The Steelers trade for TE Vance McDonald

[polamalubeast]

902563046282977280

http://www.nfl.com/player/vancemcdonald/2540215/profile

[AtlantaDan]

902563046282977280

http://www.nfl.com/player/vancemcdonald/2540215/profile

Throw him into the CB competition mix

[polamalubeast]

I would not be surprised if the steelers do the same for a outside CB.

[Dwinsgames]

I do not like the move at all , dude has less than 1000 yards receiving in his career( 4 years ) and Gary Barnage sits there with more yards in a single season and costs you nothing in terms of draft picks ...

[polamalubeast]

I do not like the move at all , dude has less than 1000 yards receiving in his career( 4 years ) and Gary Barnage sits there with more yards in a single season and costs you nothing in terms of draft picks ...


The steelers have a good chance of being one of the best teams in the NFL in 2017 and the 49ers will probably be one of the worst, so if we count the compensations pick, the steelers will be trade back for only 15-20 spot to improve a major weak point.Jesse James is not a NFL starter.

McDonald's has also been better in the last two years.

[Nadroj 20]

I do not like the move at all , dude has less than 1000 yards receiving in his career( 4 years ) and Gary Barnage sits there with more yards in a single season and costs you nothing in terms of draft picks ...

TE Position isn't only about receiving yards and TD's. What are their respective blocking abilities? I do not know much about either one, but we only lost a 4th rounder and did gain a 5th rounder in addition to McDonald. If he fits our needs better than Barnage then I like the trade.

[polamalubeast]

902567968768483329

- - - Updated - - -

902568322188722176

- - - Updated - - -

902569219623075841

[Dwinsgames]

a lot of over blown hype there IMO ...

he isn't nor will he ever be anything close to the players green would have been if healthy ... he is not near the athlete period ..

I am surprised at all this to be honest ...

go to this link , look at 1 stat ..... catches vs targets.... and if you think Grimble is frustrating buckle up its gonna be a long ride https://www.pro-football-reference.c...M/McDoVa00.htm (https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/McDoVa00.htm)

[Steeldude]

Well hopefully it is not another trade that ends up benching the player until week 16 and then letting him go.

Who do they let go? Johnson or Grimble? Is Jake McGee eligible for the PS?

[polamalubeast]

866 yards on 118 targets is far from bad(717 yards on 91 targets in the last 2 years), especially in an atrocious offense like the 49ers in the last 2 years.

In fact, it's a big improvement what we had as TE with Jesse James

[Dwinsgames]

866 yards on 118 targets is far from bad(717 yards on 91 targets in the last 2 years), especially in an atrocious offense like the 49ers in the last 2 years.

In fact, it's a big improvement what we had as TE with Jesse James


64 catches 118 targets is the number that needs to be looked at ......

[polamalubeast]

64 catches 118 targets is the number that needs to be looked at ......



If you only look at the completion percentage , Sam Bradford was the best QB in the nfl last year

Yards per target is more important for me.

- - - Updated - - -

for his drop....

804009964796682240

- - - Updated - - -

And I'm not saying McDonald's is great, but it's a position that the steelers are improving, since our TE position was so bad with James.

- - - Updated - - -

902574397612974080

Almost better that the yards per catch by James

[Steeldude]

I'm hoping McGee will continue to grow.

[Dwinsgames]

just think better short term options where available without swapping a 4th rounder for a 5th rounder ...

but the proof will be in the pudding if he makes plays and doesn't have a 30-40% drop rate I will gladly eat crow

but if he stinks it up or proves to be no better than what we already Have in Grimble /James ...well haha

[polamalubeast]

just think better short term options where available without swapping a 4th rounder for a 5th rounder ...

but the proof will be in the pudding if he makes plays and doesn't have a 30-40% drop rate I will gladly eat crow

but if he stinks it up or proves to be no better than what we already Have in Grimble /James ...well haha

It's not hard to be better than James and the rest.

- - - Updated - - -

902577626765815809

[Dwinsgames]

It's not hard to be better than James and the rest.

it is when you start counting drops , you cant waste downs in this league

but either way we have said about all there is to say on this for now ...

will wait for the pulling my hair out threads when dropped balls cost us drives/games ( God I hope I am wrong )

[Mojouw]

This is highway robbery. The Steelers get a viable NFL player at the cost of having to move back in the draft like what 15 spots at most?

Is McDonald going to be the answer? Will he even see the field? No idea. But I like the aggressiveness of Colbert and CO in the new cut-down era.

Got two guys that have had some success in the league for basically a bag of kicking tees in Phillips and McDonald.

[tube517]

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/vance-mcdonald?id=2540215

I know nothing about this guy.

But, I thought they would make a move for a starting CB first versus a TE at this juncture. Oh well.

(Forgot about Phillips but I was dreaming for someone better lol)

[polamalubeast]

it is when you start counting drops , you cant waste downs in this league

but either way we have said about all there is to say on this for now ...

will wait for the pulling my hair out threads when dropped balls cost us drives/games ( God I hope I am wrong )

804009964796682240

He improved on that last year, but one thing is certain, he can be a playmaker for the steelers, which James will never be able to be.

- - - Updated - - -


This is highway robbery. The Steelers get a viable NFL player at the cost of having to move back in the draft like what 15 spots at most?

Is McDonald going to be the answer? Will he even see the field? No idea. But I like the aggressiveness of Colbert and CO in the new cut-down era.

Got two guys that have had some success in the league for basically a bag of kicking tees in Phillips and McDonald.

He going to see the field,no doubt in my mind.

[AtlantaDan]

It's not hard to be better than James and the rest.

- - - Updated - - -

902577626765815809

To splash play, don't blink, and living in your fears add "haven't been consistently varsity enough" to the list of Tomlinisms :chuckle:

[tube517]

To splash play, don't blink, and living in your fears add "haven't been consistently varsity enough" to the list of Tomlinisms :chuckle:

http://www.steelersuniverse.com/forums/showthread.php/3444-Tomlin-isms

:tomlinism: :chuckle:

[Iron Steeler]

Whelp let see what he has... Right now he is = to james/ grimble in my book.

[polamalubeast]

Whelp let see what he has... Right now he is = to james/ grimble in my book.


He had 717 yards in 91 targets in the last two years with a very bad offense.

James will never have his numbers.

[Dwinsgames]

He had 717 yards in 91 targets in the last two years with a very bad offense.

James will never have his numbers.

I remember thinking something similar with a WR we obtained from the 49ers named Cedrick Wilson ...

San Fran STUNK his entire tenure there but was their leading receiver his final year there with 641 yards

thought if he could do that on a shitty team with a shitty QB he would flourish in Pittsburgh with Ward opposite him and Ben throwing him the ball ...

Wilson spent 3 years here never surpassing his best numbers in San Fran , in fact never really getting all that close to those numbers with 504 yards being his best in Black N Gold
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/W/WilsCe00.htm

[43Hitman]

I heard that he has a high yardage per catch too, something like 14+

[polamalubeast]

I remember thinking something similar with a WR we obtained from the 49ers named Cedrick Wilson ...

San Fran STUNK his entire tenure there but was their leading receiver his final year there with 641 yards

thought if he could do that on a shitty team with a shitty QB he would flourish in Pittsburgh with Ward opposite him and Ben throwing him the ball ...

Wilson spent 3 years here never surpassing his best numbers in San Fran , in fact never really getting all that close to those numbers with 504 yards being his best in Black N Gold
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/W/WilsCe00.htm


Wilson was good for us in 2005.(451 yards on only 53 targets in regular season and 216 yards on 12 targets in the playoffs)

The steelers was a run first team in 2005 too.

[Dwinsgames]

Wilson was good for us in 2005.(451 yards on only 53 targets in regular season and 216 yards on 12 targets in the playoffs)

The steelers was a run first team in 2005 too.


sorry I just can't agree with that , 51% completion percentage is unacceptable

[polamalubeast]

sorry I just can't agree with that , 51% completion percentage is unacceptable

No when you have 10 yards per target if we combine the regular season and the playoffs.

Sorry but completion percentage is overrated...YPA or yards per targets for a WR/TE is more important.667 Yards on 65 targets is great!....A catch for 5 yards on the 3rd down and 7 is bad!

[Mojouw]

It all depends on what the measuring stick for the trade is.

Is this dude gonna come in and be Ladarius Green? Nope. Is he going to be Kelce/Eifert/Gronk good? Of course not.

But can he come in and cause the following to happen:
1. McDonald takes most of the snaps and stops tipping the offenses intent. The specific TE the Steelers select from their current pu pu platter of mediocrity essentially provides a "key" to the defense of the play call.
2. Lights a fire under either James or Grimble and they start playing with some "want to".

If either of those happens, then moving back a dozen spots in the draft is more than worth it.

That's the thing. The "opportunity" cost for McDonald is pretty darn low. He is even totally cut-able after this season. Is it potentially a band-aid solution to the TE situation? Yup. Likely not a very good one? Totally possible.

But it is an aggressive, low risk move that I argue is ahead of the curve of the rest of the league. Good teams are going to start doing this kind of thing because of the longer cut down period.

[Shoes]

Big, big mistake in not drafting Kittle.

[Mojouw]

Big, big mistake in not drafting Kittle.

Not sure I'm willing to swap Kittle for Dobbs.

You could argue that Dobbs would've still been there at the Steelers #5, but we will never know. As things stand right now, that is the choice.

The QB or the TE. I'm taking the QB every single time.

[Shoes]

Not sure I'm willing to swap Kittle for Dobbs.

You could argue that Dobbs would've still been there at the Steelers #5, but we will never know. As things stand right now, that is the choice.

The QB or the TE. I'm taking the QB every single time.

I would have taken Kittle in R4 without a question. Steelers like losing draft picks.

On that note McDonald looks better than James, but I want to see how he blocks.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNrLfK3hoIQ

[SteelerFanInStl]

I like the trade and I like McDonald. He's a very good blocker and I think he can become an even better receiver with a good QB. For giving up hardly anything, I like it.

[st33lersguy]

I don't like these August trades and after the last 2 years I can't trust that whoever they trade for in August will actually contribute. Getting the 5th round pick though really makes the deal better

[Iron Steeler]

Big, big mistake in not drafting Kittle.

My thoughts exactly . George Kittle over Josh Dobbs

[BurghBoy412]

I like the move. Hope it upgrades the position. He should be able to produce where the other TE's on the roster have failed.

[Iron Steeler]

Not sure I'm willing to swap Kittle for Dobbs.

You could argue that Dobbs would've still been there at the Steelers #5, but we will never know. As things stand right now, that is the choice.

The QB or the TE. I'm taking the QB every single time.

Kittle could have contributed right away to the team this year. Dobbs may be gone by next draft day . (Dennis Dixon 2.0)

[Mojouw]

All good points. I just always take the the QB. Can never have enough tickets to that lottery.

Doesn't really matter though. Point is they got a serviceable NFL TE for peanuts.

[BlackAndGold]

We improved the TE position and only moved back less than 10 spots in next years draft.

This was a great deal.

[teegre]

This is highway robbery. The Steelers get a viable NFL player at the cost of having to move back in the draft like what 15 spots at most?

Bingo!!!

The Niners will be picking in the top 5.
And, the Steelers will be picking 32nd. :wink02:
As far as the comps go, in the last draft, there were seven R4 comp picks. Heck, let's assume it is ten.

R4, 32: Niners (from Steelers)
R4, comp:
R4, comp:
R4, comp:
R4, comp:
R4, comp:
R4, comp:
R4, comp:
R4, comp:
R4, comp:
R4, comp:
R5, 1: NYJets
R5, 2: Browns
R5, 3: Bills
R5, 4: Jaguars
R5, 5: Steelers (from Niners)

[polamalubeast]

902613373077995521

[86WARD]

This guy was a decent target and a bright spot in the dregs of the Niners. He can catch balls, he can block and he's got that gritty attitude. I love this trade...a lot. He's going from trash to Ben at QB and look at the receivers around him. I love it.

Give Ben options with two TEs in the game and Brown and Bryant on the field. If they go two high on Brown, Ben can opt to run with Bell as McDonald can block. He's a nice weapon for Ben to have on the field.

McDonald and a 5 for a 4th rounder is a no brainer.

[86WARD]

All good points. I just always take the the QB. Can never have enough tickets to that lottery.

Doesn't really matter though. Point is they got a serviceable NFL TE for peanuts.

Far more than serviceable.

[polamalubeast]

902631933464776704

[tube517]

http://www.steelersdepot.com/2017/08/film-room-vance-mcdonald-brings-consistency-vertical-threat-steelers-need/

[tube517]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DIbREpFVwAAhge8.jpg:large

[DesertSteel]

I'm sure that his numbers are skewed by that motley QB crew out there in SF. Dreadful. Let's see what he can do with a top 3 QB where great receivers are taking all the coverage.

I like the move.

[Born2Steel]

If McD can solve the TE woes then great. Means we can fully focus on safety next draft. After we take the next Steeler franchise QB that is.

[polamalubeast]

Film Room: Breakdown Of Vance McDonald’s 2016 Incompleted Targets


The Pittsburgh Steelers acquired tight end Vance McDonald in a Tuesday morning trade with the San Francisco 49ers and since that deal happened there’s been a lot of talk about his reliability as a pass catcher and especially when it comes to drops.

While Alex Kozora has already done a fine job of breaking down a lot of the good that comes along with McDonald, in this post, I’ll look at the 21 pass targets to him from last season that were incomplete.

Below is a video of all 21 incompleted targets thrown to McDonald last season and all are from the end zone view of the play. The table below is in chronological order for you to follow along with as well.

As you will see in the video, quite a few of those incompleted passes were a result of off-target by the 49ers quarterbacks. In fact, you can probably say that at least 13 of those incompleted throws were uncatchable and maybe even 14.

Now, one throw was undercut by a defensive back and intercepted while three others were broken up by defensive players and those should be easy to identify.


read more

http://www.steelersdepot.com/2017/08/film-room-breakdown-vance-mcdonalds-2016-incompleted-targets/

[st33lersguy]

http://steelerswire.usatoday.com/2017/08/29/salary-cap-implications-for-steelers-after-trade-for-te-vance-mcdonald/

Fortunately, the salary cap numbers are not as bad as previously thought

[BlackAndGold]

http://steelerswire.usatoday.com/2017/08/29/salary-cap-implications-for-steelers-after-trade-for-te-vance-mcdonald/

Fortunately, the salary cap numbers are not as bad as previously thought

Yep, great trade.

[Shoes]

Lots of folks thought James, Johnson, Grimble were enough, clearly that wasn't the case.

Well at least McDonald is better than the three we have, but then again Kittle pushed McDonald out the door, you can see why. Blocks like a OT, runs a 4.5 forty, great hands and can do this after the catch, all in a R4 package if we would have taken him.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-m-RHsCkJMY

[Hawkman]

But we didn't take Kittle........move on.

[Shoes]

But we didn't take Kittle........move on.

and that was a big mistake, Ill keep you posted on how well he does.

[polamalubeast]

and that was a big mistake, Ill keep you posted on how well he does.



This is another debate, but he must not be so incredible if he was still available in the 5th round.

[Shoes]

This is another debate, but he must not be so incredible if he was still available in the 5th round.

It is another debate, but wait and see.

[Dwinsgames]

Film Room: Breakdown Of Vance McDonald’s 2016 Incompleted Targets


The Pittsburgh Steelers acquired tight end Vance McDonald in a Tuesday morning trade with the San Francisco 49ers and since that deal happened there’s been a lot of talk about his reliability as a pass catcher and especially when it comes to drops.

While Alex Kozora has already done a fine job of breaking down a lot of the good that comes along with McDonald, in this post, I’ll look at the 21 pass targets to him from last season that were incomplete.

Below is a video of all 21 incompleted targets thrown to McDonald last season and all are from the end zone view of the play. The table below is in chronological order for you to follow along with as well.

As you will see in the video, quite a few of those incompleted passes were a result of off-target by the 49ers quarterbacks. In fact, you can probably say that at least 13 of those incompleted throws were uncatchable and maybe even 14.

Now, one throw was undercut by a defensive back and intercepted while three others were broken up by defensive players and those should be easy to identify.


read more

http://www.steelersdepot.com/2017/08/film-room-breakdown-vance-mcdonalds-2016-incompleted-targets/


if you bother to watch that tape you will find there is a shitload more than 3 or 4 drops on it ....

watch the tape its there make your own determination

McDonald can be a great weapon he just is not a reliable one so he may win you a game with a great catch and run but he also may lose you some games with key drive killing dropped passes

[polamalubeast]

if you bother to watch that tape you will find there is a shitload more than 3 or 4 drops on it ....

watch the tape its there make your own determination

McDonald can be a great weapon he just is not a reliable one so he may win you a game with a great catch and run but he also may lose you some games with key drive killing dropped passes

Still much better that James(not even close)and the steelers give almost nothing for him.

Also, McDonald a threat of big play and yards after the catch.James will never be good at it.

[Mojouw]

if you bother to watch that tape you will find there is a shitload more than 3 or 4 drops on it ....

watch the tape its there make your own determination

McDonald can be a great weapon he just is not a reliable one so he may win you a game with a great catch and run but he also may lose you some games with key drive killing dropped passes

So you disagree with the pass by pass breakdown that is provided along with accompanying video. Gee, its almost like with the chart and everything you could point to specific plays you took issue with.

Or you could just talk trash to PB all night.

FWIW, I agree McDonald is what he is at this point as an NFL player. Solidly in the slightly above average category as a TE.

Again, for basically nothing -- heck of a trade. Does it solve any issues at the position group long term? Of course not. But the Pittsburgh Steelers TE group is more of an NFL level of competency than it was 12 hours ago.

What are we still talking about?

[Dwinsgames]

watch it ... if they do not jump out at you not sure what to tell you but way more than 3 drops here


https://streamable.com/nbamw

[Mojouw]

I got 5 legit drops. 2 a defender knocks it away. 2 that maybe in a perfect world a better athlete reaches back and gets.

I mean that's no worse than anyone else on the roster.

[polamalubeast]

watch it ... if they do not jump out at you not sure what to tell you but way more than 3 drops here


https://streamable.com/nbamw


I counted 4

When the pass is not accurate (like behind) or that McDonald is very well cover, I do not count it as a drop.

- - - Updated - - -


I got 5 legit drops. 2 a defender knocks it away. 2 that maybe in a perfect world a better athlete reaches back and gets.

I mean that's no worse than anyone else on the roster.

In fact this is better.

[Shoes]

watch it ... if they do not jump out at you not sure what to tell you but way more than 3 drops here


https://streamable.com/nbamw

Here's proof why no-one wants Kap! :lol:

[Mojouw]

Here's proof why no-one want Kap! :lol:

For reals. Some of those throws were just wrong.

[st33lersguy]

I counted 3 drops, and three were in the area but wide and would have been tough catches

[polamalubeast]

After the lowlight,now the highlights....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxSGF29odwE

[Shoes]

No question he's an upgrade over the three stooges we now have, so that is a good thing. Seems like a high character kid too, always a plus.

[Psycho Ward 86]

outstanding trade. looks like one of Belicheat's classic trades where he gives up little to nothing for a little known commodity and makes him blow up. Lets be real, the 49ers are going to be bottom feeders and the steelers are going to be near the top, meaning the 4th round pick we gave up will be a late 4th rounder and the 5th round pick we gain will be an early 5th rounder. We essentially moved back a few spots to acquire Vance. And yes, that contract looks alarming, but its a very easy contract for us to get out of if we need to. And this is the kind of tight end we've been looking for all along. I was pissed that we didnt get it done during the draft, especially moments like drafting Dobbs when George Kittle was on the board, but im really happy with this one. Super low risk, super high potential reward

[BurghBoy412]

Will we see him Thursday night?

[teegre]

No question he's an upgrade over the three stooges we now have, so that is a good thing. Seems like a high character kid too, always a plus.

Back in 2013, over at Steelers Fever, a lot of people were high on Vance.

So... he's got that going for him.

[86WARD]

Lots of folks thought James, Johnson, Grimble were enough, clearly that wasn't the case.

Well at least McDonald is better than the three we have, but then again Kittle pushed McDonald out the door, you can see why. Blocks like a OT, runs a 4.5 forty, great hands and can do this after the catch, all in a R4 package if we would have taken him.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-m-RHsCkJMY

Not totally true. There's new management in San Francisco as well that want "their players" there and as usual, they clean house on players that make "too much" or don't fit their schemes. Maybe they thought Kittle was better than McDonald, but not the sole reason they "pushed him out the door".

[Shoes]

Not totally true. There's new management in San Francisco as well that want "their players" there and as usual, they clean house on players that make "too much" or don't fit their schemes. Maybe they thought Kittle was better than McDonald, but not the sole reason they "pushed him out the door".

I can agree with that, they got a younger, better player at a cheaper price, see ya later Vance.

[tube517]

Here's proof why no-one wants Kap! :lol:

Horrible! :chuckle:

[SteelMayhem72]

I do not like the move at all , dude has less than 1000 yards receiving in his career( 4 years ) and Gary Barnage sits there with more yards in a single season and costs you nothing in terms of draft picks ...Look who his quarterback was. Dude has averaged over 14 yards per catch so that tells me he turns it up field. Plus he is huge and could easily be a mismatch. Ben is probably salivating.

Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk

[BlackAndGold]

If Barnidge was worth a contract he would have one by now.

He had 1 great year, and padded his stats against soft prevent defense because the Browns suck.

[polamalubeast]

902717640770293760

[Iron Steeler]

james route running is horrible... Vance definately has him beat there

[BlackAndGold]

http://www.steelers.com/videos/videos/Around_the_Locker_Room_at_Panthers/f2c163e1-163e-4228-94a0-2acda4db9968

After the game against Carolina, Vance was asked if the Steelers told him what role will he fill, he replied saying "we're going to win a championship (that's all I heard)"

:tt02: