defenders. In the NFL the hashmarks are wider and most players run a 4.3- 4.6 on defense and will chase down players going lateral. You gotta make hay vertically in the NFL, whether its running between the tackles or getting a QB some protection and throwing to small windows.

College coaches do what they can to win games and keep their jobs, not to develop players that fit an NFL system. NFL coaches need to win to keep their jobs and running a college offense gets you the Steve Spurrier or Bobby Petrino treatment.

Mojouw
09-11-2017, 12:31 PM
Moj, the NFL teams wont adapt game plans to what college spread offense QB's do. The last one they did that for was Bob Griffin and all that NFL defenses did was to call their friends in college and use their defensive schemes to defend the college offense that Shanny put in place for Bob. BTW, it involves disguising the read of the end and making the QB make the wrong choice to not hand it off....then it involves getting as many "hits on the QB as possible".

The hashmarks in NCAA are wider and the overall speed of defenses is slower, so RB's like Reggie Bush, or QB's like Bob Griffin can outrun defenders. In the NFL the hashmarks are wider and most players run a 4.3- 4.6 on defense and will chase down players going lateral. You gotta make hay vertically in the NFL, whether its running between the tackles or getting a QB some protection and throwing to small windows.

College coaches do what they can to win games and keep their jobs, not to develop players that fit an NFL system. NFL coaches need to win to keep their jobs and running a college offense gets you the Steve Spurrier or Bobby Petrino treatment.

Yeah, I think it is pretty well proven that you can't run straight-up "spread" stuff in the NFL. Just like the wildcat being cool for a hot minute. But I think there are plenty of Qbs who play in college under these spread principles but don't really couple it with the take off and run approach. Those are the guys that I would target for transitioning to the NFL style of play.

All I am saying, I think since I keep changing my mind on this, is that not sure if you can lump all these types of QBs together.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-11-2017, 12:40 PM
All I am saying, I think since I keep changing my mind on this, is that not sure if you can lump all these types of QBs together.

Nobody ever does lump them together, except the guys that falsely tweet that Tuitt is done for the year, when it looks like he is week to week.

There are a lot of things that pro scouts look for. I think arm strength, good decision making, leadership ability, accuracy, intelligence, production, mechanics all factor into things more than if a guy got the snap from under center or shotgun

teegre
09-11-2017, 02:15 PM
Rosen has been impressive.

:nod:

pczach
09-11-2017, 05:36 PM
Moj, the NFL teams wont adapt game plans to what college spread offense QB's do. The last one they did that for was Bob Griffin and all that NFL defenses did was to call their friends in college and use their defensive schemes to defend the college offense that Shanny put in place for Bob. BTW, it involves disguising the read of the end and making the QB make the wrong choice to not hand it off....then it involves getting as many "hits on the QB as possible".

The hashmarks in NCAA are wider and the overall speed of defenses is slower, so RB's like Reggie Bush, or QB's like Bob Griffin can outrun defenders. In the NFL the hashmarks are wider and most players run a 4.3- 4.6 on defense and will chase down players going lateral. You gotta make hay vertically in the NFL, whether its running between the tackles or getting a QB some protection and throwing to small windows.

College coaches do what they can to win games and keep their jobs, not to develop players that fit an NFL system. NFL coaches need to win to keep their jobs and running a college offense gets you the Steve Spurrier or Bobby Petrino treatment.


You're correct. The field gets so compressed if the offense is unable to produce anything vertically. The defense just keeps playing downhill and all the coverages get tighter and tighter like a noose. The NFL game is definitely more of a North/South game. You can get the corner with misdirection sometimes or with a reverse or bootleg action, but to just consistently do toss sweeps and take the ball to the boundary and down the sideline is something that really doesn't exist at the pro level.

In the passing game, only Peyton Manning and the Patriots have managed to have 80% of their success with crossing routes which are almost exclusively illegal pick plays to create separation. The Patriots and Tom Brady have made a living using the horizontal passing game. I know everyone uses it, but they have that as the foundation of everything they do in the passing game. Funny how it only works for them.

As for the college quarterbacks, I try to never make a final determination until they have completed their last year in school. A guy like Jackson is such a phenomenal athlete that if he can continue to make strides with his accuracy and ability to read defenses, he has a chance to be considered at the next level. I noticed an improvement in his game this year too. The real test is when they play a legitimate defense. Unfortunately, Louisville doesn't have a ton of strong defenses with big time talent on their schedule. The big numbers he puts up are impressive, but I truly believe that the lack of competition will hurt him in the draft process. If it's me, I need to see him do more against great defenses. When you don't play a tough schedule, he can't afford to come up small in big games like at the end of last year.

I just think that quarterbacks in the spread offenses are just a tougher evaluation because of the footwork, easier reads, play calls from the sideline, and the offenses just seem to have a lot less anticipation throws because of the numbers game with the spread and what it dictates to the defense. It doesn't mean that they can't be great quarterbacks in the NFL, obviously. It just makes them harder to identify and evaluate the traits and abilities that translate directly to the next level.

Edman
09-17-2017, 01:26 AM
The way Josh Allen is going so far, he just may fall to the Steelers.

Another unimpressive performance against a Power 5 team. A 49-13 destruction at home against Oregon. I know it's may not be all his fault, but thems the breaks.

Steelerette
09-17-2017, 01:46 AM
You've got to be joshing me...

teegre
09-17-2017, 06:31 AM
The way Josh Allen is going so far, he just may fall to the Steelers in round 4.

slight edit

pczach
09-17-2017, 07:35 AM
Louisville QB Lamar Jackson played a legit, big-time defense and didn't look the same as he does against weaker competition. His numbers at the end of the game looked OK, but during the time of the game when the outcome was decided, he had less than 200 yards passing, not many rushing yards, threw a pick-6, and had a lucky TD completion where it looked like he was throwing to another guy.

He still needs to improve and work on some things, and his offensive line just didn't match up with Clemson's front. He's an amazing athlete that had a huge run called back for a cut block that wasn't anywhere near the play, and is a very talented and dangerous player. He needs to be able to throw with more anticipation, and he still needs to work on his accuracy.

He's still fun to watch though! He still has a lot of time to get better.

teegre
09-17-2017, 07:55 AM
Josh Rosen has no defensive help. Ergo, he feels like he has to do it all, which in turn, fosters his penchant for "gambling" (INTs). His overconfidence doesn't help, either (he thinks he can make impossible throws).

Anyway, Rosen vs. Fergeson was epic. Two legit R1 picks.


(Keep your eye on Fergeson.)

pczach
09-17-2017, 08:14 AM
Josh Rosen has no defensive help. Ergo, he feels like he has to do it all, which in turn, fosters his penchant for "gambling" (INTs). His overconfidence doesn't help, either (he thinks he can make impossible throws).

Anyway, Rosen vs. Fergeson was epic. Two legit R1 picks.


(Keep your eye on Fergeson.)
.

That game was awesome to watch. I thought it was the best game that I saw yesterday.

Riley Furguson outplayed Rosen yesterday.

Just as exciting is the play of Memphis WR Anthony Miller. He looks a little AB-like out there! He was fantastic.

DesertSteel
09-17-2017, 08:48 AM
The way Josh Allen is going so far, he just may fall to the Steelers.


In round 3....

Born2Steel
09-17-2017, 09:34 AM
I thought there were several good games this week. UCLA/Mem was a shootout between 2 very good college QBs.(Football's version of a pitcher's duel) Florida/Tennessee was a chess match, mostly due to both team's lack of homerun talent this year. But it ended in typical FL/TN style. I have OleMiss/Cal recorded but haven't watched yet. Mason Rudolph was the unstoppable force against Pitt. USC/Texas went OT for the fans that like a little extra football. And how about SDState knocking off Stanford? That was a fun Saturday.

Born2Steel
09-18-2017, 08:28 AM
Shea Patterson of Ole Miss is only a sophomore, so not in a draft thread discussion yet. Put a pin in this name though. Kid can park the ball just about anywhere he wants to. Great pocket awareness too.

teegre
09-23-2017, 09:34 PM
The PAC-12 is loaded.

Everyone knows Darnold and Rosen.
Falk has had a resurgence.
Herbert is rising... fast.
Even Browning is a viable NFL QB.

Shoes
10-22-2017, 10:41 AM
Steelers send more scouts to Wyoming. Colbert to USC-ND game.

http://www.steelersdepot.com/2017/10/steelers-continue-show-interest-top-college-quarterbacks/

teegre
10-22-2017, 11:48 AM
Steelers send more scouts to Wyoming. Colbert to USC-ND game.

http://www.steelersdepot.com/2017/10/steelers-continue-show-interest-top-college-quarterbacks/

Ugh. No to both.

hawaiiansteeler
10-22-2017, 01:08 PM
Steelers send more scouts to Wyoming.

I watched Josh Allen very closely against the U of Hawaii which is not a good defensive team and tbh I was very unimpressed, I wouldn't want the Steelers to draft him.

pczach
10-22-2017, 01:12 PM
I watched Josh Allen very closely against the U of Hawaii which is not a good defensive team and tbh I was very unimpressed, I wouldn't want the Steelers to draft him.


Allen hasn't looked very good this year. I know there are other issues with the team contributing to his play, but he certainly isn't playing like a quarterback you would want to take early in the draft.

Psycho Ward 86
10-22-2017, 01:28 PM
I never look at draft prospects this early but I've always read that Josh Allen has nothing as far as weapons are concerned and a shit O0line featuring 2 true freshman. Is the guy really that bad or is he just getting absolutely no help?

Born2Steel
10-22-2017, 03:41 PM
SEASON
CMP
ATT
YDS
CMP%
YPA
LNG
TD
INT
SACK
RAT
RAW QBR
ADJ QBR


2017
107
192
1216
55.7
6.33
47
8
6
16
116.4
54.9
51.8


2016
209
373
3203
56.0
8.59
54
28
15
27
144.9
74.2
73.8


2015
4
6
51
66.7
8.50
19
0
0
0
138.1
-
-




*Career stats are updated nightly.






Allen's career stats are not so impressive either. 56% completion rate at less than 10 yards per attempt is pretty awful actually.

BlackAndGold
10-22-2017, 06:35 PM
I'll wait until I see some breakdowns on these QB's during the draft process before I judge.

From Matt Miller, NFL teams like Josh Allen, even with his struggles. He has all the tools to be a successful QB, comparable to Ben.

DesertSteel
10-22-2017, 11:19 PM
I'll wait until I see some breakdowns on these QB's during the draft process before I judge.

From Matt Miller, NFL teams like Josh Allen, even with his struggles. He has all the tools to be a successful QB, comparable to Ben.
After watching him for the first time last night, I'll take Dobbs over that kid.

st33lersguy
10-22-2017, 11:30 PM
SEASON
CMP
ATT
YDS
CMP%
YPA
LNG
TD
INT
SACK
RAT
RAW QBR
ADJ QBR


2017
107
192
1216
55.7
6.33
47
8
6
16
116.4
54.9
51.8


2016
209
373
3203
56.0
8.59
54
28
15
27
144.9
74.2
73.8


2015
4
6
51
66.7
8.50
19
0
0
0
138.1
-
-




*Career stats are updated nightly.






Allen's career stats are not so impressive either. 56% completion rate at less than 10 yards per attempt is pretty awful actually.

Issues with accuracy and interceptions, no thank you

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
10-22-2017, 11:32 PM
Shame there wasting there time when the future QB is on our team named Golden.

hawaiiansteeler
10-22-2017, 11:35 PM
Shame there wasting there time when the future QB is on our team named Golden.

he took advantage of a "Golden Opportunity", Robert Golden is now a perfect 2-2 in his career. wonder what his career passer rating is?

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
10-22-2017, 11:47 PM
he took advantage of a "Golden Opportunity", Robert Golden is now a perfect 2-2 in his career. wonder what his career passer rating is? Lol he is better then LJ.

Mojouw
10-23-2017, 10:34 AM
SEASON
CMP
ATT
YDS
CMP%
YPA
LNG
TD
INT
SACK
RAT
RAW QBR
ADJ QBR


2017
107
192
1216
55.7
6.33
47
8
6
16
116.4
54.9
51.8


2016
209
373
3203
56.0
8.59
54
28
15
27
144.9
74.2
73.8


2015
4
6
51
66.7
8.50
19
0
0
0
138.1
-
-




*Career stats are updated nightly.



Allen's career stats are not so impressive either. 56% completion rate at less than 10 yards per attempt is pretty awful actually.

eah. I want nothing to do with a college QB who can't hit "college open" passes because those won't be there in the NFL. Also, those yards per attempt point to a check down artist.

So, this guy is some sort of cross between Flacco and Alex Smith? Nope. Nope. Nope.

El-Gonzo Jackson
10-23-2017, 11:43 AM
Issues with accuracy and interceptions, no thank you

Interesting. Questionable interceptions and accuracy was a red flag for Deshawn Watson last year too. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/01/10/interceptions-a-red-flag-for-deshaun-watson/

Mojouw
10-23-2017, 11:50 AM
Interesting. Questionable interceptions and accuracy was a red flag for Deshawn Watson last year too. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/01/10/interceptions-a-red-flag-for-deshaun-watson/

And all of that was basically a load of crap because people were not actually watching games.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/deshaun-watson-1.html

Watson was completing passes at a 67% clip and throwing downfield (average yards per attempt was over 12!)

Watson throw 17 INTS out of 579 attempts (so just under 3% of his passes are being picked). Allen is getting picked at just over 3%. So maybe that balances, but he is doing it at HALF the yards per attempt.

BlackAndGold
10-23-2017, 12:14 PM
922441185461002240

Matt Miller had this to say about Allen

Some of the players below are now considered top-10 players, while others are off the board completely. And one player who started the year as the top overall player but has struggled so far doesn't make the list.
Why no Josh Allen? The Wyoming quarterback was my top-ranked player over the summer and has indeed struggled this year. That said, every NFL scout or executive I talk to continues to say Allen will be a top-10 pick in April. Going from top overall to top 10 doesn't warrant mention here.

El-Gonzo Jackson
10-23-2017, 12:33 PM
And all of that was basically a load of crap because people were not actually watching games.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/deshaun-watson-1.html

Watson was completing passes at a 67% clip and throwing downfield (average yards per attempt was over 12!)

Watson throw 17 INTS out of 579 attempts (so just under 3% of his passes are being picked). Allen is getting picked at just over 3%. So maybe that balances, but he is doing it at HALF the yards per attempt.
But it was PFT, ESPN, Kiper, Steelersdepot, and just about everybody but WalterFootball. They were all pegging him at a 3rd round pick despite his performances. I'm just saying that its funny all the hacking he got, yet I thought he was probably the best QB in the draft and definitely didn't get the Kizer hype.

Born2Steel
10-23-2017, 12:41 PM
Stats-wise, Baker Mayfield leads the pack by a lot. Over 70% completion rate, and over 11 yards per attempt.

El-Gonzo Jackson
10-23-2017, 01:07 PM
Stats-wise, Baker Mayfield leads the pack by a lot. Over 70% completion rate, and over 11 yards per attempt.

Yes, and Chris Weinke won the Heisman too.

Mayfield I think goes in the 4th or 5th round. College starter, NFL backup, cant outrun the police.

Mojouw
10-23-2017, 01:11 PM
But it was PFT, ESPN, Kiper, Steelersdepot, and just about everybody but WalterFootball. They were all pegging him at a 3rd round pick despite his performances. I'm just saying that its funny all the hacking he got, yet I thought he was probably the best QB in the draft and definitely didn't get the Kizer hype.

Yeah I can get behind that. But the thing is, most of those sources are just cutting and pasting "Scouting" from the same sources. It gets to be group-think and it is often so blatant that you can read the exact cut and pastes.

On the other hand, there were plenty of other sources (all of which are readily available) that wrote and showed how Watson was well positioned to be successful in the NFL if he put in the work that almost all college QBs need to do.

Kizer is another classic example of people falling in love with a size/arm strength prospect. I saw plenty of sites that pointed out that he processes the game at a glacial pace, stares down receivers, and exhibits several other potentially disastrous traits.

I guess it comes down to the very simple concept that teams need to watch these guys play and not worry so much about what the "pundits" say.

El-Gonzo Jackson
10-23-2017, 01:22 PM
Yeah I can get behind that. But the thing is, most of those sources are just cutting and pasting "Scouting" from the same sources. It gets to be group-think and it is often so blatant that you can read the exact cut and pastes.

On the other hand, there were plenty of other sources (all of which are readily available) that wrote and showed how Watson was well positioned to be successful in the NFL if he put in the work that almost all college QBs need to do.

Kizer is another classic example of people falling in love with a size/arm strength prospect. I saw plenty of sites that pointed out that he processes the game at a glacial pace, stares down receivers, and exhibits several other potentially disastrous traits.

I guess it comes down to the very simple concept that teams need to watch these guys play and not worry so much about what the "pundits" say.

I agree.

Some of the pundits and group think as you say, don't really look at much more than stats. Even Mel Kiper was hacking on Watson. If you watch games and see mechanics, demeanor under pressure, decision making, etc and factor in who they are playing with and who they are playing against, its good, but obviously not perfect.

I joke about Mayfield, but his footwork needs a lot and while LaMarr Jackson best ability is his athleticism, I think he has footwork and mechanics that teams can work with. I haven't watched Allen, but some evaluators that I like and have been consistent are saying good things. He may be the deal.

Mojouw
10-23-2017, 01:42 PM
I agree.

Some of the pundits and group think as you say, don't really look at much more than stats. Even Mel Kiper was hacking on Watson. If you watch games and see mechanics, demeanor under pressure, decision making, etc and factor in who they are playing with and who they are playing against, its good, but obviously not perfect.

I joke about Mayfield, but his footwork needs a lot and while LaMarr Jackson best ability is his athleticism, I think he has footwork and mechanics that teams can work with. I haven't watched Allen, but some evaluators that I like and have been consistent are saying good things. He may be the deal.

I haven't watched any of these guys and I won't until I get bored during the off-season and start thinking more about the draft.

But I will say this, a college QB who completes less than 60% of his passes for under 7 yards per attempt? I challenge anyone to find me a statistical comp for that player that had any success in the NFL. Closest I could come off the top of my head was Ryan Tannehill. But even his stats were slightly better. Other rough comps were McNAbb and Eli Manning - but both had good final years north of 60% completion and higher yards per attempt.

Again, I haven't watched this kid play, but he is going to have to absolutely jump off the tape to overcome his absolutely terrifying statistical snap-shot.

hawaiiansteeler
10-23-2017, 02:13 PM
922441185461002240

Matt Miller had this to say about Allen

Some of the players below are now considered top-10 players, while others are off the board completely. And one player who started the year as the top overall player but has struggled so far doesn't make the list.
Why no Josh Allen? The Wyoming quarterback was my top-ranked player over the summer and has indeed struggled this year. That said, every NFL scout or executive I talk to continues to say Allen will be a top-10 pick in April. Going from top overall to top 10 doesn't warrant mention here.


no way he goes in the top 10, I've watched him play one full game in his career and that pretty much makes me an expert on everything anyone wants to know about Josh Allen :thumbsup:

BlackAndGold
10-23-2017, 02:21 PM
no way he goes in the top 10, I've watched him play one full game in his career and that pretty much makes me an expert on everything anyone wants to know about Josh Allen :thumbsup:

I actually agree with this. But NFL coaches are somewhat arrogant if that is the right word to use, they believe they can fix any prospect, so his report isn't shocking.

teegre
10-23-2017, 02:27 PM
What is everyone's thoughts on Will Grier?

hawaiiansteeler
10-23-2017, 04:16 PM
I actually agree with this. But NFL coaches are somewhat arrogant if that is the right word to use, they believe they can fix any prospect, so his report isn't shocking.

the Cleveland Browns might take Josh Allen with the first pick :wink02:

teegre
10-27-2017, 06:22 AM
Steelers scouts will be at the Oklahoma St. - West Virginia game.

Scouting Mason Rudolph AND Will Grier in one fell swoop.

Born2Steel
10-27-2017, 07:55 AM
Steelers scouts will be at the Oklahoma St. - West Virginia game.

Scouting Mason Rudolph AND Will Grier in one fell swoop.

May get close to 1000 passing yards combined in that game. I'll be watching that one too.

DesertSteel
10-27-2017, 01:13 PM
Steelers scouts will be at the Oklahoma St. - West Virginia game.

Scouting Mason Rudolph AND Will Grier in one fell swoop.
Think how much social media you exposure the Steelers could garner if they draft Grier. His brothers have more followers than Justin Bieber.

teegre
10-27-2017, 02:04 PM
Think how much social media you exposure the Steelers could garner if they draft Grier. His brothers have more followers than Justin Bieber.

Bike vines for everyone!!!

Edman
10-28-2017, 01:10 PM
It's all Mason Rudolph in the Grier-Rudolph matchup so far. Not a QB duel at all.

Grier has looked...frankly garbage.

polamalubeast
10-28-2017, 01:12 PM
It's all Mason Rudolph in the Grier-Rudolph matchup so far. Not a QB duel at all.

Grier has looked...frankly garbage.


He is terrible...2 INT right now in this game

polamalubeast
10-28-2017, 01:24 PM
another interception....

Edman
10-28-2017, 01:24 PM
He is terrible...2 INT right now in this game

3 now.

Look at it this way. His stock will fall after this one at this rate, so the Steelers can grab him.

Edman
10-28-2017, 01:45 PM
Ugly throw by Rudolph.

WVU just scored two TD's on turnovers in less than a minute. It's now a one-score game.

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
10-28-2017, 01:46 PM
Rudolph is looking like the second coming of Ben vs the Jags. I think we found our next Ben.

polamalubeast
10-28-2017, 01:46 PM
Now a pick 6 for Rudolph

In his defense, his receiver had a huge drop on 3rd down at the drive before and West Virginia has had a punt block for a TD after

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
10-28-2017, 01:48 PM
Am waiting for the Penn State game but this one is getting interesting.

hawaiiansteeler
10-28-2017, 02:12 PM
He is terrible...2 INT right now in this game

make that 4 ints now

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
10-28-2017, 02:14 PM
make that 4 ints now Yep seen enough of him and let The Browns draft him.

polamalubeast
10-28-2017, 02:17 PM
The QB draft class in 2018 is now less promising than before the season....

- - - Updated - - -

And remember, the scout of the steelers are in this game!

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
10-28-2017, 02:20 PM
The QB draft class in 2018 is now less promising than before the season....

- - - Updated - - -

And remember, the scout of the steelers are in this game! Yep last class had a bad rap but this class don't look all that either.

- - - Updated - - -

Grier seems to hook up more to AJ Green then Dalton does.

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
10-28-2017, 03:01 PM
Wasted trip for the scouts and Steelers won't have the draft picks to get Rudolph and Grier looks like trash. Hope the scouts at least enjoy a great dinner on the Steelers tonight.

Edman
10-28-2017, 03:54 PM
Yep seen enough of him and let The Browns draft him.

They're not done destroying Kizer yet.

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
10-28-2017, 03:56 PM
They're not done destroying Kizer yet. They will trade for Cousins next year and ruin his career.

teegre
10-28-2017, 04:35 PM
Scouts attend games all of the time, but when they specifically let you know, it’s to see how you handle the pressure. Grier failed miserably.

hawaiiansteeler
10-28-2017, 05:21 PM
Josh Rosen is looking pretty average against UW today also, maybe this year's QB class really isn't all that good after all

st33lersguy
10-28-2017, 05:26 PM
We probably can cross Will Grier off the list

43Hitman
10-28-2017, 05:38 PM
We probably can cross Will Grier off the list
Ben had a 4 interception game against Iowa once.

hawaiiansteeler
10-28-2017, 05:51 PM
Ben had a 4 interception game against Iowa once.

that's because Ben doesn't study enough film and isn't a good leader like Peyton is :stirthepot:

43Hitman
10-28-2017, 06:13 PM
that's because Ben doesn't study enough film and isn't a good leader like Peyton is :stirthepot:
:lol:

El-Gonzo Jackson
10-28-2017, 07:58 PM
We probably can cross Will Grier off the list

He probably wasn't on the list anyways. He has somewhat of an inconsistent delivery and doesn't set his feet well. If you watch the last 2 INT, he was almost throwing just with his arm only, as he already took his left hand off the ball and moved it away from his body, so there is not much rotation with the upper body. My guess is a 4th round pick or later and more of a career backup if he makes it.

Edman
10-28-2017, 08:10 PM
Scouts attend games all of the time, but when they specifically let you know, it’s to see how you handle the pressure. Grier failed miserably.

I think Grier's stock would've rose big time if he stepped up his play in the 4th quarter. Even if he didn't have the greatest game, responding to adversity is a big time skill to have in the NFL. Instead Grier melted down, even when his Defense and Special Teams got them back in the game.

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
10-28-2017, 08:34 PM
Scouts attend games all of the time, but when they specifically let you know, it’s to see how you handle the pressure. Grier failed miserably. Dang being a scout is a dream job.

86WARD
10-28-2017, 09:28 PM
I’ve started seeing Allen compared to Wentz. Accurate?

teegre
10-28-2017, 09:44 PM
Dang being a scout is a dream job.

Except... they usually do not get to watch Steelers games.

st33lersguy
10-28-2017, 09:44 PM
I’ve started seeing Allen compared to Wentz. Accurate?

If you are talking about big bodied QBs from a smaller school than yes, if you are talking about accuracy and fewer interceptions then no. Wentz always had over a 60% completion percentage in college and never threw more than 10 INTs

teegre
10-28-2017, 10:00 PM
Currently, I’m thinking that we go with Dobbs and surround him with talent.

My newest man-crush is on Quenton Nelson, LG, Notre Dame.


AV - Nelson - Pouncey - DD - Gilbert

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
10-28-2017, 10:50 PM
Except... they usually do not get to watch Steelers games. Not live stadium but bet they get to watch them in there cozy motel rooms or at the bar.

polamalubeast
11-08-2017, 08:24 AM
928238458077962241

Mojouw
11-08-2017, 08:54 AM
928238458077962241

The Giants should follow the plan sometimes floated round these parts -- fire everyone and start over.

In all seriousness, Davis Webb should start the second half of the season. See what they have there. Eli is D-O-N-E.

AtlantaDan
11-08-2017, 09:11 AM
SI has Sam Darnold as the #1 pick by the Clowns

https://www.si.com/nfl/2017/11/07/mock-draft-2018-cleveland-browns-san-francisco-49ers-sam-darnold-josh-rosen-saquon-barkley

I do not get the Darnold love as the top pick by any team that has watched him play this season after he torched Penn State in the Rose Bowl

polamalubeast
11-08-2017, 09:44 AM
The Giants should follow the plan sometimes floated round these parts -- fire everyone and start over.

In all seriousness, Davis Webb should start the second half of the season. See what they have there. Eli is D-O-N-E.

Eli will at least have 2 more starts to beat his brother for the second longest streak of starts in a row.

AtlantaDan
11-08-2017, 09:53 AM
The Giants should follow the plan sometimes floated round these parts -- fire everyone and start over.

In all seriousness, Davis Webb should start the second half of the season. See what they have there. Eli is D-O-N-E.

$12.4 million Giants cap hit in dead money in 2018 if Eli goes after this season

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/new-york-giants/eli-manning-4348/

Identical $12.4 million dead money cap hit if this is Ben's last season

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/pittsburgh-steelers/ben-roethlisberger-3595/

ALLD
11-09-2017, 06:16 PM
Sam Donald should go to medical school if the Browns or 49ers want to draft him.

43Hitman
11-10-2017, 04:23 AM
Sam Donald should go to medical school if the Browns or 49ers want to draft him.
Why would the 49ers draft Donald? They trade that pick and build their o-line, they already have the QB they want.

86WARD
11-10-2017, 05:48 AM
Why would the 49ers draft Donald? They trade that pick and build their o-line, they already have the QB they want.

Garrapolo isn’t a sure thing and I don’t think he’s signed beyond this season.

An interesting game this weekend is Giants/49ers...the winner may play themselves out of the first pick. Part of the reason why the Niners may not play Garrapolo this weekend...lol.

43Hitman
11-10-2017, 05:59 AM
Garrapolo isn’t a sure thing and I don’t think he’s signed beyond this season.

An interesting game this weekend is Giants/49ers...the winner may play themselves out of the first pick. Part of the reason why the Niners may not play Garrapolo this weekend...lol.He's more of a sure thing than Donald in my opinion. Garrapolo has at least played in some NFL games. You watch the 49 ers will be good again before most people think. Also I don't think the niners make that trade if they don't think he's their guy.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

86WARD
11-10-2017, 06:30 AM
He's more of a sure thing than Donald in my opinion. Garrapolo has at least played in some NFL games. You watch the 49 ers will be good again before most people think. Also I don't think the niners make that trade if they don't think he's their guy.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

What if Garrapolo wants to test the market? He’d be stupid not to...the Niners May think he’s their guy, but Garrapolo may not want to be there...would it surprise anyone if he played this year out and then wound up back in New England on a three year back up deal?

polamalubeast
11-10-2017, 06:32 AM
What if Garrapolo wants to test the market? He’d be stupid not to...the Niners May think he’s their guy, but Garrapolo may not want to be there...would it surprise anyone if he played this year out and then wound up back in New England on a three year back up deal?

Franchise TAG....

When the 49ers made this trade, it is for Garrapolo to be their QB for at least the next 10 years.

86WARD
11-10-2017, 06:38 AM
I thought it was rumored that Joe Staley was going to garner that Franchise Tag? Maybe not?

polamalubeast
11-10-2017, 06:42 AM
I thought it was rumored that Joe Staley was going to garner that Franchise Tag? Maybe not?

You can not waste a high draft pick if you do not think to keep him.

He could have a contract before the season is over too, but one thing is sure, Garrapolo is going to be with the 49ers for the future.

86WARD
11-10-2017, 06:44 AM
You can not waste a high draft pick if you do not think to keep him.

He could have a contract before the season is over too, but one thing is sure, Garrapolo is going to be with the 49ers for the future.

They could also franchise tag him and then trade him to another team, again opening it up for them to draft Darnold who is also an unknown for a lot less money and use that left over money to re-sign Staley.

My point is, I don’t think it’s a guarantee that Garrapolo stays in San Francisco. Hell, maybe he will stay and the Niners still use the pick on a QB...

polamalubeast
11-10-2017, 06:46 AM
They could also franchise tag him and then trade him to another team, again opening it up for them to draft Darnold who is also an unknown for a lot less money and use that left over money to re-sign Staley.

Very unlikely

The 49ers also have a lot of cap space

teegre
11-10-2017, 07:58 AM
Sam Darnold the football player should go back to school and hone his trade.

Sam Darnold the businessman should strike while the iron is hot (if he would indeed go #1 overall).

DesertSteel
11-10-2017, 11:27 AM
Sam Darnold the football player should go back to school and hone his trade.

Sam Darnold the businessman should strike while the iron is hot (if he would indeed go #1 overall).
Yeah how many guys who were projected top 1-5 decided to go back to school and got exposed and dropped?! Several come to mind. No way would I take the chance. Sam the businessman should overrule the football player. Buyer beware.

polamalubeast
11-10-2017, 11:31 AM
929033590163361793

43Hitman
11-10-2017, 01:08 PM
They could also franchise tag him and then trade him to another team, again opening it up for them to draft Darnold who is also an unknown for a lot less money and use that left over money to re-sign Staley.

My point is, I don’t think it’s a guarantee that Garrapolo stays in San Francisco. Hell, maybe he will stay and the Niners still use the pick on a QB...
I dunno man, that seems like a lot of mental gymnastics to me.

BlackAndGold
11-10-2017, 04:35 PM
Where would Dobbs go in this draft class? late first early 2nd?

This whole draft seems weak.

teegre
11-10-2017, 06:37 PM
Where would Dobbs go in this draft class? late first early 2nd?

This whole draft seems weak.

:nod:

Hence, that is why I’ve suggested going with Dobbs (and surrounding him with talent).

st33lersguy
11-10-2017, 06:51 PM
Where would Dobbs go in this draft class? late first early 2nd?

This whole draft seems weak.

4th at the latest considering how weak last's draft class was graded

BlackAndGold
11-10-2017, 07:41 PM
4th at the latest considering how weak last's draft class was graded

Trubisky, Watson, Mahomes >> Darnold, Rosen, Allen

Also last years draft was deep at other positions. As I posted, this whole draft class is weak Imo.

st33lersguy
11-10-2017, 07:57 PM
Trubisky, Watson, Mahomes >> Darnold, Rosen, Allen

Also last years draft was deep at other positions. As I posted, this whole draft class is weak Imo.

Even factoring how much deeper the 2017 class was at other positions, late 1st/early 2nd is stretching it.

Late 3rd at the absolute max

DesertSteel
11-10-2017, 08:10 PM
Trubisky, Watson, Mahomes >> Darnold, Rosen, Allen

Also last years draft was deep at other positions. As I posted, this whole draft class is weak Imo.
Watson perhaps but there’s no evidence re the other two that backs that up.

Drafting QBs is half skill and half luck.

Mojouw
11-10-2017, 08:39 PM
I thought this was supposed to be the best class since 04. That's what everyone said 9 weeks ago. Now they all suck. 9 weeks from now they'll all be good again after some kid kills it in a bowl game. 9 weeks after that people will "watch the tape" and everyone will suck again. Then it'll be the draft and 6 guys will go in round one.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

DesertSteel
11-10-2017, 10:26 PM
Take one in rounds 3-7 every year!

43Hitman
11-11-2017, 06:15 AM
I thought this was supposed to be the best class since 04. That's what everyone said 9 weeks ago. Now they all suck. 9 weeks from now they'll all be good again after some kid kills it in a bowl game. 9 weeks after that people will "watch the tape" and everyone will suck again. Then it'll be the draft and 6 guys will go in round one.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Lol, pretty much this.

Born2Steel
11-11-2017, 10:58 AM
You do NOT have to draft the 'best' QB in the draft. People will pour over film and mechanics, and footwork, and accuracy, and so on...AND fundamentally, Eli should be as good as Payton. Brees never should have made it back as a starter. Judging by mechanics, Favre should have been awful and a wasted pick. I still contend the QB we need to follow Ben, once he retires, is already in the league and sitting on IR in Denver. In fact, I would like to see Lynch AND Kelley get an opportunity here. I'm willing to give Dobbs his chance, but I did watch him at Tennessee a lot over his career and he was not very accurate with the football. He didn't get much help, but this offensive scheme needs an accurate passer. Also someone that can move when needed.

polamalubeast
11-11-2017, 12:01 PM
I still think Roethlisberger will be with us next year, so ....

BlackAndGold
11-11-2017, 07:30 PM
929426091986563072

Looking at Richmond QB, Kyle Lauletta

BlackAndGold
11-11-2017, 07:41 PM
Even factoring how much deeper the 2017 class was at other positions, late 1st/early 2nd is stretching it.

Late 3rd at the absolute max

Dobbs was considered a late 3rd/early 4th round pick this year. (Mayock had him in round 3, Mel Kiper had him as a possible 2nd round pick)

Not sure how he would still be ranked the same. Weak drafts pushes up talent. I'll agree late first is stretching it, but after that it's very possible.

st33lersguy
11-11-2017, 08:15 PM
Dobbs was considered a late 3rd/early 4th round pick this year. (Mayock had him in round 3, Mel Kiper had him as a possible 2nd round pick)

Not sure how he would still be ranked the same. Weak drafts pushes up talent. I'll agree late first is stretching it, but after that it's very possible.

You were talking about where Dobbs would end up and he ended up a late 4th round pick this past year

BlackAndGold
11-11-2017, 09:19 PM
My intentions was about projections.

In this awful class(again, not just QB's) Dobbs would be viewed as a 2nd rounder at the very least.

hawaiiansteeler
11-11-2017, 09:23 PM
Take one in rounds 3-7 every year!

you mean like Tee Martin, Brian St Pierre, Omar Jacobs, Dennis Dixon and Landry Jones? :horror:

ALLD
11-11-2017, 09:30 PM
you mean like Tee Martin, Brian St Pierre, Omar Jacobs, Dennis Dixon and Landry Jones? :horror:

Dennis Dixon has 2 SB rings.

hawaiiansteeler
11-11-2017, 10:10 PM
Dennis Dixon has 2 SB rings.

amazing, while QBs like Dan Marino, Jim Kelly, Dan Fouts and Fran Tarkenton have none.

Born2Steel
11-11-2017, 11:02 PM
Dennis Dixon has 2 rings while also never seeing the field. What does that even mean?

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
11-26-2017, 05:50 PM
That kid from Stanford Costello impressed me last night! Any idea what RD he may go ?

Born2Steel
11-26-2017, 06:02 PM
Last draft QB success is based on Trubisky, Watson, and Mahomes? Next draft QB class success will be based on Rosen, Mayfield, and Allen?

This is not an accurate tool to measure by. By that method, Aaron Rodgers was a bust until Favre left GB. Dak was the 'steal of the draft', at the end of last season. Today, not so much. As with most things NFL, it's a process, and a system. Kizer 'could be' in the running for OROY maybe, if he was starting for the Jags, Buccs, or Bills instead of the Browns.

teegre
11-27-2017, 06:32 AM
My gut keeps telling me that the Steelers are going to draft Mason Rudolph (QB, Oklahoma St.) at #32.

I’ve averred that they could go with Dobbs (and add a TE), but I just cannot shake this feeling.

El-Gonzo Jackson
11-27-2017, 11:45 AM
My gut keeps telling me that the Steelers are going to draft Mason Rudolph (QB, Oklahoma St.) at #32.

I’ve averred that they could go with Dobbs (and add a TE), but I just cannot shake this feeling.

I hope not. From what I have seen of Rudolf, he makes Kevin Hogan look like a great NFL QB. Try some Rolaids for your gut.

DesertSteel
11-27-2017, 11:57 AM
Ben will tone down the retirement talk this offseason and focus on getting #4. Thus the Steelers will draft another OLB to drop into coverage at #32.

teegre
11-27-2017, 09:24 PM
Try some Rolaids for your gut.

Maybe some prune juice. :lol:

QUESTION:
If BB retires, SteelersCanada suggested signing Tyrod Taylor. Since the Bills are trying to run him out of town, it’s completely possible. And, Taylor isn’t half bad... especially if he has AB, Bell, and our O-line.

DesertSteel
11-27-2017, 10:45 PM
Maybe some prune juice. :lol:

QUESTION:
If BB retires, SteelersCanada suggested signing Tyrod Taylor. Since the Bills are trying to run him out of town, it’s completely possible. And, Taylor isn’t half bad... especially if he has AB, Bell, and our O-line.
I'd go Keenum over Taylor but Taylor would be a viable option - at least as a stop gap.

cubanstogie
11-27-2017, 10:46 PM
Maybe some prune juice. :lol:

QUESTION:
If BB retires, SteelersCanada suggested signing Tyrod Taylor. Since the Bills are trying to run him out of town, it’s completely possible. And, Taylor isn’t half bad... especially if he has AB, Bell, and our O-line.
I really like Tyrod. A lot of poise, good accurate arm and he obviously can run. With the right talent he could be a poor mans Russel Wilson. After watching Tom Savage suck balls tonight he reminded me of Landry Jones. Slow, no passion and had deer in headlights look. We all know Landry will lead us no where. Dobbs has a couple of years to develop and then jury is out. If Ben does retire I think Tyrod would be best choice, or AJ Mccarron. I don't see any for sure things. Mayfield ,Rudolf ,Finley, are a role of dice. Lamar Jackson would be my pick over any of them. Doubt he'll be around though since we'll have last pick.

teegre
11-27-2017, 10:50 PM
I'd go Keenum over Taylor but Taylor would be a viable option - at least as a stop gap.

There is no way that Minnesota let’s Keenum go.

(They’ll probably trade Bradford and Bridgewater.)

teegre
11-27-2017, 10:58 PM
I really like Tyrod. A lot of poise, good accurate arm and he obviously can run. With the right talent he could be a poor mans Russel Wilson. After watching Tom Savage suck balls tonight he reminded me of Landry Jones. Slow, no passion and had deer in headlights look. We all know Landry will lead us no where. Dobbs has a couple of years to develop and then jury is out. If Ben does retire I think Tyrod would be best choice, or AJ Mccarron. I don't see any for sure things. Mayfield ,Rudolf ,Finley, are a role of dice. Lamar Jackson would be my pick over any of them. Doubt he'll be around though since we'll have last pick.

Oooh... McCarron. I like that idea, as well. :nod:

El-Gonzo Jackson
11-28-2017, 10:28 AM
Maybe some prune juice. :lol:

QUESTION:
If BB retires, SteelersCanada suggested signing Tyrod Taylor. Since the Bills are trying to run him out of town, it’s completely possible. And, Taylor isn’t half bad... especially if he has AB, Bell, and our O-line.

I'd pass. The knock on Taylor is that he is conservative and doesn't try to throw the football in tight windows, but rather only if he sees the WR open. That isn't the attitude of a playoff winning QB, so if you want a guy to hold the torch a couple seasons until you find your QB (like the Bills have tried to do), then sure. IMO, he is a more athletic version of Bruce Gradkowski.

43Hitman
11-28-2017, 03:36 PM
I'd pass. The knock on Taylor is that he is conservative and doesn't try to throw the football in tight windows, but rather only if he sees the WR open. That isn't the attitude of a playoff winning QB, so if you want a guy to hold the torch a couple seasons until you find your QB (like the Bills have tried to do), then sure. IMO, he is a more athletic version of Bruce Gradkowski.
I'm not sure who is saying that but I've been watching Tyrod play since he was at VT and I've never seen those traits.

El-Gonzo Jackson
11-28-2017, 04:28 PM
I'm not sure who is saying that but I've been watching Tyrod play since he was at VT and I've never seen those traits.

Here is one scouting report from college:
His anticipation isn’t very good either and I have rarely seen him “throw a receiver open” and he doesn’t go through his progressions very well.
https://tommeltonscouting.wordpress.com/2011/03/22/tyrod-taylor-qb-virgina-tech-scouting-report/


He also does not show the consistent sound decision making to be an efficient quarterback. http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/tyrod-taylor?id=2495240

I heard mention on a radio show of the report that he is comfortable throwing in rhythm, when he sees a pre snap matchup he likes and the WR will be open, but is not eager to throw the ball when a WR is reasonably covered, but a good throw will be completed. Another knock is that he wont stand in the pocket in the face of the rush. He takes his eyes off the WR's and instead looks at the rush and is eager to scramble.

polamalubeast
11-28-2017, 04:37 PM
I would not like Taylor too.

He would kill the Antonio Brown's talent.

hawaiiansteeler
12-21-2017, 02:40 PM
Wyoming QB Josh Allen to play in bowl game, enter NFL draft

Posted by Michael David Smith on December 21, 2017

Wyoming quarterback Josh Allen, a projected first-round pick in the 2018 NFL draft, has decided to play in his bowl game.

That announcement is surprising to some, as top prospects have increasingly decided not to risk injuries in bowl games. It would be particularly understandable if Allen went that route, as he missed the last two games of the regular season with a shoulder injury.

But Wyoming coach Craig Bohl said Allen’s decision to play is an indication of the kind of competitor he is, and NFL teams should like that about him.

to read rest of article:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/12/21/wyoming-qb-josh-allen-to-play-in-bowl-game-enter-nfl-draft/

Fire Goodell
12-21-2017, 03:23 PM
I don't see how we can draft him at this point barring making a Ditka trade, which would cause an uproar in Pittsburgh unless the kid becomes the next Peyton Manning

st33lersguy
12-21-2017, 06:25 PM
He'll be gone, have no interest in him anyway. Inaccurate, INT prone, no thank you

hawaiiansteeler
12-22-2017, 03:03 PM
2018 NFL draft quarterback class primer: Everything you need to know

Feels like last year we heard a ton of pre-draft talk about how the quarterback class wasn't so great. Turns out it had Deshaun Watson, who was pretty special until tearing his ACL in practice in early November. And Mitchell Trubisky ended up starting for the Bears before it was all over. Heck, DeShone Kizer started for the Browns right away ... although maybe he shouldn't have.

Anyway, that was last year. This year's quarterback draft class is the talk of the NFL town. It has been since last offseason. Seriously, at the combine last year, teams would moan about the quality of the quarterbacks in the draft and say, "But next year ..."

Well, next year is here, so how does it look?

to read rest of article:

http://www.espn.com/nfl/draft2018/story/_/id/21836489/2018-nfl-draft-quarterback-class-preview-background-scouting-reports-pro-fits

Buckinnuts
12-22-2017, 04:55 PM
hopefully this kid is there mason rudolph 6'5" 230 lb for draft

Passing
Year School Conf Class Pos G Cmp Att Pct Yds Y/A AY/A TD Int Rate
*2014 Oklahoma State Big 12 FR QB 3 49 86 57.0 853 9.9 9.2 6 4 154.0
*2015 Oklahoma State Big 12 SO QB 13 264 424 62.3 3770 8.9 8.9 21 9 149.1
*2016 Oklahoma State Big 12 JR QB 13 284 448 63.4 4091 9.1 10.0 28 4 158.9
2017 Oklahoma State Big 12 SR QB 12 297 457 65.0 4553 10.0 10.6 35 9 170.0
Career Oklahoma State 894 1415 63.2 13267 9.4 9.8 90 26 159.3

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
12-22-2017, 05:46 PM
If Ben retires after this year I think we make a play for a vet and probably draft a QB in the later rds again. Maybe even Cutler who can be had on the cheap for a 2 year deal. Wouldn't rule out Cousins either even though price will be higher then they like to pay.

- - - Updated - - -

Cutler, Dobbs and a rookie wouldn't be the worst.

hawaiiansteeler
12-22-2017, 06:32 PM
If Ben retires after this year I think we make a play for a vet and probably draft a QB in the later rds again. Maybe even Cutler who can be had on the cheap for a 2 year deal. Wouldn't rule out Cousins either even though price will be higher then they like to pay.

- - - Updated - - -

Cutler, Dobbs and a rookie wouldn't be the worst.

no thanks to Cutler, he's not cut from Steelers cloth.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/474x/79/cc/e0/79cce0e843b886f8f48762e6e9c46756.jpg

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
12-22-2017, 06:47 PM
no thanks to Cutler, he's not cut from Steelers cloth.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/474x/79/cc/e0/79cce0e843b886f8f48762e6e9c46756.jpg But he knows how to beat the Pats with even less talent lol.

hawaiiansteeler
12-22-2017, 06:59 PM
But he knows how to beat the Pats with even less talent lol.

Jay Cutler is 1-3 against the Pats* in his career.

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
12-22-2017, 07:38 PM
Jay Cutler is 1-3 against the Pats* in his career. Yes but that was all with less talented teams like we have now. Besides what is Ben's record against them? Only half joking here but don't think Cutler would be that bad of a choice then going with a unproven QB next season.

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
12-22-2017, 07:47 PM
My point is we are not going to sniff any of the top qb's in this upcoming draft. Dobbs showed some promise in preseason but still think he is very raw. This team is built for the next couple years to be a contender. I think we need to get a decent vet is the best option if Ben does hang it up. Would luv to get Eli if Ben is done and another option. Cutler is the cheapest one.

DesertSteel
12-22-2017, 08:10 PM
My point is we are not going to sniff any of the top qb's in this upcoming draft. Dobbs showed some promise in preseason but still think he is very raw. This team is built for the next couple years to be a contender. I think we need to get a decent vet is the best option if Ben does hang it up. Would luv to get Eli if Ben is done and another option. Cutler is the cheapest one.
My preferences, if Ben retires:
1. Cousins
2. Keenum
3. Eli
4. Alex Smith
5. Bridgewater
6. 1st Rounder
7. Dobbs

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
12-22-2017, 08:43 PM
My preferences, if Ben retires:
1. Cousins
2. Keenum
3. Eli
4. Alex Smith
5. Bridgewater
6. 1st Rounder
7. Dobbs Out of your top 5 the only one I think will be off the table is Keenum after the year the Vikes are having. Cousin is the one I prefer as well and would be nice to lock him in at a 3 year deal if we can make it happen. Bridgewater I'm not sold on but like the rest of the 5.

st33lersguy
12-22-2017, 08:44 PM
If Ben retires after this year I think we make a play for a vet and probably draft a QB in the later rds again. Maybe even Cutler who can be had on the cheap for a 2 year deal. Wouldn't rule out Cousins either even though price will be higher then they like to pay.

- - - Updated - - -

Cutler, Dobbs and a rookie wouldn't be the worst.

Cutler sucks, don't want him

hawaiiansteeler
12-22-2017, 08:57 PM
Cutler sucks, don't want him

https://i.imgflip.com/re5hh.jpg

st33lersguy
12-22-2017, 09:00 PM
BTW, Allen has officially declared for the draft, and apparently he won his bowl game today

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
12-22-2017, 09:56 PM
BTW, Allen has officially declared for the draft, and apparently he won his bowl game today Doesn't matter to us and we won't be drafting him.

Born2Steel
12-22-2017, 10:24 PM
My preferences, if Ben retires:
1. Cousins
2. Keenum
3. Eli
4. Alex Smith
5. Bridgewater
6. 1st Rounder
7. Dobbs


I've posted before a few times that i would take Paxton Lynch to run this offense tomorrow. I think the Broncos will be drafting a QB early and that will make Lynch AND Kelly available for trade immediately, and probably one or both get cut at preseason. The Broncos and the Vikes are 'QB rich' right now. Both teams are not going to be able to keep all those guys and that's going to lower the price. Cousins and Smith are going to go after big money, unknowns to little knowns, Lynch, Kelly, and Bridgewater are not going to get what most are predicting to move teams. They can thank Osweiler and Bradford for that. Keenum most likely stays in Minn.

DesertSteel
12-22-2017, 10:38 PM
I've posted before a few times that i would take Paxton Lynch to run this offense tomorrow. I think the Broncos will be drafting a QB early and that will make Lynch AND Kelly available for trade immediately, and probably one or both get cut at preseason. The Broncos and the Vikes are 'QB rich' right now. Both teams are not going to be able to keep all those guys and that's going to lower the price. Cousins and Smith are going to go after big money, unknowns to little knowns, Lynch, Kelly, and Bridgewater are not going to get what most are predicting to move teams. They can thank Osweiler and Bradford for that. Keenum most likely stays in Minn.

You may be the only person on the planet who would call the Broncos "QB rich" lol.

I'd like to see Lynch take some real action before year's end. I think they'll keep Kelly as a developmental 3rd.

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
12-22-2017, 10:44 PM
I've posted before a few times that i would take Paxton Lynch to run this offense tomorrow. I think the Broncos will be drafting a QB early and that will make Lynch AND Kelly available for trade immediately, and probably one or both get cut at preseason. The Broncos and the Vikes are 'QB rich' right now. Both teams are not going to be able to keep all those guys and that's going to lower the price. Cousins and Smith are going to go after big money, unknowns to little knowns, Lynch, Kelly, and Bridgewater are not going to get what most are predicting to move teams. They can thank Osweiler and Bradford for that. Keenum most likely stays in Minn. You lost me at Broncos are QB rich. Other then Lynch still a unknown I would call it QB curse.

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
12-22-2017, 10:57 PM
Lol DS we think alike on this and didn't see you're post to after I made mine.

Born2Steel
12-22-2017, 11:13 PM
You may be the only person on the planet who would call the Broncos "QB rich" lol.

I'd like to see Lynch take some real action before year's end. I think they'll keep Kelly as a developmental 3rd.

By "QB rich", I'm referring to the fact that they have 4 QBs on roster.
Broncos - Osweiler, Siemian, Lynch, Kelly. Vikings - Keenum, Bradford, and Bridgewater. That's 7 QBs and probably 4-5 of them will become trades. Trades equal draft picks usually when they are QBs. That's all I meant.

st33lersguy
12-22-2017, 11:15 PM
I've posted before a few times that i would take Paxton Lynch to run this offense tomorrow. I think the Broncos will be drafting a QB early and that will make Lynch AND Kelly available for trade immediately, and probably one or both get cut at preseason. The Broncos and the Vikes are 'QB rich' right now. Both teams are not going to be able to keep all those guys and that's going to lower the price. Cousins and Smith are going to go after big money, unknowns to little knowns, Lynch, Kelly, and Bridgewater are not going to get what most are predicting to move teams. They can thank Osweiler and Bradford for that. Keenum most likely stays in Minn.

Seimien, Lynch, Osweiler, yep, that's a QB rich team alright

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https://i.imgflip.com/re5hh.jpg

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/6d/b7/39/6db7398272f7904b703fba445585a1b0.jpg

DesertSteel
12-22-2017, 11:29 PM
By "QB rich", I'm referring to the fact that they have 4 QBs on roster.
Broncos - Osweiler, Siemian, Lynch, Kelly. Vikings - Keenum, Bradford, and Bridgewater. That's 7 QBs and probably 4-5 of them will become trades. Trades equal draft picks usually when they are QBs. That's all I meant.Just giving you a hard time :). Glut might be a better word than rich. You think Lynch is good?

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
12-22-2017, 11:58 PM
Yep only messing too and got what you meant B2S but hard not to comment when the Broncos biggest issue this year is QB.

Born2Steel
12-23-2017, 12:01 AM
Just giving you a hard time :). Glut might be a better word than rich. You think Lynch is good?

I watched Lynch play at Memphis. I held season tickets for 2 of those seasons. I feel like I got a very good look at his skill set. He's not a QB that can succeed just anywhere like Aaron Rogers. He's more of a system guy. IMO, I believe Lynch fits what we do in Pittsburgh perfectly. He is very tall and that works here. He has a very strong arm with accuracy, that works here. He's a lot more mobile than most would think on his 6'7" frame, that works here. And he throws a pretty ball on the move left or right, that works here. I have watched him have to scramble and find the open guy downfield probably as many times as he's had a clean pocket. His downside has always been just get rid of the ball. When his checkdowns are all covered he is prone to forcing throws. That's fixable. He may not be the most cerebral guy in his field, but we don't really need that for the Steelers. So, in a nutshell, yes, I think Lynch is good, for the Steelers.

hawaiiansteeler
12-23-2017, 01:37 PM
BTW, Allen has officially declared for the draft, and apparently he won his bowl game today

Mel Kiper has Josh Allen going at #5 in the first round of his current mock draft.

st33lersguy
12-23-2017, 01:42 PM
Mel Kiper has Josh Allen going at #5 in the first round of his current mock draft.

Whoever drafts him no. 5 will be making a big mistake, not worth the hype IMO

teegre
12-23-2017, 03:11 PM
I’d trade a LOT to acquire Josh Rosen.

Every other QB I’d wait to see if they drop to 32... and, I still might not take them.

Born2Steel
12-23-2017, 05:34 PM
I’d trade a LOT to acquire Josh Rosen.

Every other QB I’d wait to see if they drop to 32... and, I still might not take them.

Curious, what is your top 5? Assuming everyone declares.

JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue
12-23-2017, 06:01 PM
I’d trade a LOT to acquire Josh Rosen.

Every other QB I’d wait to see if they drop to 32... and, I still might not take them. I think Mayfield is going to be the real deal.

hawaiiansteeler
12-23-2017, 06:01 PM
Curious, what is your top 5? Assuming everyone declares.

1) Josh Rosen UCLA
2) Sam Darnold USC
3) Josh Allen Wyoming
4) Baker Mayfield Oklahoma
5) Lamar Jackson Louisville

Born2Steel
12-23-2017, 06:55 PM
1) Josh Rosen UCLA
2) Sam Darnold USC
3) Josh Allen Wyoming
4) Baker Mayfield Oklahoma
5) Lamar Jackson Louisville

Staying with these 5, I would go a little different order

1) Baker Mayfield - IMO, best available of this class for the steelers.
2) Josh Rosen - Most pro ready with unreal talent and potential.
3) Josh Allen - Reminded me a lot of Big Ben in his bowl game.
4) Sam Darnold - Great talent but maybe the most raw of the list.
5) Lamar Jackson - Still not sure he plays QB in the pros. Could be Tomlin's favorite due to comparisons with Falcons Michael Vick.

cubanstogie
12-23-2017, 07:29 PM
I think Darnold will be the best in the long run. None of the above will be available when Steelers pick IMO. While Jackson is a gamble it would be worth it if he's around. I don't know if Jarret Stidham is coming out but he could end up being as good as anyone for more of a bargain. Anytime your drafting a QB its a roll of the dice and I don't see any of those guys as sure things.

teegre
12-23-2017, 07:51 PM
Curious, what is your top 5? Assuming everyone declares.

Top 5 overall?... or, Top 5 QBs???

Shoes
12-23-2017, 07:59 PM
And everyone of them shudders when thinking the Browns will pick them.

Born2Steel
12-23-2017, 08:13 PM
Top 5 overall?... or, Top 5 QBs???

Sorry, QBs.

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And everyone of them shudders when thinking the Browns will pick them.

True. Very possible Kizer will be available for trade.

teegre
12-23-2017, 09:00 PM
Sorry, QBs.

I’m different than most in that I sort of just have guys that I like (some in later rounds).

Josh Rosen is the only QB who I’d bet on in this draft class. He’s #1 and everyone else is a distant second. I feel about as strongly about him as I did about Andrew Luck.

Sam Darnold seems like a huge bust. I can’t put my finger on exactly why, but my gut just says he never becomes a great QB. And, my gut feeling about Josh Allen is even worse.

Lamar Jackson intrigued me. He just has that “winner” quality... albeit, not nearly as much as Deshaun Watson had, but inklings enough to possibly give him strong consideration. Tomlin liked Watson and Dak Prescott, and so, I could definitely see the Steelers drafting Jackson.

For whatever reason, I keep thinking that the Steelers draft Mason Rudolph at 32. Meh. (Nuff said.)

I like Luke Falk (in R2), as well as Kyle Lualetta (R3). When he was a senior in high school, I predicted that the Steelers woukddraft Kyle Allen in 2018... so... let’s add him (R6).

Now... Baker Mayfield. Boy, oh boy. The dude has the moxie, but his footwork is atrocious. He is the A-#1 quintessential “hit or miss” QB in this draft.

So...

1. Josh Rosen
2. Lamar Jackson
3. Luke Falk
4. Kyle Lualetta
5. Baker Mayfield

hawaiiansteeler
12-23-2017, 11:47 PM
I like Luke Falk

So...

1. Josh Rosen
2. Lamar Jackson
3. Luke Falk
4. Kyle Lualetta
5. Baker Mayfield

I saw Falk throw 5 ints against Cal and 3 against Washington, that worries me because NFL dbs are even faster and quicker...

Born2Steel
12-24-2017, 11:26 PM
I’m different than most in that I sort of just have guys that I like (some in later rounds).

Josh Rosen is the only QB who I’d bet on in this draft class. He’s #1 and everyone else is a distant second. I feel about as strongly about him as I did about Andrew Luck.

Sam Darnold seems like a huge bust. I can’t put my finger on exactly why, but my gut just says he never becomes a great QB. And, my gut feeling about Josh Allen is even worse.

Lamar Jackson intrigued me. He just has that “winner” quality... albeit, not nearly as much as Deshaun Watson had, but inklings enough to possibly give him strong consideration. Tomlin liked Watson and Dak Prescott, and so, I could definitely see the Steelers drafting Jackson.

For whatever reason, I keep thinking that the Steelers draft Mason Rudolph at 32. Meh. (Nuff said.)

I like Luke Falk (in R2), as well as Kyle Lualetta (R3). When he was a senior in high school, I predicted that the Steelers woukddraft Kyle Allen in 2018... so... let’s add him (R6).

Now... Baker Mayfield. Boy, oh boy. The dude has the moxie, but his footwork is atrocious. He is the A-#1 quintessential “hit or miss” QB in this draft.

So...

1. Josh Rosen
2. Lamar Jackson
3. Luke Falk
4. Kyle Lualetta
5. Baker Mayfield

Lauletta is one i need to watch play. I have seen zero Richmond football games, ever.
I was very intrigued by Thomas Sirk until he injured his elbow and missed some time, then came back and played TE. He was a fun QB to watch at ECU.
I had wondered what happened with Kyle Allen. I didn't realize he played at Houston last season after A&M.
I hope the Steelers do not take Rudolph. I like the guys arm, I do not like that he takes so many sacks.
I seriously think Darnold needs another season at USC. He has ALL the tools, needs more experience against top college defenses before he tries his hand in the league.
Baker Mayfield...Have you ever noticed how the best shooters in basketball have some weird quirk in their shooting motion? They have some strange stance or hop or hand position or shoulder roll, etc....That is Mayfield. 3 seasons of 70% completion rate.(sop 68%, jr 71%, sr 70%) That can't be a fluke.

Born2Steel
12-24-2017, 11:39 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wUgV5ENZrEE

This highlight of the Idaho Potato Bowl gives a great look at Josh Allen and explains a lot of the hype on him.

DesertSteel
12-25-2017, 02:18 PM
I’m different than most in that I sort of just have guys that I like (some in later rounds).

Josh Rosen is the only QB who I’d bet on in this draft class. He’s #1 and everyone else is a distant second. I feel about as strongly about him as I did about Andrew Luck.

Sam Darnold seems like a huge bust. I can’t put my finger on exactly why, but my gut just says he never becomes a great QB. And, my gut feeling about Josh Allen is even worse.

Lamar Jackson intrigued me. He just has that “winner” quality... albeit, not nearly as much as Deshaun Watson had, but inklings enough to possibly give him strong consideration. Tomlin liked Watson and Dak Prescott, and so, I could definitely see the Steelers drafting Jackson.

For whatever reason, I keep thinking that the Steelers draft Mason Rudolph at 32. Meh. (Nuff said.)

I like Luke Falk (in R2), as well as Kyle Lualetta (R3). When he was a senior in high school, I predicted that the Steelers woukddraft Kyle Allen in 2018... so... let’s add him (R6).

Now... Baker Mayfield. Boy, oh boy. The dude has the moxie, but his footwork is atrocious. He is the A-#1 quintessential “hit or miss” QB in this draft.

So...

1. Josh Rosen
2. Lamar Jackson
3. Luke Falk
4. Kyle Lualetta
5. Baker Mayfield
I worry a little bit about Rosen's confusion history.

teegre
12-26-2017, 12:01 PM
I saw Falk throw 5 ints against Cal and 3 against Washington, that worries me because NFL dbs are even faster and quicker...

Very true... although... BB had a 4-INT game against Iowa, and Josh Rosen has a couple of meltdowns, as well.

There is a strong correlation between completion percentage (in college) and success in the pros.

below 60% avoid!!!
60% - 70% normal
above 70% good indicator of success

And, Falk was over 70%.

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I worry a little bit about Rosen's confusion history.

Very, very true.

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Baker Mayfield...Have you ever noticed how the best shooters in basketball have some weird quirk in their shooting motion? They have some strange stance or hop or hand position or shoulder roll, etc....That is Mayfield. 3 seasons of 70% completion rate.(sop 68%, jr 71%, sr 70%) That can't be a fluke.

Veeerrrrry interesting

polamalubeast
12-26-2017, 12:08 PM
Jay Cutler?!?!....Are you kidding me!!!!

I mean, Cutler has made the playoffs just once(It was in 2010 and the bears won so many lucky games in 2010.....) in his career and he's never made his teams better and he's a horrible leader ....

And Ben will be back next year ....

DesertSteel
12-26-2017, 12:12 PM
I worry a little bit about Rosen's confusion history.




Very, very true.




I just noticed that spell check changed concussion to confusion... lol

El-Gonzo Jackson
12-26-2017, 12:38 PM
Baker Mayfield...Have you ever noticed how the best shooters in basketball have some weird quirk in their shooting motion? They have some strange stance or hop or hand position or shoulder roll, etc....That is Mayfield. 3 seasons of 70% completion rate.(sop 68%, jr 71%, sr 70%) That can't be a fluke.

Ray Allen, Kyle Korver, Steph Curry, Larry Bird, JR Smith, Reggie Miller, Steve Kerr, Paul Pierce....the only guy there that I think had a bit of an odd stroke was Miller, but it was more of his timing of jump and release point I think.

All time Oklahoma Career passing leaders are 1. Landry Jones 2. Baker Mayfield 3. Sam Bradford 4. Jason White 5. Josh Heupel. There are three Heisman winners there and one starting NFL QB on that list.

Born2Steel
12-26-2017, 12:51 PM
Ray Allen, Kyle Korver, Steph Curry, Larry Bird, JR Smith, Reggie Miller, Steve Kerr, Paul Pierce....the only guy there that I think had a bit of an odd stroke was Miller, but it was more of his timing of jump and release point I think.

All time Oklahoma Career passing leaders are 1. Landry Jones 2. Baker Mayfield 3. Sam Bradford 4. Jason White 5. Josh Heupel. There are three Heisman winners there and one starting NFL QB on that list.

I understand you do not like Mayfield. So, again, I am not going to debate with you my opinion. I see a guy that completes 70+% of his passes, is very mobile, has better body control than he's given credit for, and the guy just wins games. People want to point at the gesture he made to the Kansas bench as him being a jerk. Nobody seems to remember that the Kansas players wouldn't shake hands before the coin toss. Immature? Yes. But factor in the reason and it doesn't seem so one sided.

Jason White won the Heisman but everyone knew his knees were shot, so he didn't even get drafted. And Heupel had a chronically bad shoulder on his throwing arm. The other 2 are still playing in the NFL, why Landry Jones is, is a bit of a debate itself.

El-Gonzo Jackson
12-26-2017, 01:52 PM
I understand you do not like Mayfield. So, again, I am not going to debate with you my opinion. I see a guy that completes 70+% of his passes, is very mobile, has better body control than he's given credit for, and the guy just wins games. People want to point at the gesture he made to the Kansas bench as him being a jerk. Nobody seems to remember that the Kansas players wouldn't shake hands before the coin toss. Immature? Yes. But factor in the reason and it doesn't seem so one sided.

Jason White won the Heisman but everyone knew his knees were shot, so he didn't even get drafted. And Heupel had a chronically bad shoulder on his throwing arm. The other 2 are still playing in the NFL, why Landry Jones is, is a bit of a debate itself.

I have nothing against Mayfield, I just see his footwork and comfort in the pocket don't look conducive to being a QB that makes accurate on time throws. He likes to try and ad lib more, and in those cases his feet are never set, so its all arm and footballs like those throws get intercepted in the NFL.

His offseason arrest, fleeing from the police, coupled with his issues this year speak to character and that will be fleshed out in the interview process. I am just saying there are other hyped college QB's that don't make good NFL QB's and I get a kick out of how Mayfield was a 5th round prospect at the end of last season, but now he is somehow a first rounder.

Slimdugger99
12-27-2017, 12:09 AM
Don’t you think it’s premature to write off Dobbs? He’s a rookie who hasn’t played in the regular season yet. Maybe we’ll get to see him against Cleveland.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Born2Steel
12-27-2017, 09:29 AM
Don’t you think it’s premature to write off Dobbs? He’s a rookie who hasn’t played in the regular season yet. Maybe we’ll get to see him against Cleveland.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I certainly don't mean to write off Dobbs. I watched him a lot at Tennessee, and I saw a guy with a very good deep ball, yet very inaccurate short to mid range passes. I don't know if that is due to mechanics, coaching, confidence, or what. I just can't rest on finding a QB to be the next starter here yet. I sincerely hope Dobbs CAN be that guy.

El-Gonzo Jackson
12-27-2017, 11:33 AM
I certainly don't mean to write off Dobbs. I watched him a lot at Tennessee, and I saw a guy with a very good deep ball, yet very inaccurate short to mid range passes. I don't know if that is due to mechanics, coaching, confidence, or what. I just can't rest on finding a QB to be the next starter here yet. I sincerely hope Dobbs CAN be that guy.

I agree, too early to write him off, but I always like the week of Senior Bowl because players are playing against similar all star talent in NFL systems, not some college system that can mask inefficiencies. The week of Senior Bowl last year Dobbs looked like the 3rd best QB on his team, not the 3rd best QB in Mobile, so I really don't hold much hope that he will be anything but the successor to Landry Jones as the Steelers hopefully prime backup. His preseason games didn't show me much different.

Mojouw
12-31-2017, 12:03 PM
Think you all have turned me around on Mayfield. Took another short look and he isn’t what I first thought. I kinda can see a version of him that is Russell Wilson with a bit worse of an arm. Long story short, I am starting to see how a polarizing prospect like Mayfield takes a tumble out of the top 25 on draft day.

IF that were to happen, got to wonder at what point do you try and go get him? Sit at 32 and wait or as soon as it gets to a point where it is your 20717 first rounder and only one other pick, do you go get him? Shades of Favre and Rodgers in the best case....a draft day of regret in the worst. So much to argue about — I love it!

teegre
12-31-2017, 03:10 PM
Think you all have turned me around on Mayfield. Took another short look and he isn’t what I first thought. I kinda can see a version of him that is Russell Wilson with a bit worse of an arm. Long story short, I am starting to see how a polarizing prospect like Mayfield takes a tumble out of the top 25 on draft day.

IF that were to happen, got to wonder at what point do you try and go get him? Sit at 32 and wait or as soon as it gets to a point where it is your 20717 first rounder and only one other pick, do you go get him? Shades of Favre and Rodgers in the best case....a draft day of regret in the worst. So much to argue about — I love it!

Baker Mayfield will be the most discussed, most debated player in the 2018 NFL Draft.

teegre
12-31-2017, 03:30 PM
Steelers scouts were in attendance to watch Lamar Jackson’s bowl game.

GoSlash27
12-31-2017, 07:25 PM
I'm still fully on board the CJ Beathard bandwagon. I bet we can get him away from SF pretty cheap. They aren't attached to him and he didn't have a great showing as a rookie with no weapons trying to carry the team, but I'm tellin' ya: He plays QB just like Ben did when he was young. He's an easy fit for our system.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9n3kevc_8Gw

cubanstogie
12-31-2017, 09:12 PM
I'm still fully on board the CJ Beathard bandwagon. I bet we can get him away from SF pretty cheap. They aren't attached to him and he didn't have a great showing as a rookie with no weapons trying to carry the team, but I'm tellin' ya: He plays QB just like Ben did when he was young. He's an easy fit for our system.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9n3kevc_8Gw
No way, dude is equal to Landry Jones. Good backup no way starter. The niners had zero shot at winning until Garoppolo showed up

Born2Steel
12-31-2017, 09:18 PM
Steelers scouts were in attendance to watch Lamar Jackson’s bowl game.

Lamar Jackson may be the best football player in this draft. I don't know about as a QB, but he is lightning in a bottle as an athlete.

cubanstogie
12-31-2017, 09:27 PM
Lamar Jackson may be the best football player in this draft. I don't know about as a QB, but he is lightning in a bottle as an athlete.
Plus I’ve read he is quality kid wanting to get better , studies film and humble.I don’t know if he has Deshaun Watson’s brains but he has more talent imo.

polamalubeast
01-03-2018, 06:44 PM
948712769880195072

948704443268124672

DesertSteel
01-03-2018, 07:39 PM
Browns take Darnold and ............................... Bust!

Steeldude
01-03-2018, 08:07 PM
Are any of these QBs real 1st round prospects? Or are they only in the 1st round because they happen to be the best out of an average pool?

Born2Steel
01-03-2018, 08:29 PM
Are any of these QBs real 1st round prospects? Or are they only in the 1st round because they happen to be the best out of an average pool?

Obviously we don't know the answer to that yet. Not completely anyway. Right now all we can measure is physical ability based on what they did in college. IMO, Rosen is NFL ready, Darnold should have stayed another year. There are some promising prospects in this year's QB class. But for now that's all they are. Promising.

Rosen, Darnold, Jackson, Mayfield, Allen, Finley, Falk, Ferguson, Rudolph, White, Woodside, McSorley, and Briscoe, and probably a couple names I have forgotten right this minute, will probably all be rated to go in rounds 1-3. What we won't know for a while is if they have the brains, temperament, and emotional maturity to be successful NFL QBs.

teegre
01-03-2018, 10:25 PM
Lamar Jackson may be the best football player in this draft. I don't know about as a QB, but he is lightning in a bottle as an athlete.

I heard a talking head say almost the exact same thing. :nod:

teegre
01-04-2018, 12:40 AM
Are any of these QBs real 1st round prospects? Or are they only in the 1st round because they happen to be the best out of an average pool?

That is a good question.

QBs are always overvalued/overdrafted, and rightfully so, because you HAVE to have a franchise QB in order to succeed in the NFL. There is NO way that Ryan Tannehill should have EVER been drafted in the top ten... but, to acquire even an “average” QB, that is indeed what has to be done. IMO, guys like Derek Carr are a good value: pretty good, but not overdrafted (Carr was #36).

In this draft, Rosen is worthy of the #1 overall selection.

Then, there are several who would be “worthy” of being drafted 32 (similar to Carr)... where you aren’t reaching, but your getting a QB with great talent (albeit with flaws).

Following that logic, Luke Falk at 64 is a good value. He “could” develop into a good QB, but you definitely aren’t overpaying (but, he also has more flaws). Even farther along that line of thinking is Kyle Lauletta at 96: low risk, even more flaws. Maybe, with good coaching, you end up with the next Jimmy Garappolo. But, for every one of him, you have about twenty Matt Barkleys.

The most intriguing QB is Lamar Jackson. He has immense talent (more so than any other QB), but he would need coaching. And, he might be there at 32. No reach, high potential.

El-Gonzo Jackson
01-04-2018, 01:16 AM
The most intriguing QB is Lamar Jackson. He has immense talent (more so than any other QB), but he would need coaching. And, he might be there at 32. No reach, high potential.

Yeah, I thought last year that he was just an athletic QB that could make passes to open WR's, but when watching him this year carry out play action fake, he got his feet squared nicely and had a good bounce on the balls of his feet and threw a nice mechanical football from the legs up. He looked like he could be a good mechanical QB and has Mike Vick type acceleration. His footwork looks a lot better than Mason Rudolf or Will Grier IMO.

Steeldude
01-04-2018, 03:21 AM
Obviously we don't know the answer to that yet. Not completely anyway. Right now all we can measure is physical ability based on what they did in college. IMO, Rosen is NFL ready, Darnold should have stayed another year. There are some promising prospects in this year's QB class. But for now that's all they are. Promising.

Rosen, Darnold, Jackson, Mayfield, Allen, Finley, Falk, Ferguson, Rudolph, White, Woodside, McSorley, and Briscoe, and probably a couple names I have forgotten right this minute, will probably all be rated to go in rounds 1-3. What we won't know for a while is if they have the brains, temperament, and emotional maturity to be successful NFL QBs.

I meant are any of them considered the next Marino, Manning, Elway etc...? I wouldn't take a QB in the first unless he is really worth it

BostonBlackie
01-04-2018, 04:04 AM
Too bad he isn't a WR. Tall, smart, quickness, speed, drool.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-GOJpZYaco