Artie Burns VS. the Dallas trade

[teegre]

For those of you who hate the Artie Burns pick... buckle in.

Reportedly, right after Pittsburgh turned in their draft card for Artie Burns, Dallas offered them the #34 and a R1 pick in 2017.

Supposedly, Pittsburgh tried to get the card back (they accepted the trade), but the NFL would not let them: "Once a pick is in, it is in."

Enjoy. :doh:

[Psycho Ward 86]

Wow. just wow. Artie, you better turn out to be something else

[Count Steeler]

Who did Dallas want?

[hawaiiansteeler]

Who did Dallas want?

Paxton Lynch

[polamalubeast]

Who did Dallas want?


Paxton Lynch I think....But I don't believe than the cowboys offer the 2017 first round pick to the steelers....

[hawaiiansteeler]

For those of you who hate the Artie Burns pick... buckle in.

Reportedly, right after Pittsburgh turned in their draft card for Artie Burns, Dallas offered them the #34 and a R1 pick in 2017.

Supposedly, Pittsburgh tried to get the card back (they accepted the trade), but the NFL would not let them: "Once a pick is in, it is in."

Enjoy. :doh:

maybe this is a lesson learned for the Steelers that you don't have to run to the podium to make your pick right away. I'll bet in the future they take their full allowed time...

[steelreserve]

Yup ... I'm lacing up my dog-kicking boots again.

[Devilsdancefloor]

I have the feels for the young man I think he is gonna be special!

[Mojouw]

First, let's say that was the offer and Jerry Jones is crazy enough to make it.

Second, look at what happened AFTER the Steelers took Burns - Seahawks AND Chiefs trade out. Burns was going to either of those places. Not Alexander, Not Howard - Artie Burns.

Third - We are left with evaluating whether or not this (Burns) is better than that (Alexander or Howard + 1st round 2017).

Dear me, I usually try and see the logic in stuff, but I not sure I can contort myself around this one. I do think Burns is better than Howard. But is he enough better than Alexander to off-set the 1st round pick? Based on how many teams passed on Alexander, maybe? But damn - that is a story.

[hawaiiansteeler]

I do think Burns is better than Howard. But is he enough better than Alexander to off-set the 1st round pick? Based on how many teams passed on Alexander, maybe? But damn - that is a story.

the reason for Alexander's fall was he reportedly came across as being cocky and arrogant and did not take well to coaching.

who knows, the Steelers may very well have had him off their board...

[Cyphon25]

First, let's say that was the offer and Jerry Jones is crazy enough to make it.

Second, look at what happened AFTER the Steelers took Burns - Seahawks AND Chiefs trade out. Burns was going to either of those places. Not Alexander, Not Howard - Artie Burns.

Third - We are left with evaluating whether or not this (Burns) is better than that (Alexander or Howard + 1st round 2017).

Dear me, I usually try and see the logic in stuff, but I not sure I can contort myself around this one. I do think Burns is better than Howard. But is he enough better than Alexander to off-set the 1st round pick? Based on how many teams passed on Alexander, maybe? But damn - that is a story.

Not that I disagree with anything, but it didn't really have to be CB or bust. Could have gotten Spence, Jack, Dodd etc....

[Mojouw]

Not that I disagree with anything, but it didn't really have to be CB or bust. Could have gotten Spence, Jack, Dodd etc....

Good point. But going with the theory that the Steelers were "all in" on CB early in this draft. After Burns you can still get talented players, but they are very different "types" of DBs.

I don't know, if it was any other team than Dallas, I would dismiss it.

Also, the part of this story that is the most terrifying to me is not that they didn't get to pull this trade off, but that NO ONE on the Steelers draft day operation knew that once the card was in - that is it. Even I know that.

[teegre]

maybe this is a lesson learned for the Steelers that you don't have to run to the podium to make your pick right away. I'll bet in the future they take their full allowed time...

My thoguhts for years.

Even if you know... wait to see if a team offers you a Herschel Walker/Ricky Williams type of deal.

[pczach]

maybe this is a lesson learned for the Steelers that you don't have to run to the podium to make your pick right away. I'll bet in the future they take their full allowed time...


I made the comment in the draft thread that I couldn't believe they ran up there that fast. Take all the time necessary and wait to see what offers come in. There were teams looking to move up to draft quarterbacks and receivers, and everyone knew it.

It just doesn't make any sense to run up there and not have a team offer you a ton for your pick, or make you an offer you can't refuse.

It just seemed strange and some of us commented on it as it was happening. You were there, you know.

[Psycho Ward 86]

First, let's say that was the offer and Jerry Jones is crazy enough to make it.

Second, look at what happened AFTER the Steelers took Burns - Seahawks AND Chiefs trade out. Burns was going to either of those places. Not Alexander, Not Howard - Artie Burns.

Third - We are left with evaluating whether or not this (Burns) is better than that (Alexander or Howard + 1st round 2017).

Dear me, I usually try and see the logic in stuff, but I not sure I can contort myself around this one. I do think Burns is better than Howard. But is he enough better than Alexander to off-set the 1st round pick? Based on how many teams passed on Alexander, maybe? But damn - that is a story.

Alexander is the comparison that definitely worries me. Even though he basically has little to no experience in zone coverage, neither does Artie Burns. And we already know Alexander is insanely good in man coverage compared to Artie who has some inconsistencies. And its not like theres an age gap either. Alexander is pretty young too (22)

[teegre]

look at what happened AFTER the Steelers took Burns - Seahawks AND Chiefs trade out. Burns was going to either of those places.

This is what makes me feel good about the Burns pick: both of those teams know how to pick CBs.

[steelreserve]

Knowing that Dallas' success next year depends largely on whether the NFL equivalent of Glass Joe can stay healthy, I'd say there's a 50-50 chance that would have been a top-10, maybe even a top-five pick.

Think of the kind of player we could get with that. Maybe Ben's real successor. Maybe next year's equivalent of Jalen Ramsey. Maybe two first-round position players if we traded out of it. Plus at R2/#4, a cornerback not much worse than Burns at R2/#4. Maybe even better than Burns.

I really want to like this kid, but MAN, this really is shaping up a bit too perfectly to be one of those "look at what they passed up" situations that is talked about for years. If I was Colbert and I get this offer while my guy is running up to the podium to turn in the draft card, I shoot him right in the back.

[sactownsteeler]

I'm calling BS on this otherwise they would've gotten him over Denvers deal so it makes zero sense.

[teegre]

I'm calling BS on this otherwise they would've gotten him over Denvers deal so it makes zero sense.

Denver's deal was only a R3 pick.

Dallas' offer was substantially larger.

[fansince'76]

Not to impugn teegre here, but where is this coming from? For all anybody knows, this could be just another "draft day trade" tall tale from Jim Wexell (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/16/dan-snyder-says-steelers-planned-to-move-up-to-16/).

That one went national with Peter King and then PFT before Wexell (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/16/jim-wexell-still-has-some-explaining-to-do/)basically said "my bad" and deleted the tweet (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/16/jim-wexell-still-has-some-explaining-to-do/).

Just sayin'...

[zulater]

Hey, no matter what, at least we didn't trade up to draft a kicker in the second round! :pointlaugh:

[RunNGun]

For those of you who hate the Artie Burns pick... buckle in.

Reportedly, right after Pittsburgh turned in their draft card for Artie Burns, Dallas offered them the #34 and a R1 pick in 2017.

Supposedly, Pittsburgh tried to get the card back (they accepted the trade), but the NFL would not let them: "Once a pick is in, it is in."

Enjoy. :doh:

If they were open to a trade it makes you wonder why they made the pick so quickly. Doesn't make a lot of sense.

[sactownsteeler]

Denver's deal was only a R3 pick.

Dallas' offer was substantially larger.
that is my point... Seattle would've taken that deal from Dalla over Denver so I'm sure it was same offer to us as it was to them

[Born2Steel]

One thing I know for sure. If the trade had been made with ALL the names still on the board at 25, there would have been some fans jumping out windows before the next pick was even announced. Today fans would be yelling that we would have taken somebody that will change the world, but instead traded back and got a wasted pick or 2. Check back in 3 years and see if we should have made the trade.

[SteelerFanInStl]

Not to impugn teegre here, but where is this coming from? For all anybody knows, this could be just another "draft day trade" tall tale from Jim Wexell (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/16/dan-snyder-says-steelers-planned-to-move-up-to-16/).

That one went national with Peter King and then PFT before Wexell (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/16/jim-wexell-still-has-some-explaining-to-do/)basically said "my bad" and deleted the tweet (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/16/jim-wexell-still-has-some-explaining-to-do/).

Just sayin'...

Pretty much how I feel about it.

[teegre]

Not to impugn teegre here, but where is this coming from? For all anybody knows, this could be just another "draft day trade" tall tale from Jim Wexell (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/16/dan-snyder-says-steelers-planned-to-move-up-to-16/).

That one went national with Peter King and then PFT before Wexell (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/16/jim-wexell-still-has-some-explaining-to-do/)basically said "my bad" and deleted the tweet (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/16/jim-wexell-still-has-some-explaining-to-do/).

Just sayin'...

Radio

I probably should have taken it with a grain of salt...



that is my point... Seattle would've taken that deal from Dalla over Denver so I'm sure it was same offer to us as it was to them

Good point.

That said, I've heard tales of teams offering one team more than they off to another team. For example, if a team wanted a corner, and that corner went right before they picked, they'd be more willing (take less) to trade back... than the team who has the opportunity to take that corner.

[teegre]

If they were open to a trade it makes you wonder why they made the pick so quickly. Doesn't make a lot of sense.

Maybe Dallas didn't offer the R1 pick until after it was too late.

In the 1985 draft, the Niners wouldn't give up a R3 pick to move up... until it was too late. (They didn't trade up... and settled for Jerry Rice.)

ONE OTHER THING...
The difference between 31 and 34 is the fifth-year option. First round picks get that fifth year.

But, acquiring a R1 pick would sway many teams to trade out of the first round.

[teegre]

Like I said...

I probably should have taken it with a grain of salt.

(But, it still makes sense, IMO.)

[hawaiiansteeler]

2016 NFL Draft rumors: Buffalo Bills, Dallas Cowboys talked Round 1 trade

By Brian Galliford on Apr 29, 2016

Had the Cowboys been willing to part ways with a future Round 1 pick, last night might have looked very different for Buffalo

Before they selected Clemson defensive end Shaq Lawson with the No. 19 overall pick in the 2016 NFL Draft last night, the Buffalo Bills were on the phone with the Dallas Cowboys, attempting to trade down for a big haul.

Tim Graham of The Buffalo News reported the news late last night, after the first round had been completed. Buffalo had an offer on the table from the Cowboys, but they did not believe that Dallas was offering enough.

The Bills weren't the only team that Dallas called, either. ESPN's Todd Archer reported that the Cowboys offered Seattle second- and third-round picks to move up to No. 26 overall with Lynch still on the board, but that their offer was beaten out by Denver, who ended up selecting Lynch at that spot.

What stopped the Bills from trading down from No. 19 to No. 34, and moving out of the first round entirely? According to Graham, it was the Cowboys' unwillingness to part ways with their 2017 first-round pick to seal the deal.

http://www.buffalorumblings.com/buffalo-bills-news/2016/4/29/11535318/2016-nfl-draft-rumors-buffalo-bills-dallas-cowboys-trade-paxton-lynch

[Mojouw]

All the moving parts don't make sense to this. It is predicated on either or both of two things being true - Dallas or Pittsburgh's front offices are dumb and bad with time.

Not sure I buy it. Still a cool debate. Not like there will be anything substantial to talk about for 4 more months.

[Texasteel]

Not to impugn teegre here, but where is this coming from? For all anybody knows, this could be just another "draft day trade" tall tale from Jim Wexell (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/16/dan-snyder-says-steelers-planned-to-move-up-to-16/).

That one went national with Peter King and then PFT before Wexell (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/16/jim-wexell-still-has-some-explaining-to-do/)basically said "my bad" and deleted the tweet (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/16/jim-wexell-still-has-some-explaining-to-do/).

Just sayin'...

If this rumor is true, why didn't Dallas just speed dial KC. Sounds like they were offering a lot more than Denver did.

[hawaiiansteeler]

Kevin Colbert Says Steelers Never Considered Trading Out Of First Round

BY ALEX KOZORA MAY 1, 2016

This was Kevin Colbert’s Draft Day moment. Clutching the piece of paper, wrinkled up, with these words scribbled down: Draft Artie Burns. No matter what.

Ok, maybe that didn’t happen. But according to him, the idea of moving out of the 25th spot was never worth the risk of losing out on him.

“We weren’t going to [trade down] because we were going to take Artie Burns right then and there. Trading away from Artie Burns was never even an issue,” Colbert told the media in the team’s post-draft press conference.

to read rest of article:

http://www.steelersdepot.com/2016/05/kevin-colbert-says-steelers-never-considered-trading-first-round/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+SteelersDepotBlog+%28Steelers +Depot%29

[fansince'76]

All the moving parts don't make sense to this. It is predicated on either or both of two things being true - Dallas or Pittsburgh's front offices are dumb and bad with time.

Not sure I buy it.

http://connectbiz.com/stories/nissen-k5.gif

[AtlantaDan]

According to Peter King, who spent draft weekend with the Cowboys, this was what Dallas was trying to do to trade up and get Paxson Lynch - no indication the 2017 first round pick was ever on the table

The plan was to offer Dallas’s second-round and third-round picks, 34 and 67 overall, to teams in the late teens and early 20s—Indianapolis, Buffalo, the Jets, Houston—but then swap out the third-rounder for Dallas’s fourth-rounder, 101 overall, starting in the mid-20s. Cincinnati (24), Pittsburgh (25), Seattle (26), Green Bay (27) and Kansas City (28) all got called. Lukewarm responses, mostly. ...

Pittsburgh never considered trading at No. 25 and made a pick quickly: cornerback Artie Burns...

Denver consummated the deal with Seattle for the chance to pick Lynch. The Denver deal was clearly better. Dallas was offering picks 34 and 101 for the 26th overall pick. Denver was offering picks 31 and 94

http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2016/05/01/nfl-draft-dallas-cowboys-war-room-jerry-jones-peter-king

[steelreserve]

Well then Dallas can suck on a fart like always.

[teegre]

According to Peter King, who spent draft weekend with the Cowboys, this was what Dallas was trying to do to trade up and get Paxson Lynch - no indication the 2017 first round pick was ever on the table

The plan was to offer Dallas’s second-round and third-round picks, 34 and 67 overall, to teams in the late teens and early 20s—Indianapolis, Buffalo, the Jets, Houston—but then swap out the third-rounder for Dallas’s fourth-rounder, 101 overall, starting in the mid-20s. Cincinnati (24), Pittsburgh (25), Seattle (26), Green Bay (27) and Kansas City (28) all got called. Lukewarm responses, mostly. ...

Pittsburgh never considered trading at No. 25 and made a pick quickly: cornerback Artie Burns...

Denver consummated the deal with Seattle for the chance to pick Lynch. The Denver deal was clearly better. Dallas was offering picks 34 and 101 for the 26th overall pick. Denver was offering picks 31 and 94

http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2016/05/01/nfl-draft-dallas-cowboys-war-room-jerry-jones-peter-king

This post made my day...

...because, Dan has arrived.

Welcome!!!!!

[GBMelBlount]

My thoguhts for years.

Even if you know... wait to see if a team offers you a Herschel Walker/Ricky Williams type of deal.

Agreed.

I personally thought they picked burns so quickly so they would not look like they were just sucker punched by the Bengals.

Guess I was wrong.

[pczach]

According to Peter King, who spent draft weekend with the Cowboys, this was what Dallas was trying to do to trade up and get Paxson Lynch - no indication the 2017 first round pick was ever on the table

The plan was to offer Dallas’s second-round and third-round picks, 34 and 67 overall, to teams in the late teens and early 20s—Indianapolis, Buffalo, the Jets, Houston—but then swap out the third-rounder for Dallas’s fourth-rounder, 101 overall, starting in the mid-20s. Cincinnati (24), Pittsburgh (25), Seattle (26), Green Bay (27) and Kansas City (28) all got called. Lukewarm responses, mostly. ...

Pittsburgh never considered trading at No. 25 and made a pick quickly: cornerback Artie Burns...

Denver consummated the deal with Seattle for the chance to pick Lynch. The Denver deal was clearly better. Dallas was offering picks 34 and 101 for the 26th overall pick. Denver was offering picks 31 and 94

http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2016/05/01/nfl-draft-dallas-cowboys-war-room-jerry-jones-peter-king


Welcome aboard Dan!

[GBMelBlount]

According to Peter King, who spent draft weekend with the Cowboys, this was what Dallas was trying to do to trade up and get Paxson Lynch - no indication the 2017 first round pick was ever on the table

The plan was to offer Dallas’s second-round and third-round picks, 34 and 67 overall, to teams in the late teens and early 20s—Indianapolis, Buffalo, the Jets, Houston—but then swap out the third-rounder for Dallas’s fourth-rounder, 101 overall, starting in the mid-20s. Cincinnati (24), Pittsburgh (25), Seattle (26), Green Bay (27) and Kansas City (28) all got called. Lukewarm responses, mostly. ...

Pittsburgh never considered trading at No. 25 and made a pick quickly: cornerback Artie Burns...

Denver consummated the deal with Seattle for the chance to pick Lynch. The Denver deal was clearly better. Dallas was offering picks 34 and 101 for the 26th overall pick. Denver was offering picks 31 and 94

http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2016/05/01/nfl-draft-dallas-cowboys-war-room-jerry-jones-peter-king

Welcome Dan!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[AtlantaDan]

This post made my day...

...because, Dan has arrived.

Welcome!!!!!


Welcome aboard Dan!



Welcome Dan!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks for the welcomes :drink: