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hawaiiansteeler
03-14-2016, 12:25 PM
Jets bringing in Steelers nose tackle Steve McLendon for a visit

Posted by Darin Gantt on March 14, 2016

https://nbcprofootballtalk.files.wordpress.com/2013/04/mclendon.jpg?w=236

After losing Damon Harrison to the Giants, the Jets are beginning to look at options to backfill their defensive line.

According to Dom Cosentino of NJ.com, the Jets are bringing in Steelers free agent Steve McLendon for a visit today.

He’s been a solid run player for the Steelers, and that’s what the Jets are looking for after losing the massive Harrison in the first day of free agency.

The former undrafted free agent from Troy has spent his entire career with the Steelers. He visited with the Packers in 2013, but returned to Pittsburgh then.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/03/14/jets-bringing-in-steelers-nose-tackle-steve-mclendon-for-a-visit/

hawaiiansteeler
03-15-2016, 02:19 PM
Why math might not add up for Steelers and NT Steve McLendon

Jeremy Fowler
ESPN Staff Writer

http://a3.espncdn.com/combiner/i?img=%2Fphoto%2F2014%2F0607%2Fnfl_g_mclendon01jr_ 1296x729.jpg&w=570

The Pittsburgh Steelers' nose tackle plans are coming into focus.

They like Steve McLendon and want him back, but at a price. Basically, they won't pay big money for a player who won't see the field much for them. A nose tackle in a true 3-4 set will be used about 25 to 30 percent of the time in this defense. The Steelers have relayed this message, and they are prepared to enhance Dan McCullers' role if necessary.

As a result, McLendon finds himself in New York this week. He's visiting the Jets. A reference point for him could be Al Woods, who just got a reported three-year deal worth up to $10.5 million from the Titans.

Barring new developments, it's looking like the Steelers won't pay enough to keep McLendon unless his market falls back to them. Given the lack of depth with free-agent nose tackles, here's to betting McLendon can do slightly better financially on the open market.

Re-signing McLendon seems like the sensible thing to do on paper. He keeps continuity up front. But the Steelers find themselves a bit stuck here. They know linemen Cam Heyward and Stephon Tuitt will play a majority of the snaps, and McLendon is sort of the odd man out. It's not a production thing but a logistical one.

Meanwhile, McCullers has a chance this offseason to prove he's worth more playing time. The man can move people. He's every bit of 6-foot-7 and 348 pounds. But he didn't take ownership of a job last training camp and didn't look comfortable on the field. The team has challenged him to get in better shape and put in the necessary work in the film room. Stay tuned on him.

http://espn.go.com/blog/pittsburgh-steelers/post/_/id/18031/why-math-might-not-add-up-for-steelers-and-nt-steve-mclendon

Born2Steel
03-15-2016, 04:16 PM
Let's Go ShadeTree!!!! Get it done big man!!!

hawaiiansteeler
03-15-2016, 06:31 PM
Jets Sign Former Steelers NT Steve McLendon

By Jeremy J. Jackson 3 on Mar 15, 2016

https://cdn3.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/ppU3uhfQchd_l1CN5EyfWn4zWeY=/0x310:4602x3378/709x473/cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/49091387/usa-today-9091858.0.jpg

The Jets have a Snacks replacement, as they signed former Steeler Steve McLendon. The deal is said to be 3 years with a maximum value of $12 million dollars. How to get to $12 mil, we don't know at this time.

McLendon started 9 games last year and played in all 16. He recorded 14 tackles and a sack. However, the true value of a nose tackle isn't in his stats but how well he clogs the middle, and by all accounts he's very good at doing that.

to read rest of article:

http://www.ganggreennation.com/2016/3/15/11242000/jets-sign-former-steelers-nt-steve-mclendon

katmandu
03-15-2016, 06:38 PM
http://www.profootballrumors.com/jets-to-sign-steve-mclendon/

hawaiiansteeler
03-15-2016, 06:39 PM
http://www.steelersuniverse.com/forums/showthread.php/25424-Jets-bringing-in-Steve-McLendon-for-a-visit

Shoes
03-15-2016, 06:54 PM
NT R1...anything worth while in the FA NT department?

SteelerFanInStl
03-15-2016, 07:18 PM
NT R1...anything worth while in the FA NT department?

I still don't want us to spend a 1st round pick on a NT. That's a waste IMO.

Knighton is still available. We should be talking to him.

katmandu
03-15-2016, 07:21 PM
http://www.steelersuniverse.com/forums/showthread.php/25424-Jets-bringing-in-Steve-McLendon-for-a-visitI'm a day late and a dollar short again !

Shoes
03-15-2016, 07:28 PM
I still don't want us to spend a 1st round pick on a NT. That's a waste IMO.

Knighton is still available. We should be talking to him.

I don''t think we need to, its a top heavy class.....but.

I know Ngata has been on the decline, but I wonder how much of a pay cut he would take? At least for some depth. I don't expect much from McCullers.

steelreserve
03-15-2016, 07:29 PM
Good. Forcing us to move on from mediocrity is a positive thing if you ask me.

katmandu
03-15-2016, 07:35 PM
Good. Forcing us to move on from mediocrity is a positive thing if you ask me.Time for Big Dan to wake the hell up !

hawaiiansteeler
03-15-2016, 08:20 PM
I don''t think we need to, its a top heavy class.....but.

I know Ngata has been on the decline, but I wonder how much of a pay cut he would take? At least for some depth. I don't expect much from McCullers.

James C Wexell
‏@jimwexell

Yes. It's McCullers' time. Be fine for the third of snaps their NT plays.

https://twitter.com/jimwexell/status/709889822089842688

SteelerFanInStl
03-15-2016, 08:53 PM
I don''t think we need to, its a top heavy class.....but.

I know Ngata has been on the decline, but I wonder how much of a pay cut he would take? At least for some depth. I don't expect much from McCullers.

I believe that Ngata already re-signed with Detroit.

Mojouw
03-15-2016, 08:53 PM
I don''t think we need to, its a top heavy class.....but.

I know Ngata has been on the decline, but I wonder how much of a pay cut he would take? At least for some depth. I don't expect much from McCullers.

I think he quietly re-upped with Detroit.

SteelerFanInStl
03-15-2016, 08:55 PM
Good. Forcing us to move on from mediocrity is a positive thing if you ask me.

It is as long as we take action and do something about it. McCullers hasn't done enough for me to think that he can just step in and do the job. He really seemed to take a step backward last season.

Mojouw
03-15-2016, 08:57 PM
Now we really get to see Butler's vision for the defense. I think it is Butler who is tinkering with pulling things away from a strict OLB based fire-zone to more of a 3-4 built around the DEs.

Of course that may be a product of where the talent lies on the roster currently. Be interesting to see where they spend big time draft chips on defense. May show how the team is charting the way forward scheme wise.

steelreserve
03-15-2016, 09:04 PM
At this point I think it's almost a must that they draft a DT early. I mean, there's no everyday DT on the roster and no money to sign one. So - kind of thinking that was their plan, unless there's some drastic remaking of the defense that no one knows about.

Mojouw
03-15-2016, 09:13 PM
At this point I think it's almost a must that they draft a DT early. I mean, there's no everyday DT on the roster and no money to sign one. So - kind of thinking that was their plan, unless there's some drastic remaking of the defense that no one knows about.

I would tend to agree. But that just has almost never been Colbert's MO. He always seems to sign at least one bottom of the barrel guy in an attempt to enter the draft with no "needs". Still a month out, so you never know.

But, I suspect we are looking at a DT/DE combo player at #25.

teegre
03-15-2016, 10:45 PM
But, I suspect we are looking at a DT/DE combo player at #25.

1. Jarran Reed is my dream, but he'll be gone by 25.
2. Kenny Clark is who I realistically want.
3. Vernon Butler is who I'd put my money on.

fansince'76
03-15-2016, 10:46 PM
1. Jarran Reed is my dream, but he'll be gone by 25.

Do we package picks to move up? This team is close and IMO, in a "win now" mode.

teegre
03-15-2016, 10:51 PM
Do we package picks to move up? This team is close and IMO, in a "win now" mode.

Most years, yes.

This year, Clark or Butler are just a notch below.

SUMMATION:
Clark/Butler + Nassib (R3) > Reed only

hawaiiansteeler
03-15-2016, 11:08 PM
1. Jarran Reed is my dream, but he'll be gone by 25.


weren't you paying attention to the draft genius, there's a good chance that Jarran Reed will still be available when the Steelers pick in Round 2...:rolleyes3:

steelreserve
03-15-2016, 11:17 PM
It always seems that with big fat guys, there are players still available you'd never expect (and we pass on all of them). Whether it's Reed or not, there are so many this year I'm sure we'll get a good one. And who knows, it could be him too.

Cyphon25
03-16-2016, 08:10 AM
I could definitely see us taking DL in the first round and would be cool with it but I think there is a chance there are still some really good ones left in the 2nd round. If Mackensie Alexander isn't there at 25 I would go with a Vernon Butler, Sheldon Rankins, Kevin Dodd or one of those types.

People shouldn't write off McCullers just yet. He didn't see the field much but keep in mind neither did McLendon. It is the nature of the position in our defense. So even if McCullers isn't great he has a very limited snap count to begin with. It isn't ideal but it wouldn't spell doom either.

MrPgh
03-16-2016, 08:22 AM
NTs are rarely taken in the 1st round. Remember back in 2014 when a lot of "experts" had Louis Nix III being taken in the 1st? He wasn't drafted until the 3rd round that year. With NTs only spending about 30% of snaps on the field, it's really easy to understand why team avoid the position in the 1st. CB and S are still bigger needs for this team.

Born2Steel
03-16-2016, 09:08 AM
I think our FO is happy with the improvements McCullers has made. He hasn't shown it in actual production, true, but I think they see something there. Also, a DL in the 1st-2nd wouldn't be a surprise at this point either, even if we had kept McLendon.

tube517
03-16-2016, 09:26 AM
We need another Kimo Von Oelhoffen or Chris Hoke. I'm sure we can find one of those in the 2nd or possibly 3rd?

Dwinsgames
03-16-2016, 09:46 AM
Tomlin and Colbert at Baylor pro day. Billings DT/NT

Shoes
03-16-2016, 11:06 AM
Tomlin and Colbert at Baylor pro day. Billings DT/NT

Welcome to Pittsburgh Billings.

steelreserve
03-16-2016, 11:33 AM
NTs are rarely taken in the 1st round. Remember back in 2014 when a lot of "experts" had Louis Nix III being taken in the 1st? He wasn't drafted until the 3rd round that year. With NTs only spending about 30% of snaps on the field, it's really easy to understand why team avoid the position in the 1st. CB and S are still bigger needs for this team.

We've been over this about a thousand times, but to summarize: That tired old argument about snap counts is just another way of saying that when you have a shitty nose tackle whose only skill set is to sort of defend the run - of course he doesn't play very much because there's not much use for that. If you have a good one, he plays a lot more. Louis Nix probably would've gone in the first if he hadn't torn up his knee, which some people (myself included) thought would be ok, but apparently was a lot worse than that.



We need another Kimo Von Oelhoffen or Chris Hoke. I'm sure we can find one of those in the 2nd or possibly 3rd?

We could probably find two with any combination of picks from the 1st through 3rd. We realistically need two more DLs of some sort between now and the start of the season, and at least one has to be able to play DT. Question is whether we think it's worth spending two picks on. And unless we sign a DB of some sort, the answer is no, other needs are probably more important. So we'll start the season with a rookie DT who is probably playing behind another Cam Thomas-level cheap veteran signing - for four games or so until we realize there's nothing to lose by playing the rookie. I just hope Cam II isn't on a two-year deal that makes whoever signed him too afraid to get egg on their face to cut him.

MrPgh
03-16-2016, 02:45 PM
We've been over this about a thousand times, but to summarize: That tired old argument about snap counts is just another way of saying that when you have a shitty nose tackle whose only skill set is to sort of defend the run - of course he doesn't play very much because there's not much use for that. If you have a good one, he plays a lot more. Louis Nix probably would've gone in the first if he hadn't torn up his knee, which some people (myself included) thought would be ok, but apparently was a lot worse than that.




We could probably find two with any combination of picks from the 1st through 3rd. We realistically need two more DLs of some sort between now and the start of the season, and at least one has to be able to play DT. Question is whether we think it's worth spending two picks on. And unless we sign a DB of some sort, the answer is no, other needs are probably more important. So we'll start the season with a rookie DT who is probably playing behind another Cam Thomas-level cheap veteran signing - for four games or so until we realize there's nothing to lose by playing the rookie. I just hope Cam II isn't on a two-year deal that makes whoever signed him too afraid to get egg on their face to cut him.

Regardless of whether it's a "tired old argument" or not doesn't change the fact CB and S are bigger needs.

steelreserve
03-16-2016, 03:20 PM
Regardless of whether it's a "tired old argument" or not doesn't change the fact CB and S are bigger needs.


Really? We actually have players on the roster at those positions.

MrPgh
03-16-2016, 04:44 PM
Really? We actually have players on the roster at those positions.

And most of them stink and will be on the field much more often than whoever the NT will be.

SteelerFanInStl
03-16-2016, 04:48 PM
Really? We actually have players on the roster at those positions.

Gay, Cockrell, Golson and Grant. Super Bowl here we come!

steelreserve
03-16-2016, 04:53 PM
Gay, Cockrell, Golson and Grant. Super Bowl here we come!

That by itself is a tremendous improvement over Gay, Cockrell and Blake.

Yes, we need one more of each (CB, S) before the start of the season and it would help if we somehow got one of those before the draft.

A third defensive lineman would be on the field roughly 60-65% of the time based on last year's snap count, assuming whoever we drafted could both play NT and sub for DE, which almost certainly the answer would be yes.

This "nose tackles are only on the field 30% of the time" argument is repeated so much, but it's such bullshit, and the number keeps getting more and more absurd, just like "you inhale 100,000 spiders an hour while you're asleep."

A good player is going to be on the field much more than that and make much more of an impact that that, or else the coach is an idiot.

MrPgh
03-16-2016, 05:49 PM
Nobody is saying the Steelers don't need a NT, just not in the first round. If they drafted a NT in round 3 I doubt anyone would have a problem with that.

steelreserve
03-16-2016, 06:04 PM
Nobody is saying the Steelers don't need a NT, just not in the first round. If they drafted a NT in round 3 I doubt anyone would have a problem with that.

I would have a problem with it, because you probably wouldn't get a good nose tackle. You'd get Steve McLendon.

Again: Good nose tackles aren't 30%-of-the-time players. Shitty Steve McLendon nose tackles are.

Good nose tackles don't only defend against the run. Shitty Steve McLendon nose tackles do.

Good nose tackles can stay in on passing downs and can generate pressure. Shitty Steve McLendon nose tackles don't.

You (and others) are confusing the position's impact with the impact of one shitty player. We just haven't had a real nose tackle for 5 years so it looks like it's not a key position. Put a first-round talent there and you will get first-round impact.

MrPgh
03-16-2016, 06:24 PM
I would have a problem with it, because you probably wouldn't get a good nose tackle. You'd get Steve McLendon.

Again: Good nose tackles aren't 30%-of-the-time players. Shitty Steve McLendon nose tackles are.

Good nose tackles don't only defend against the run. Shitty Steve McLendon nose tackles do.

Good nose tackles can stay in on passing downs and can generate pressure. Shitty Steve McLendon nose tackles don't.

You (and others) are confusing the position's impact with the impact of one shitty player. We just haven't had a real nose tackle for 5 years so it looks like it's not a key position. Put a first-round talent there and you will get first-round impact.

Again, whether anything you say is right or wrong it doesn't take away from the fact that CB and S are MUCH bigger needs than NT right now. So if that "shitty Steve McClendon" NT player they would have to settle for in the third means improving a position that has been downright terrible for the Steelers over the last three seasons, so be it.

No offense, but you come off as one of those fans who think only the players in the trenches are important and that any scrub who can run can play the outside positions.

Shoes
03-16-2016, 06:57 PM
Mean Joe Greene On Baylor DT Andrew Billings: ‘I Saw A Little Nasty In Him

BY DAVE BRYAN (http://www.steelersdepot.com/author/davebryan/) MARCH 16, 2016 AT 06:54 PM
The Pittsburgh Steelers certainly didn’t hide their interest in Baylor defensive tackle Andrew Billings at the school’s Wednesday pro day as they even brought Hall of Famer Joe Greene with them to observe the young player. After the event ended, Greene was asked what he thought about Billings in an interview with David Smoak of ESPN-Central Texas.
“He has the body type for the position,” said Greene of Billings. “He’s strong, he’s quick and I saw a little nasty in him.”
Even though Billings posted a great 40-yard dash time a few weeks ago at the 2016 NFL Scouting Combine in Indianapolis, he surprised a few people Wednesday by attempting to better his time. Greene was asked what he thought about the Billing’s decision to do that.
“That means he’s a competitor,” said Greene. “He had a time that he ran in Indianapolis at the combine and he wanted to beat that and we talked a little bit last night and he said he probably wasn’t going to run. but he came in here today and he saw the excitement that was surrounding his teammates and he decided to be a part of it.”
Billings is regarded as having a great character and at one point on Wednesday, Steelers general manager Kevin Colbert and head coach Mike Tomlin were both spotted talking to his parents. Green was asked to talk about the importance of young players entering the NFL having a strong character in addition to a great support system.
“It always matters,” said Greene. “But these young men that are coming into a new environment, it is so important that they have support at home because it really is very easy to go in the wrong direction. You can be down that path and not even know it, but that support at home definitely helps.”
It’s great to see Greene back on the road looking at draft prospects and you can tell that he really likes Billings. He had dinner with him Tuesday night and one would think the two were joined by Tomlin.
Billings definitely helped cement his status as a first-round draft pick on Wednesday and now we’ll have to wait and see where he winds up being selected. It will be interesting to see if the Steelers bring Billings to Pittsburgh for a pre-draft visit in April.
If Wednesday was just a smoke-screen, the Steelers certainly produced a thick one.
http://www.steelersdepot.com/2016/03/mean-joe-green-on-baylor-dt-andrew-billings-i-saw-a-little-nasty-in-him/

steelreserve
03-16-2016, 07:13 PM
Again, whether anything you say is right or wrong it doesn't take away from the fact that CB and S are MUCH bigger needs than NT right now. So if that "shitty Steve McClendon" NT player they would have to settle for in the third means improving a position that has been downright terrible for the Steelers over the last three seasons, so be it.

No offense, but you come off as one of those fans who think only the players in the trenches are important and that any scrub who can run can play the outside positions.


No offense taken; you come off as one of those fans who has jumped into the sabermetric hype with both feet and outsmarted himself with statistics.

The "nose tackles aren't on the field enough" line of BS is the same as the hype around tall defensive backs and the read-option offense: a big fad. Eventually people realize that no matter what elaborate statistical distortion they've managed in support of their viewpoint - even if it's only a third of the time, you can't put a shitty player on the field. And if it's not a shitty player, he's on the field as much as all the other players.

Anyway, more to the point - this year is an exceptionally good one to draft a defensive lineman and an exceptionally shitty one to draft a cornerback. Draft a DT at pick #25 and you will likely get a guy who is a top-10 or top-15 talent most other years. Outside of the top three or so prospects who will be long gone, all the CBs are either Round 3 talents or incredibly risky boom-or-bust types (and the "boom" depends on adding more polish to fix a known weakness, which our coaching staff has not managed to do with any DBs for about a decade, but that's a separate issue). Anyway, since using a higher pick doesn't make the player any better, there's no sense taking one of those guys at #25 when you could use a later pick. There may well be a couple of good safeties available when we pick in R2, though. So ideally, you would see a draft that goes:

R1. DL
R2. S or CB
R3. CB or DL

depending on whether we can still bring in at least an average DB during the rest of free agency and which kind. Getting a TE was a tremendous move in hindsight, because it took that need off the board and this is one of the worst TE classes I can remember. I'd put CB next on that list.

hawaiiansteeler
03-16-2016, 07:44 PM
Steelers Meet With Kyle Peko At Oregon State Pro Day

BY ALEX KOZORA MARCH 16, 2016

A Pittsburgh Steelers’ scout met with DL Kyle Peko at Oregon State’s Pro Day. This makes the second time the team has shown interest in him, also talking to him during the NFLPA Bowl week.

Peko, according to the Statesman Journal, ran a 4.9 in the 40 and repped 31 times on the bench press. That would’ve tied him for third of all defensive linemen at this year’s Combine, the same mark Andrew Billings hit.

After dealing with academic issues, sitting out 2014, Peko was only able to play one year at the FBS level. He made the most of it, recording 4.5 TFL and two sacks. He said teams told him his “best football was yet to come,” according to the Statesman.

He projects as a late round pick but given how much of an unknown he was, could rise the closer we get to the draft, and as teams find out more about him. Peko is currently unranked on NFL Draft Scout’s board. He was, however, listed on an NFL.com Top 200 list even before the season started, getting noticed as the cousin of Cincinnati Bengals’ defensive tackle Domata Peko.

Around 6’1, 308 pounds, he would project more as a nose tackle in the Steelers’ scheme. Currently, there is a void on the roster after the Steelers lost Steve McLendon to the New York Jets yesterday.

to read rest of article:

http://www.steelersdepot.com/2016/03/steelers-meet-kyle-peko-oregon-state-pro-day/

cold-hard-steel
03-16-2016, 07:47 PM
I'm a day late and a dollar short again !









yeah kind of like Longstreet felt before that fateful charge.Do not turn your back.

steelerkitty
03-16-2016, 07:53 PM
Kyle Peko is a Nobody. Not even a top-500 player in this draft.

MrPgh
03-16-2016, 08:04 PM
No offense taken; you come off as one of those fans who has jumped into the sabermetric hype with both feet and outsmarted himself with statistics.

The "nose tackles aren't on the field enough" line of BS is the same as the hype around tall defensive backs and the read-option offense: a big fad. Eventually people realize that no matter what elaborate statistical distortion they've managed in support of their viewpoint - even if it's only a third of the time, you can't put a shitty player on the field. And if it's not a shitty player, he's on the field as much as all the other players.

Anyway, more to the point - this year is an exceptionally good one to draft a defensive lineman and an exceptionally shitty one to draft a cornerback. Draft a DT at pick #25 and you will likely get a guy who is a top-10 or top-15 talent most other years. Outside of the top three or so prospects who will be long gone, all the CBs are either Round 3 talents or incredibly risky boom-or-bust types (and the "boom" depends on adding more polish to fix a known weakness, which our coaching staff has not managed to do with any DBs for about a decade, but that's a separate issue). Anyway, since using a higher pick doesn't make the player any better, there's no sense taking one of those guys at #25 when you could use a later pick. There may well be a couple of good safeties available when we pick in R2, though. So ideally, you would see a draft that goes:

R1. DL
R2. S or CB
R3. CB or DL

depending on whether we can still bring in at least an average DB during the rest of free agency and which kind. Getting a TE was a tremendous move in hindsight, because it took that need off the board and this is one of the worst TE classes I can remember. I'd put CB next on that list.

So by saying CB and S are bigger needs than NT, I'm obsessed with sabermetrics?

Cool story.

hawaiiansteeler
03-16-2016, 08:06 PM
Jets sign NT Steve McLendon (3 years, $12 million): C+ Grade

The Jets had a huge hole in the middle of their defensive line when Damon "Snacks" Harrison departed via free agency and signed with the Giants. Harrison, after all, was one of the primary reasons they were one of the best teams in terms of stuffing the run. Their replacement for Harrison will be former Steeler Steve McLendon.

McLendon is an obvious downgrade. There's no doubt about that. While Harrison was one of the top nose tackles in the NFL, McLendon has been just a mediocre player at his position. The Steelers didn't even want him anymore, and they have some glaring defensive issues of their own.

With that in mind, this is an overpay, but I won't grade the Jets too harshly though because their options were limited. In the wake of B.J. Raji's retirement, the only other legitimate nose tackle out there was Terrance Knighton. The draft is a possibility, but if the Jets want to go quarterback at No. 20 - as I have happening in my 2016 NFL Mock Draft - there's no telling who would've been available in Round 2 and beyond.

http://walterfootball.com/freeagentsigninggrades.php#DHpUOAHuBkp23OwH.99

cold-hard-steel
03-16-2016, 08:43 PM
I guess what i am trying to say is you gots to man your ground. Do what you have to do .Put another man right back in that spot.

Shoes
03-16-2016, 09:17 PM
I think Billings will be there at 25. Most of the Mocks I looked at have him going after 25. Profootball focus only has Rankins & Nkemdiche going before 25.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2016/03/15/draft-wentz-goff-go-1-2-in-cris-collinsworths-first-2016-nfl-mock-draft/

steelreserve
03-16-2016, 09:51 PM
So by saying CB and S are bigger needs than NT, I'm obsessed with sabermetrics?

Cool story.


No, you're doing that by downplaying the importance of NT and saying that basically any fat person will do. Much cooler story.

hawaiiansteeler
03-16-2016, 11:50 PM
Mock Draft Monday: Andrew Billings falls to the Steelers with the 25th overall pick

By Jeff.Hartmant on Feb 29, 2016

https://cdn2.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/KiE0taseRyuVWuCGUJeCNDNIIkw=/0x72:3243x2234/709x473/cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/48961759/usa-today-8974998.0.jpg

The Steelers don't draft cornerbacks in the first round, and that trend continues in the latest mock draft as the team drafts the giant, Andrew Billings, with the 25th overall pick.

It seems to be a foregone conclusion that Baylor NT/DE Andrew Billings will be an early first round draft pick in the upcoming NFL Draft. However, with the NFL Scouting Combine coming to a close Monday, there have been some waves made in the prospect waters, especially along the defensive line.

Sometimes teams put certain players, positions and team needs ahead of the 'Best Player Available' philosophy which fans of the Pittsburgh Steelers have become all too familiar with. For this reason, and others, there is always a chance a tremendous athlete falls in the draft.

In 2014 it was Stephon Tuitt who fell all the way to the second round, when he was a projected first round draft pick. In 2015 it was Bud Dupree who was thought to be drafted in the first half of the draft, but had to wait until the Steelers picked 22nd overall for his name to be called.

So, with that said, there is a chance Billings could fall to 25th overall, which would put his gigantic 6-foot 1-inch 315-pound body in the Steelers proverbial laps. In the latest SB Nation Mock Draft, they have Billings headed to Pittsburgh.

25. Pittsburgh Steelers: Andrew Billings, DT, Baylor

Cornerbacks are often the choice for Pittsburgh - it's a pick I've made several times - but since current Steelers general manager Kevin Colbert joined Pittsburgh in 2000, they haven't picked a cornerback in the first round. A nose tackle like Billings could fit nicely between Stephon Tuitt and Cameron Heyward.

Billings being selected by the Steelers would mean several things have already taken place prior to the draft. Steve McLendon likely finding a new home in free agency, and the team not being sold on Daniel McCullers being the nose tackle of the future.

Either way, Billings brings an extreme amount of power to the interior pass rush and run stopping -- something the Steelers could certainly use in the coming season. His 5.05 40-yard dash is impressive, considering the weight he is carrying, but his 31 repetitions on the 225-pound bench press is what tells the true tale of Billings.

If the Steelers were to somehow land Billings, it would mean a player who is ready to play from Day 1, and be a force along the young and improving Steelers' defensive line.

http://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2016-nfl-mock-draft-pittsburgh-steelers-list-database/2016/2/29/11131348/mock-draft-monday-andrew-billings-falls-to-the-steelers-with-the-25th

MrPgh
03-17-2016, 11:38 AM
No, you're doing that by downplaying the importance of NT and saying that basically any fat person will do. Much cooler story.

I think there's a difference between a 3rd round pick and "any fat person." Given that the Steelers already have 1st round and 2nd round talent on the DL, maybe it's time to put some more focus into the backfield.

steelreserve
03-17-2016, 12:21 PM
I think there's a difference between a 3rd round pick and "any fat person." Given that the Steelers already have 1st round and 2nd round talent on the DL, maybe it's time to put some more focus into the backfield.


Well yes, we obviously need to do that too. And don't get me wrong, I don't think CB/S is any "less" of a need. But in the draft THIS YEAR, with our first-round pick we would probably get a very lousy deal at CB. We'd basically be picking from a pool of half a dozen guys who are all roughly the same low-R2 or R3 talent level. The past 3-4 seasons we probably could've gotten at least a decent CB in Round 1, but this year it would've been much smarter for us to use free agency to bring in a mid-level CB (and I'm still hopeful maybe there's a chance of that).

Of course, if that blue-chip CB somehow happens to be there in R1 I'd take him without hesitation, but I just think there are about three of them and they'll all be LONG gone.

Meanwhile, this could be the rare year where there is not just one but multiple guys with Casey Hampton potential in the draft, and we can get one at #25 who would normally be 15 spots out of our reach, and require trading half a draft to get (which would NOT be worth it). And still an excellent chance of getting an impact player at safety, or that failing, and average CB, in R2.

If you remember our dominant defenses going back through the Cowher days, the one thing they all had in common was that they all had not one or two but THREE dominant defensive linemen (along with a decent backup). You could get away with having a couple so-so linebackers or an average CB. Heyward and Tuitt are so good that they can kind of let us fake it having only two, but if you really want the defense to be clicking, round it out with a third. I don't care how they get one - sign one, draft one, trade for one - but that's a big missing piece.

hawaiiansteeler
03-17-2016, 12:41 PM
Of course, if that blue-chip CB somehow happens to be there in R1 I'd take him without hesitation, but I just think there are about three of them and they'll all be LONG gone.


out of curiosity, which 3 CBs do you believe to be blue-chip? I'm assuming Jalen Ramsey, Vernon Hargreaves and ?

steelreserve
03-17-2016, 01:33 PM
out of curiosity, which 3 CBs do you believe to be blue-chip? I'm assuming Jalen Ramsey, Vernon Hargreaves and ?

Probably Mackenzie Alexander. He's also the one out of the three that has a chance of being there at #25 (and also one who I'd pull the trigger on).

People talk up Eli Apple as a R1 talent, and he may well be for some other team - but that's a trap pick for us. Word on him is that he has a couple holes in his game that need some coaching up to fix at the NFL level, and if there's one thing we don't do well under Lake, it's coach up DBs.

William Jackson is another one that *somebody* might take in the first because omg he's tall, but would also be a big reach to take there. Did well in a mid-major kind of environment, but a coin flip whether he'll make the NFL transition, and even more of a gamble whether that'll happen quickly. I think we want better than "now if we're really lucky, maybe later, possibly never" out of a first-round pick. And again, if he needs coaching up (and he likely will) that's also a big problem for us. God damn do we need to do something about that - but that's another story.

Then after that, it's a bunch of guys who have middle-round written all over them, so grab a dart and maybe your third-round pick turns into an above-average NFL player.

At safety, I think there's a really good chance that Joseph, Cravens, or one of a handful of others who have the potential to be impact players will be there when we pick in R2, so now that TE is out of the way, that's really what I'd have my radar on with that pick.

SteelMember
03-17-2016, 03:09 PM
We need a big, fat fatty. :hippo:

Born2Steel
03-17-2016, 03:44 PM
The whole mid-major thing is a real non issue when evaluating talent at skill positions.

teegre
03-17-2016, 06:04 PM
I once heard Damien Woody talking about CB vs OLB.

Woody played with Darrelle Revis, when Revis was the #1 corner in the NFL. Woody averred that Revis was the best player that he had ever played with.

But... if given a choice between James Harrison and Darrelle Revis, Woody would take the "player closer to the line of scrimmage" 100 times out of 100.

Woody acknowledged that Revis could take another team's #1 receiver 100% out of a game: "It was like the opposition was playing with only 10 guys on offense." BUT, it was only one player.

Whweras, a blue chip defender who was closer to the line-of-scrimmage could disrupt the entire offense.

SUMMATION:
Woody said that it starts & ends with the line.

Bring on the big ugly!!!

MrPgh
03-17-2016, 06:24 PM
I once heard Damien Woody talking about CB vs OLB.

Woody played with Darrelle Revis, when Revis was the #1 corner in the NFL. Woody averred that Revis was the best player that he had ever played with.

But... if given a choice between James Harrison and Darrelle Revis, Woody would take the "player closer to the line of scrimmage" 100 times out of 100.

Woody acknowledged that Revis could take another team's #1 receiver 100% out of a game: "It was like the opposition was playing with only 10 guys on offense." BUT, it was only one player.

Whweras, a blue chip defender who was closer to the line-of-scrimmage could disrupt the entire offense.

SUMMATION:
Woody said that it starts & ends with the line.

Bring on the big ugly!!!

Woody was an offensive lineman right? I think it's obvious he has a bias.

The Steelers HAVE spent high draft picks for the guys up front. Now it's time to use them on the back end. Denver didn't win a Super Bowl with scrubs in the secondary.

teegre
03-17-2016, 06:28 PM
Woody was an offensive lineman right? I think it's obvious he has a bias.

The Steelers HAVE spent high draft picks for the guys up front. Now it's time to use them on the back end. Denver didn't win a Super Bowl with scrubs in the secondary.

Most former players would agree. Ray Lewis sucked when his D-line sucked.

Three things: Malik Jackson, Sylvester Williams, & Derek Wolfe.

polamalubeast
03-17-2016, 06:32 PM
But Woody is right

You need a good secondary to have a great defense, but the pass rush is the most important thing.I take Von Miller and J.J Watt before Richard Sherman or another CB

MrPgh
03-17-2016, 06:36 PM
But Woody is right

You need a good secondary to have a great defense, but the pass rush is the most important thing.I take Von Miller and J.J Watt before Richard Sherman or another CB

But the line already has first and second round talent on it. I don't think third round talent at NT will kill the already very talented DL if the backfield starts to get more of that high-end talent.

teegre
03-17-2016, 06:36 PM
But Woody is right

You need a good secondary to have a great defense, but the pass rush is the most important thing.I take Von Miller and J.J Watt before Richard Sherman or another CB

Yep.
I agree 100%.

MrPgh
03-17-2016, 06:46 PM
You don't think the guys up front for Denver were helped by the DBs at all? It's not a one-way street.

polamalubeast
03-17-2016, 06:53 PM
You don't think the guys up front for Denver were helped by the DBs at all? It's not a one-way street.



Of course yes, but the pass rush is more important.

teegre
03-17-2016, 06:53 PM
You don't think the guys up front for Denver were helped by the DBs at all? It's not a one-way street.

I agree that one hand washes the other... that's very true.

I just prefer a big ugly first, then a DB (or three).

Born2Steel
03-17-2016, 07:47 PM
The debate over which position is more important depends largely on who is available at the pick. If Hargreaves or Alexander are there at 25,the pick is most likely CB. If not, DL makes a ton of sense over reaching for a position of need. Too many DLs with early round talent that can be an immediate help for our defense. If we get to 25 and everyone's favorite NT AND CB are available, I hope we go CB, simply because I see that as a smaller talent pool in this draft, as well as a desperate need. If the pick goes DL, same scenario, I can understand that one too even though I personally would have picked differently.
List our CBs and DLs, DLs need depth badly, we need CBs. One CB that can take away the one best receiver, on this team, is a world changer. We are sooo close.

hawaiiansteeler
03-17-2016, 08:29 PM
The debate over which position is more important depends largely on who is available at the pick. If Hargreaves or Alexander are there at 25,the pick is most likely CB.

here is Mike Manock's latest post-Combine CB ranking:

Cornerback

1. Vernon Hargreaves, Florida
2. Eli Apple, Ohio State
3. Artie Burns, Miami (Fla.)
4. William Jackson III, Houston
5. Mackensie Alexander, Clemson

Rise: Hargreaves (2), Apple (4), Burns (NR), Jackson (NR)
Fall: Alexander (3), Cyrus Jones, Alabama (5)
Note: Jalen Ramsey, Florida State (1), moves to safety

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000642199/article/mike-mayocks-2016-nfl-draft-position-rankings-20

hawaiiansteeler
03-20-2016, 01:24 AM
Greg Himonidis @himidaddy
@EdBouchette

you recall a year when we lost this many free agents? I get non are superstars but all played a role.

Ed Bouchette ‏@EdBouchette Mar 17
Ed Bouchette Retweeted Greg Himonidis

Should yield a bounty of comp picks in 2017

https://twitter.com/EdBouchette?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp %7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

Shoes
03-20-2016, 10:55 AM
Greg Himonidis @himidaddy
@EdBouchette

you recall a year when we lost this many free agents? I get non are superstars but all played a role.

Ed Bouchette ‏@EdBouchette Mar 17
Ed Bouchette Retweeted Greg Himonidis

Should yield a bounty of comp picks in 2017

https://twitter.com/EdBouchette?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp %7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

And maybe the Steelers trade up this year?

steelerkitty
03-20-2016, 11:01 AM
Yep.
I agree 100%.




Ditto. I mean what is the old saying ?...." It's pressure that bursts the Pipe "