Current Coaches You would Rather Have than Tomlin

[Craic]

A great point was made in the Fire Tomlin thread talking about whether Tomlin is a "Great" coach. The point wasn't about his greatness, but rather, how good is he compared to other coaches today? So, I ask you all, if you got to fire Tomlin and pick head coach from any NFL team and plop them into Pittsburgh, which ones, if any, would you choose? Or, would you rather stay with Tomlin?

Personally, I'd stay with Tomlin. I remain unconvinced that Belichick can win the big game without cheating. Pete Carroll has done a good job in Seattle, but he's done a good job with the opportunity to draft players he coached against in college. I'm not yet willing to make the jump for him. Honestly, there's no one else I can think of that I'd rather have.

[86WARD]

Isn't there a thread for this already?

[GoSlash27]

I'd rather stay with Tomlin. Not because I think he's the best coach in the league, but because the stability and continuity that comes with keeping a "good" coach *far* outweighs the damage and potential benefit of switching to a "better" one.

[JimHarbaugh'ssoakedtissue]

Pete Carrol but he is old as F and may retire soon and plus the horrible SB call. BB is the obvious answer but can't root for him so no Keep Mike.

[Count Steeler]

I think you have to ride Tomlin through this window with Ben. 2017 is going to be a pretty awesome year if bongs and injuries are held to a minimum.

Once Ben retires, we will truly see how Tomlin can coach. I'll even give Tomlin credit for bringing in Haley and Munchak. That has to be difficult to keep two former head coaches in line. They could easily try to rebel and destroy the locker room. Getting rid of Lebeau also took a lot of guts, but I like the fact that the defense is turning the corner with ROOKIES!!! These 3 guys would never have seen the field in years past. They would still be in teaching sessions trying to figure out the complicated Lebeau defense. Good on Butler and Tomlin.

[Butch]

Why do you limit it to those who are already HC's? The last 3 Steelers coaches were not HC's previous to them being selected as our HC. I would imagine the next guy who comes in when Tomlin leaves will not be one that has been or is a current HC rather some DC or OC who has a lot of potential. Just my 2 cents fwiw.

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I think you have to ride Tomlin through this window with Ben. 2017 is going to be a pretty awesome year if bongs and injuries are held to a minimum.

Once Ben retires, we will truly see how Tomlin can coach. I'll even give Tomlin credit for bringing in Haley and Munchak. That has to be difficult to keep two former head coaches in line. They could easily try to rebel and destroy the locker room. Getting rid of Lebeau also took a lot of guts, but I like the fact that the defense is turning the corner with ROOKIES!!! These 3 guys would never have seen the field in years past. They would still be in teaching sessions trying to figure out the complicated Lebeau defense. Good on Butler and Tomlin.

Well yeah but we all know that Haley was forced on him...LOL jk.

Over all I like this post

[Craic]

Why do you limit it to those who are already HC's? The last 3 Steelers coaches were not HC's previous to them being selected as our HC. I would imagine the next guy who comes in when Tomlin leaves will not be one that has been or is a current HC rather some DC or OC who has a lot of potential. Just my 2 cents fwiw.


Sorry if I wasn't clear on that. I limited it because it's in the context of "Great Coaches" in the NFL. One way to ask that question is, who would you trade for that is currently coaching? Since the focus is on track record, rather that possibility, I limited it to coaches that not only are current HCs, but those who had a fair number of wins (well, that and the poll only allowed 20 entries!).

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Isn't there a thread for this already?

I don't think so . . . or at least, one that's asking this specific question, is there?

[st33lersguy]

Isn't there a thread for this already?

The Fire Tomlin thread addressed the issue at points but it doesn't deal with it specifically nor give a complete list of coaches with 26 wins or more

[zulater]

Honestly for this poll to be valid you'd have to add Bill Cowher and Jon Gruden. I get their not current, but both are still viable.

[Born2Steel]

Write in vote for Chuck Noll.

[The bell ringer]

I would keep Tomlin. However if you were to force my hand and absolutely get another Coach. I would want Ex-Steeler " Darren Perry " He was a vastly underrated player who was extremely smart...and still is. He was named a rookie starter from day 1...as well as our Defensive Captain. That's how much Cowher respected him. Perry has been in Green Bay as their Defensive backs Coach since 2009 I think. And I am really surprised that he has no been courted for a Head Coaching job...Cause he really knows his stuff.



So if I HAD to Name someone else...it would be Darren Perry!

[Mojouw]

I would keep Tomlin. However if you were to force my hand and absolutely get another Coach. I would want Ex-Steeler " Darren Perry " He was a vastly underrated player who was extremely smart...and still is. He was named a rookie starter from day 1...as well as our Defensive Captain. That's how much Cowher respected him. Perry has been in Green Bay as their Defensive backs Coach since 2009 I think. And I am really surprised that he has no been courted for a Head Coaching job...Cause he really knows his stuff.



So if I HAD to Name someone else...it would be Darren Perry!

Some of Green Bays young DBs have failed to launch. Remember Quinton Rollins?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[#CRASHFormation]

I voted for two, McCarthy and Kubiak simply because I'd like to see Ben and our WR's in their offenses.

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Perry's never been a DC, so that hurts him IMO. Interesting what happens if Capers gets fired or retire after the season.

[fansince'76]

Some of Green Bays young DBs have failed to launch. Remember Quinton Rollins?

True, but after QB, CB is probably the next hardest position to "get right" in the draft. Remember Darqueze Dennard and Kyle Fuller?

Guys like Marcus Peters are the exception, not the rule, it seems.

[polamalubeast]

I voted for two, McCarthy and Kubiak simply because I'd like to see Ben and our WR's in their offenses.



Sean Payton is a better offensive coach than Mike McCarthy and Kubiak.Kubiak is a great OC but as HC his offenses are often very average.

McCarthy, before the last 5 games, we saw that the packers offense was mediocre in the last 2 years even with Rodgers as QB.

The Saints have often had a very good offense, even if sometimes the WR / TE have been very average.The problem of the Saints in the last few years was their awful defense.

[tube517]

Kubiak can't control his lockerroom. I'd pass.

[DesertSteel]

Belichick and John Harbaugh. That puts Tomlin #3 on that list for me. Not too shabby for a cheerleader.

[st33lersguy]

I just decided stick with him, if it ain't broke don't fix it
There were only 3 coaches you could make an argument for over for over Tomlin
Bellichick: 4 Super Bowls, always can get the best out of players
Carroll: Consistently taking team to the playoffs, gets the best out of players
McCarthy: Annual playoff coach which is hard to do

Notable coaches I can't make an argument for
Harbaugh: Up to 2014 you could make an argument for Harbaugh over Tomlin, but given that he has missed the playoffs 3 of 4 times since the departures of Ray Lewis and Ed Reed, that argument has greatly weakened.

Andy Reid: Annual playoff choker, no Super Bowl wins into his 18th season

Sean Payton: Has done a poor job of replenishing the 09 Super Bowl team. Needs a win over the Falcons just to avoid a 4th losing season in 5 years

[Mojouw]

True, but after QB, CB is probably the next hardest position to "get right" in the draft. Remember Darqueze Dennard and Kyle Fuller?

Guys like Marcus Peters are the exception, not the rule, it seems.

Yeah. You got me there. I'm just not sure that Perry (assuming he is even still the coach up there) has done much to get excited about. The Pack drafts young well regarded DB's every year and the last couple of seasons they have had some troubles with some of the youngsters not being ready for prime-time.

[Mojouw]

Living in the great white north that is Wisconsin, I talk about the Pack with their fans alot. None of them like McCarthy any more. He has yo-yo'd on play-calling duties. Forgets about the running game for stretches of entire seasons. Offense is predicated on going deep to Nelson and whoever is currently manning the #2 WR spot. Was late committing to Montgomery as the replacement for Lacy this year. Once he finally did, the offense took off again. Gets obsessed with "gadget" plays for Cobb, etc. On the other side of the ball, well....long story short Capers is getting the same fire leveled at him that Lebeau/Butler get. Their GM gets roasted for not spending any money on FA's and insisting on a "draft and develop" approach. Fans argue that no one actually develops.

Sound familiar? At best McCarthy is a "push" with Tomlin. At worst, he is a cut below. So no "win" for making that move.

Carrol - he built a team on drafting under-rated guys he knew from college games and recruiting that would fit his system. Now that built-in advantage is gone and the team has returned to the pack a bit. Closest I see to Tomlin across the league for getting total buy-in from his entire roster. Seattle never quits and even the 3rd string guys seem ready. I would say he is an upgrade, but not a Lombardi clinching one. Would consider it but not sure what I would decide in a Carrol for Tomlin scenario.

Harbaugh - either one. Nope. Everyone says that Tomlin doesn't "do" anything. Okay. Fair enough. It's his coordinators and position coaches. What doe either of the Harbaugh boys really do? I've never seen anything from either of their teams that is really all that innovative. Fundamentally sound and high percentage? Certainly. Innovative and strategically revolutionary? Nope. One of the brothers had a team quit on him. I know it was the ownership...blah...blah...blah. He left because he either had already lost or was in the process of losing the locker room. The news reports from the local writers seem to back that theory up. The other one has never really coached a team through adversity all that well. Why are the Ravens with the #1 defense in football out of the playoffs this year? Why did they fold under the weight of the injuries up and down their roster last year...etc.

Reid - great offensive mind and maximizes his QB talent. If you don't mind the same "safe" approach over and over again. Everyone is talking about KC this year because after almost 2 decades as a coach, Reid is finally opening up his offense and letting his position players run wild. Well, at least after 18 or so seasons of being a modern day Schottenhiemer (gets to the playoffs and meekly exits) he finally tried something else. Wonder how long it would take fans in Pittsburgh to call him arrogant?

Honestly, I got Belichick and Carrol as the only two I would think about. I know. I know - cheating right? Regardless, dude is the evil emperor of the NFL right now. The current Steelers roster might be as talented or more so than the majority of rosters he has had to work with in NE. I shudder to think what he could do with it.

Am I saying that Tomlin is the 3rd best coach going right now? Not really. Just that it is hard for me to make a cut and dried case that most NFL coaches are really that much better than Tomlin that swapping them out would really lead to a significantly improved outcome.

[#CRASHFormation]

Jim Harbaugh's an offensive mind. Alex Smith and Kap really played well for him in his system.

John's a dupe. No one likes him, and he really adds nothing.

[zulater]

Not a great time in league history for overall coaching strength! :lol:

[The bell ringer]

I just decided stick with him, if it ain't broke don't fix it
There were only 3 coaches you could make an argument for over for over Tomlin
Bellichick: 4 Super Bowls, always can get the best out of players
Carroll: Consistently taking team to the playoffs, gets the best out of players
McCarthy: Annual playoff coach which is hard to do

Notable coaches I can't make an argument for
Harbaugh: Up to 2014 you could make an argument for Harbaugh over Tomlin, but given that he has missed the playoffs 3 of 4 times since the departures of Ray Lewis and Ed Reed, that argument has greatly weakened.

Andy Reid: Annual playoff choker, no Super Bowl wins into his 18th season

Sean Payton: Has done a poor job of replenishing the 09 Super Bowl team. Needs a win over the Falcons just to avoid a 4th losing season in 5 years




I think Payton gets more credit AND Blame then he deserves. The Saints 2009 SB team won because they were lucky as hell to face similar teams that they were. I mean the win against Minnesota was because Favre had like 4 or 5 TO's. And then they faced and beat Indy with Manning...not a good defense either.




The Saints offense has been as prolific as ever..and that is not because of Sean Payton. That is because of 1....Drew Brees, and 2...the OC who was brought over from the Chargers along with Brees, and that was Pete Carmichael. It has been Carmichael who has done his job, he is great at making the QB his very best. And as a Offensive creator..he is unmatched. He is also someone I am surprised has not gotten a Head Coaching gig somewhere. But it is their GM/President who has screwed up with BAD Defensive signings, and draft picks that have ruined them. But Offensively..they are more then what they were in 2009. It's just their Defense, which was above average in 2009 has sunk badly. Not really Payton's fault. Rather their GM's fault.

[zulater]

If you want a stat that strongly suggests Tomlin is an elite coach of this era consider this. In the 2nd half of the last 4 seasons Tomlins Steelers record going into this Sunday's game is 24-7! I've always been led to believe the mark of a well coached team is one that improves as the season goes on.

[steel striker]

I'll stick with Tomlin and, let's see how things go from here. Look therer have been times where I have lost my mind like losing games to teams that that steelers should have beat. Also some of the play calling that has handcuffed this offense at times but, like FS76 said lets stay away from the double reverses. Let Ben run the offense and, there are not many teams that can hang when the steelers are firing on all cylinders.

[fansince'76]

IMO, the Saints simply never recovered from Bountygate.

[polamalubeast]

If you want a stat that strongly suggests Tomlin is an elite coach of this era consider this. In the 2nd half of the last 4 seasons Tomlins Steelers record going into this Sunday's game is 24-7! I've always been led to believe the mark of a well coached team is one that improves as the season goes on.


Very good, but I hope that in the next few years, the steelers will be better in the first half of the season.They are 15-17 in the first half of the season since 2013.

Before the steelers were always 6-2 or 6-3 in the first half of the season with Tomlin.

[#CRASHFormation]

Or Brees contract gate.

[The bell ringer]

IMO, the Saints simply never recovered from Bountygate.



No. That wasn't a factor at all. I mean after that 7-9 season without Payton...they were 11-5. Nope. To me they never recovered after giving the MILLIONS they did to " Keenan Lewis "..as well as a few others. THAT was the nail in the coffin.

[polamalubeast]

The Saints have been very incompetent for managing the salary cap in recent years, which is one of the reasons why the saints have several losing records in recent years....Their defense has also been the league's worst in the last three years.

[The bell ringer]

The Saints have been very incompetent for managing the salary cap in recent years, which is one of the reasons why the saints have several losing records in recent years....Their defense has also been the league's worst in the last three years.



Their Defense has bever been last in the last 3 seasons.

[teegre]

Belichick is a genius. Hate him all you want, but it's true. But, I have morals, and thus, I wouldn't want him as my team's coach. Yes, we'd likely have an extra ring or two, but at what cost? Those rings would be tainted and legitimately questioned by everyone outside of Pittsburgh.

Same goes for the Harbaughs. I think that they are superb coaches, but I would be embarrassed to see my team's coach crying like a baby on the sidelines.

To me, it's Tomlin.

Some might want a Noll or Parcells type of "authoritarian" coach, but in today's "me first" NFL, Tomlin is the perfect coach. His players don't quit or talk bad about him... even in the midst of adversity. Carroll is like him in that sense, and Carroll also constructed the 2001-2004 Taperiots roster (yep, Belichick won with "Carroll's players")... but, I think replacing Tomlin with Carroll would simply be a lateral move.

[polamalubeast]

I still think that John Harbaugh is a very good coach even if the ravens have miss the playoffs 3 times in the last 4 years.The ravens have 10 playoffs win since 2008 and this is with Flacco as QB, this is very impressive.We will see how Harbaugh will bounce back from the fact that the ravens have missed the playoffs 3 times since 2013.

Tomlin has already missed the playoffs 2 times in a row in 2012 and 2013 but since the steelers have made the playoffs 3 times in a row since 2014, so let's see how the ravens will bounce back from that.

[GBMelBlount]

I think you have to ride Tomlin through this window with Ben. 2017 is going to be a pretty awesome year if bongs and injuries are held to a minimum.

Once Ben retires, we will truly see how Tomlin can coach. I'll even give Tomlin credit for bringing in Haley and Munchak. That has to be difficult to keep two former head coaches in line. They could easily try to rebel and destroy the locker room. Getting rid of Lebeau also took a lot of guts, but I like the fact that the defense is turning the corner with ROOKIES!!! These 3 guys would never have seen the field in years past. They would still be in teaching sessions trying to figure out the complicated Lebeau defense. Good on Butler and Tomlin.

Good post and I agree with most of it.

I don't think Tomlin is the best but I think he is good and improving.

It would be interesting to see if his record and ranking would be any different if he did not have an elite QB his entire tenure.

Here is one ranking of coaches from earlier this year.



6. Tomlin might not be as hands-on when it comes the X’s and O’s as some other coaches on this list, but his players always play hard for him. And he’s done a good job handling his assistants. When he was given the job, Tomlin was smart enough to leave Dick LeBeau in charge of the defense instead of installing his own scheme. And the unpopular hire of Todd Haley has turned out to be a brilliant move.

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2016/05/nfl-head-coach-rankings-bill-belichick

[Craic]

I still think that John Harbaugh is a very good coach even if the ravens have miss the playoffs 3 times in the last 4 years.The ravens have 10 playoffs win since 2008 and this is with Flacco as QB, this is very impressive.We will see how Harbaugh will bounce back from the fact that the ravens have missed the playoffs 3 times since 2013.

Tomlin has already missed the playoffs 2 times in a row in 2012 and 2013 but since the steelers have made the playoffs 3 times in a row since 2014, so let's see how the ravens will bounce back from that.

Another thing to add to that is the Steelers were in contention right up to the last week both years. Beyond that, they were in a rebuilding mode while contending with cap issues purposefully created to extend the SB window of the 2006-10 core team. I think it gets lost just how impressive it is to not have a losing season while rebuilding AND digging out from under the cap.

It's something Bill Cowher couldn't do, and he wasn't even contending with cap issues in the same way (although Cowher had to deal with FA, but then again, so does every coach since). Am I saying Tomlin is better than Cowher? No. Just showing how Tomlin has achieved something that is actually pretty impressive as a head coach.

[#CRASHFormation]

Tomlin has already missed the playoffs 2 times in a row in 2012 and 2013 but since the steelers have made the playoffs 3 times in a row since 2014, so let's see how the ravens will bounce back from that.

See what happens when owners meddle?

Ben had 10 playoff wins in 8 years and was told to change.

You also have to take into account that Flacco played a lot of WC weekend football.

Ben's team had three bye weeks in 6 playoff years after 8 seasons.

I think the Ravens are ready for the rebuild. They aren't THAT good.

[polamalubeast]

Another thing to add to that is the Steelers were in contention right up to the last week both years. Beyond that, they were in a rebuilding mode while contending with cap issues purposefully created to extend the SB window of the 2006-10 core team. I think it gets lost just how impressive it is to not have a losing season while rebuilding AND digging out from under the cap.


The ravens are in a period like that right now too....They almost made the playoffs in 2013 and 2016 and in 2015 they were unlucky with injuries and several close games that the ravens have lost.(9 of their 11 losses were very close)

[86WARD]

Their Defense has bever been last in the last 3 seasons.

Wrong. The Saints defense was the worst last year when you take everything into account. Unless you want to just look at some yardage numbers and not take anything else into account. Lol. Then they were 31.

Ranked 31st in total yards allowed 31st against the pass, 31st against the run, last in points allowed. Allowed a 116.2 quarterback rating. No player recorded over 5 sacks other than Jordan.

They were the worst defense in the league.

[Mojouw]

Right meddlesome owners. Not the retirement or drastic decline of multiple HOF caliber players from one of the best defenses ever assembled. That couldn't be it. No way. I bet Tomlin was on the sidelines shaking his fist at the Rooneys like a Scooby Do villian.

"I'd have 4 Lombardis if not for you meddlesome old Irish dudes!"

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClaDQG-WgAA30iP.jpg

[#CRASHFormation]

Right meddlesome owners. Not the retirement or drastic decline of multiple HOF caliber players from one of the best defenses ever assembled. That couldn't be it. No way. I bet Tomlin was on the sidelines shaking his fist at the Rooneys like a Scooby Do villian.

"I'd have 4 Lombardis if not for you meddlesome old Irish dudes!"

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClaDQG-WgAA30iP.jpg

Um, those alleged multiple HOF caliber players blew 10 fourth quarter leads in an 18 game stretch from XLIII/opening week 2010.

I guess they were in drastic decline then too.

They also blew three 4th quarter leads in the opening six games of 2005. Ben saved them twice. He does it only once? No playoffs.

I guess they were in drastic decline then too.


"I'd have 4 Lombardis if not for you meddlesome old Irish dudes!"

Art II has never won a Super Bowl as an owner of this team.

[polamalubeast]

Um, those alleged multiple HOF caliber players blew 10 fourth quarter leads in an 18 game stretch from XLIII/opening week 2010.

Without Polamalu in many of his games....

Yes I know for the super bowl 43, but the steelers had been too conservative with the lead and the o-line was atrocious in the 4th quarter before the last drive.It was not the fault only on defense in this game.Kurt Warner and Larry Fitzgerald was hard to stop in the 2008 playoffs too.

[Mojouw]

Yeah. That same defense never won any games basically single-handedly in that same time period either.

You are cherry picking worse than a young Jaromir Jagr.

[polamalubeast]

Yeah. That same defense never won any games basically single-handedly in that same time period either.

You are cherry picking worse than a young Jaromir Jagr.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvAbSSaoptk

[Mojouw]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvAbSSaoptk

That was the exact game I was thinking of!

[st33lersguy]

Um, those alleged multiple HOF caliber players blew 10 fourth quarter leads in an 18 game stretch from XLIII/opening week 2010.

I guess they were in drastic decline then too.

They also blew three 4th quarter leads in the opening six games of 2005. Ben saved them twice. He does it only once? No playoffs.

I guess they were in drastic decline then too.



Art II has never won a Super Bowl as an owner of this team.


[/I][/COLOR]

First 6 games of 05, the Steelers surrendered an average of 15.66 points per game. Also 2009 was the only Steelers defense from 2004-2012 that surrendered more than 20 points per game in a season, they surrendered 20.25 points per game. Meanwhile 6 steeler defenses surrendered less than 17 points per game in that time period, all of them finished top 5 scoring defense, and 4 of them finished no. 1 in scoring defense, but hey let's use 24 games over a 9 period stretch to bring down the defense and make my argument sound better

[#CRASHFormation]

Without Polamalu in many of his games....

So what? No one gave a rats ass when the offense had injuries. It was that damn Bruce Arians catering to Ben. The winning didn't matter.


First 6 games of 05, the Steelers surrendered an average of 15.66 points per game.

And still managed to blow three 4th quarter leads even with the offense gobbling clock.


Meanwhile 6 steeler defenses surrendered less than 17 points per game in that time period, all of them finished top 5 scoring defense, and 4 finished no. 1 in scoring defense, but hey let's use 24 games over a 9 period stretch to bring down the defense and make my argument sound better

Dick LeBeau's 4th quarter defense has sucked ass in big moments his entire coaching career.

To deny that would be silly.

[st33lersguy]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvAbSSaoptk


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zcAhSJZFBB4

Sealed a trip to the Super Bowl




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AR-Try6GAw0

Steelers enter 2nd half of the game down 21-7, three consecutive turnovers forced deep in Baltimore territory help them take 24-21 lead early in 4th quarter, Steelers win 31-24

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[/COLOR]Dick LeBeau's 4th quarter defense has sucked ass in big moments his entire coaching career.

To deny that would be silly.

Versus how many times did they step up in big moments?

[#CRASHFormation]

Versus how many times did they step up in big moments?

Joe Montana.

Tim Tebow

David Gerard

Aaron Rodgers

The bad opening 15 minutes of the 2006 playoffs.

15 fourth quarter points in Indy the next week.


If the #Steelers didn't draft Ben LeBeau is ringless and is known for pissing a SB with Cincy.

[ALLD]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyRSV9eqTUY

[Psycho Ward 86]

I would take Belichick if having him wouldnt stain our reputation horribly. Harbaugh is the only other coach i checked off. in summation, i think were fortunate to have one of the top coaches in the league, but he could still be a lot better.

^why this will inevitably be considered an unfair assessment by so many is beyond me. Tomlin isnt god, calm down.

[teegre]

I would take Belichick if having him wouldnt stain our reputation horribly. Harbaugh is the only other coach i checked off. in summation, i think were fortunate to have one of the top coaches in the league, but he could still be a lot better.

^why this will inevitably be considered an unfair assessment by so many is beyond me. Tomlin isnt god, calm down.

This is an excellent post...

...and, not just because my opinion is similar. :wink02:

[#CRASHFormation]

What's Belichick ever won without cheating?

Jack fucking shit, that's what.

[Psycho Ward 86]

What's Belichick ever won without cheating?

Jack fucking shit, that's what.

a couple superbowls as a defensive coach for the giants?

[#CRASHFormation]

a couple superbowls as a defensive coach for the giants?

As an assistant.

Couldn't cheat in Cleveland.

[teegre]

Local San Diego radio was talking about replacing Mike McCoy... some stuff was stated which is relevant to this topic.

First, they were talking the pros and cons of Jim Harbaugh. They admitted that his tirades were awful, so much so that Jabrill Peppers doesn't want to play in tonight's bowl game (they claim that the injury is a convenient excuse). That said, one of the talking heads averred that he'd still be willing to live with the tirades, because the Chargers would win immediately.

He also said (here's the part that poignant): "We're not the Steelers who have a tradition of winning, where we can be picky about who our coach is... I want to win now, at ANY expense. If that means having an a$$hole as a coach, so be it."

[#CRASHFormation]

Rivers can't operate his offense.

Luck can. Which is where I think Harbaugh ends up.

[Psycho Ward 86]

As an assistant.

Couldn't cheat in Cleveland.

he was the defensive coordinator for those superbowl wins and the main reason the giants were good in the 80's...

[#CRASHFormation]

Yeah and if Andre Reed could catch the Bills crush the Giants.

Denver was weak in 1986, they had no business being in that game.

[fansince'76]

IMO, Lawrence Taylor was the reason those Giants teams were so good. They had a number of good players, particularly
on defense, but he put them over the top. Completely changed the way the LB position was played. Another example of a great player that was so great he was simply on another level that Craic was talking about. Hell, he won NFL MVP as a DEFENSIVE player.

[The bell ringer]

IMO, Lawrence Taylor was the reason those Giants teams were so good. Completely changed the way the LB position was played. Another example of a great player that was so great he was simply on another level that Craic was talking about.



Of course he was on another level..he was " Coked-up " practically every game. This is not a joke, he was. One of my good friends played on those Giant teams...and he had no problem telling me all the inside scoop on his teammates.

[#CRASHFormation]

Fucking rat. Keep in the locker room.

[fansince'76]

Of course he was on another level..he was " Coked-up " practically every game. This is not a joke, he was. One of my good friends played on those Giant teams...and he had no problem telling me all the inside scoop on his teammates.

Most of the league was coked up back in the day, so that doesn't really explain his dominance.

[The bell ringer]

Most of the league was coked up back in the day, so that doesn't really explain his dominance.




I can tell you right now that you are wrong. Sure some others used it. But Tayler used it before the game and at Halftime. And Parcells knew it..but did not care as long as Taylor did what he did. My friend said that almost every Giant player on the defense hated Taylor. He was a bloviated A-Hole who thought the world revolved around him. And those were the words of the Ex-Giant who played with him.

[fansince'76]

Yeah, OK, whatever...

[#CRASHFormation]

If not coke they used pills, LOTS of pills.

[Method28]

Lets give Jarvis Jones some coke!

Sent from my SM-N920P using Tapatalk

[#CRASHFormation]

I'll be honest I was shocked Jarvis has fallen this far. I thought he made plays when he was in there, but inactive against the Ravens for the Division? Wow!