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View Full Version : We could have four first round picks starting at LB



TeeTee
06-24-2015, 06:11 PM
Dupree, Shazier, Timmons and Jones.

We never used to have to draft so many LBs in the first round.

We used to get steals with LBs.

All I know is, if you draft LBs - all four in the first round - you better sure as shit have the best LB unit in the NFL.

If not, FAIL.

This will be the year we find out what we have with Jones and Shazier, maybe won't know on Dupree this season. We could, but might not.

GBMelBlount
06-24-2015, 07:40 PM
I look at our LBs like I do the offensive line.

We invested a lot of early picks and they should pay dividends in the next year or two.

steelreserve
06-25-2015, 10:40 AM
I look at our LBs like I do the offensive line.


Me too - you can't use all first and second-round picks there either, or it fucks up the rest of your team. Like you might not find any good nose tackles or defensive backs for 15 years and then --

OH! Wait. NOW I get it.

polamalubeast
06-25-2015, 10:50 AM
Dupree might have not being drafted by the Steelers if Jones would not have been a disappointment in his first two seasons

fansince'76
06-25-2015, 11:24 AM
Timmons was drafted 8 years ago, so I don't see how he can be lumped in with Jones, Shazier and Dupree.

86WARD
06-25-2015, 02:00 PM
Amazing how time has flown by...Timmons drafted 8 years ago...

TeeTee
06-25-2015, 03:01 PM
Timmons was drafted 8 years ago, so I don't see how he can be lumped in with Jones, Shazier and Dupree.

He can be "lumped in" simply because they are ALL first round LB draft picks. That is all. It doesn't speak good or ill about him.

TeeTee
06-25-2015, 03:08 PM
I look at our LBs like I do the offensive line.

We invested a lot of early picks and they should pay dividends in the next year or two.

It's similar, but how it differs is the team didn't neglect the LB position for 6 years longer than they should have, as they did with the OL. I really thought the team would put some priority on the OL (and with this team, "priority" on a position is mostly the draft since they do so little in free agency) after the 2005 season. They didn't. Really they virtually ignored it until they drafted Pouncy, Adams, Gilbert and DD, but Adams was a swing and a miss, big time. They have never ignored the LB position like the OL for such a long period. I will never forget when Tomlin said, in a smug way that "there were other ways to help Ben" other than drafting Olinemen. He was flat out wrong to hold such a mindset. Ben took a beating for years because our OL was so horrible.

fansince'76
06-25-2015, 04:48 PM
He can be "lumped in" simply because they are ALL first round LB draft picks. That is all. It doesn't speak good or ill about him.

What I meant was that Timmons doesn't fit the narrative of recent 1st round picks being LBs. He's by far the old man of the group.

steelreserve
06-25-2015, 04:49 PM
Timmons was drafted 8 years ago, so I don't see how he can be lumped in with Jones, Shazier and Dupree.


Because that's half our first-round draft picks over that time. And at a position where a single skilled player makes arguably the least difference of anywhere on the team, except offensive line.

I don't get why we do it. We never used to have to spend many first-round picks on that position, to say nothing of three consecutive first-round picks.

No, it's not that linebackers are harder to find; there is just as much talent there as ever.

No, it's not that "the price has gone up"; there are still the same number of teams splitting the same number of draft picks among the same number of positions. If anything, the relative price of cornerbacks, wide receivers and left tackles has gone way up while everything else has stayed the same or gone down. Every year lately we go "OMG!!! This amazing linebacker fell to us in the first round!" Well ... maybe it's not that great players are always "falling" to us and we're always getting a draft-day steal, it's that other teams' front offices don't value linemen and linebackers as highly as ours does, and we get too excited.

So basically, the reason is that our priorities are all fucked up. No, not all positions are equal value, and yes, an above-average cornerback can in fact have more impact than a good lineman. This trend of nothing but linemen and linebackers 1-2 started exactly when Tomlin took over and has stayed straight as an arrow. It's a damn good thing we've had some lucky breaks like Brown, Beachum and Bryant thrown in lately, or else try to imagine the mess we'd be in.

fansince'76
06-25-2015, 04:55 PM
Because that's half our first-round draft picks over that time. And at a position where a single skilled player makes arguably the least difference of anywhere on the team, except offensive line.

I don't get why we do it. We never used to have to spend many first-round picks on that position, to say nothing of three consecutive first-round picks.

No, it's not that linebackers are harder to find; there is just as much talent there as ever.

No, it's not that "the price has gone up"; there are still the same number of teams splitting the same number of draft picks among the same number of positions. If anything, the relative price of cornerbacks, wide receivers and left tackles has gone way up while everything else has stayed the same or gone down. Every year lately we go "OMG!!! This amazing linebacker fell to us in the first round!" Well ... maybe it's not that great players are always "falling" to us and we're always getting a draft-day steal, it's that other teams' front offices don't value linemen and linebackers as highly as ours does, and we get too excited.

So basically, the reason is that our priorities are all fucked up. No, not all positions are equal value, and yes, an above-average cornerback can in fact have more impact than a good lineman. This trend of nothing but linemen and linebackers 1-2 started exactly when Tomlin took over and has stayed straight as an arrow. It's a damn good thing we've had some lucky breaks like Brown, Beachum and Bryant thrown in lately, or else try to imagine the mess we'd be in.

Still not really seeing it - after all, we drafted Spin-and-Fall and Sweed 1-2 in 2008. Where'd that get us? That draft more than any other in recent years put us behind the eight ball as far as talent goes. Seems like we're just now starting to turn the corner.

I think the real issue is that we've had several subpar drafts recently. That, more than focusing on a particular position group, is what has hurt us, IMO. For example, if Jones would have torn it up from day one I have my doubts that we'd have taken Dupree.

polamalubeast
06-25-2015, 04:58 PM
Because that's half our first-round draft picks over that time. And at a position where a single skilled player makes arguably the least difference of anywhere on the team, except offensive line.

I don't get why we do it. We never used to have to spend many first-round picks on that position, to say nothing of three consecutive first-round picks.

No, it's not that linebackers are harder to find; there is just as much talent there as ever.

No, it's not that "the price has gone up"; there are still the same number of teams splitting the same number of draft picks among the same number of positions. If anything, the relative price of cornerbacks, wide receivers and left tackles has gone way up while everything else has stayed the same or gone down. Every year lately we go "OMG!!! This amazing linebacker fell to us in the first round!" Well ... maybe it's not that great players are always "falling" to us and we're always getting a draft-day steal, it's that other teams' front offices don't value linemen and linebackers as highly as ours does, and we get too excited.

So basically, the reason is that our priorities are all fucked up. No, not all positions are equal value, and yes, an above-average cornerback can in fact have more impact than a good lineman. This trend of nothing but linemen and linebackers 1-2 started exactly when Tomlin took over and has stayed straight as an arrow. It's a damn good thing we've had some lucky breaks like Brown, Beachum and Bryant thrown in lately, or else try to imagine the mess we'd be in.

The OLB in a 3-4 is maybe the most important position in a defense


And the Steelers could Drafted a another OLB next year if Jones is really a bust!

TeeTee
06-25-2015, 05:09 PM
Still not really seeing it - after all, we drafted Spin-and-Fall and Sweed 1-2 in 2008. Where'd that get us? That draft more than any other in recent years put us behind the eight ball as far as talent goes. Seems like we're just now starting to turn the corner.

I think the real issue is that we've had several subpar drafts recently. That, more than focusing on a particular position group, is what has hurt us, IMO. For example, if Jones would have torn it up from day one I have my doubts that we'd have taken Dupree.

"Spin and Fall." :rofl2: He was a bust. Sure he started for a few seasons, but he never lived up to his draft status. He just NEVER seems to break that one last tackle to make a big play; he was always one step away. Plus, he seems like a weirdo. Don't fondly recall him in any way, and his fumble costed us another ring. He couldn't carry Bell's dirty jockstrap.

fansince'76
06-25-2015, 05:10 PM
"Spin and Fall." :rofl2: He was a bust. Sure he started for a few seasons, but he never lived up to his draft status. He just NEVER seems to break that one last tackle to make a big play; he was always one step away. Plus, he seems like a weirdo. Don't fondly recall him in any way, and his fumble costed us another ring. He couldn't carry Bell's dirty jockstrap.

Good point, and one I neglected to mention. For his size, he was extremely soft and went down way too easy. Willie Parker put up more fight than he did.

Mexican Yinzer
06-25-2015, 05:59 PM
Dupree, Shazier, Timmons and Jones.

We never used to have to draft so many LBs in the first round.

We used to get steals with LBs.

All I know is, if you draft LBs - all four in the first round - you better sure as shit have the best LB unit in the NFL.

If not, FAIL.

This will be the year we find out what we have with Jones and Shazier, maybe won't know on Dupree this season. We could, but might not.
Maybe history teaches us that most rookies never show their true potential their first year. With Dupree seen him play & his overall attitude gives me a really good feeling.

Enviado desde mi SGH-I337M mediante Tapatalk

steelreserve
06-25-2015, 07:58 PM
The OLB in a 3-4 is maybe the most important position in a defense


Yeah - after the nose tackle, the defensive ends, and the secondary. Or in other words, the least important or second-least important position. Oh, I get that QB pressure is the key to the defense. I'm not dumb. The skill of the OLBs, by itself, has almost nothing to do with that.

Here's how it works: The defensive line drives the OLB play. You have a good line that disrupts a lot, you can put just about anybody at OLB and they'll give you eight or nine sacks. You have a mediocre line, and you could have James Harrison and Lawrence Taylor in their primes as your OLBs and you'll still be wondering why the pass rush sucks.

I don't buy for a minute that all these #1 picks were necessary, and think that's a result of us going about trying to solve the problem backwards. Jones probably wouldn't suck if he had a decent DL in front of him, and we may see that start to turn this year thanks to Tuitt and Heyward. Except if we'd fixed the DL first, we probably could've gotten great production out of a much lower-round draft pick at LB. Instead we burn up high picks over nothing. Again, what happens when you try to solve the problem backwards. It's frustrating to think how good this team could've been if we'd had two or three extra first-round picks to use on whatever we wanted.

polamalubeast
06-25-2015, 08:04 PM
The pass rush is the most important thing for a defense, especially in the NFL of today.....DL and OLB are the most important position for a 3-4 defense

Very rarely a defense will be dominant with no pass rush

Devilsdancefloor
06-25-2015, 09:37 PM
Dupree, Shazier, Timmons and Jones.

We never used to have to draft so many LBs in the first round.

We used to get steals with LBs.

All I know is, if you draft LBs - all four in the first round - you better sure as shit have the best LB unit in the NFL.

If not, FAIL.

This will be the year we find out what we have with Jones and Shazier, maybe won't know on Dupree this season. We could, but might not.

this is true, but the steelers where one of the very few who used the 34 defense they could wait and get those draft steals in the 4,5,6,7th rounds

TeeTee
06-25-2015, 11:36 PM
this is true, but the steelers where one of the very few who used the 34 defense they could wait and get those draft steals in the 4,5,6,7th rounds

Very valid point. We used to get gems in 3rd round or later. Same with DE's.