Ben talks new contract

[Dwinsgames]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000454810/article/roethlisberger-contract-should-be-done-sooner-than-later

[86WARD]

"I felt great all year [on his contract situation]," Roethlisberger said Tuesday on 93.7 The Fan in Pittsburgh. "Hopefully it's sooner rather than later."


Agree with Ben. Sooner would be better. Just get it done.

A 5-6 Year deal with $24M a season is probably the deal he'll get. Cap relief the first two seasons, so the team can sign some talent, maybe loaded up in the last year to make it sound like even more than $24M up to $26M maybe on average. But really only worth $24M.

He's an elite QB...the minimum starting point is over $21-22M a season...easily.

[ALLD]

$20+ to any team that has cap space. Steelers will pay. The team's bigger issue will be when Bell's rookie contract is up. If they were smart they would give him and AB new contracts if there is room.

[polamalubeast]

$20+ to any team that has cap space. Steelers will pay. The team's bigger issue will be when Bell's rookie contract is up. If they were smart they would give him and AB new contracts if there is room.

I have no problem that Ben signs a big contract, but I hope that the Steelers will be smart to keep the cap room for the next contract of Bell and Antonio Brown

In the past, the Steelers have lost some players because the Steelers had no cap room, so I hope the steelers will not make the same mistakes....The contract of Woodley is still a killer for the steelers

[steelreserve]

$20 million is the going rate for anyone in the top half of QBs, whether that means Peyton Manning or Andy Dalton. There is not much separation once you get there. I don't understand it, but about $20M is what I expect he'll get. Well worth it, and since his cap hit was already $18M this year, we don't necessarily even need to backload it much.

[86WARD]

$20 million is the going rate for anyone in the top half of QBs, whether that means Peyton Manning or Andy Dalton. There is not much separation once you get there. I don't understand it, but about $20M is what I expect he'll get. Well worth it, and since his cap hit was already $18M this year, we don't necessarily even need to backload it much.

He should get more than $20M. You would "back load" it and give a nice bonus to give some extra cap relief this year (2015) and next (2016) and then hopefully by 2017, the cap hit isn't so bad and is manageable. He should wind up being the highest paid QB once his deal is done...until The next Elite Guy gets a deal. He should obviously wind up being the biggest contract of the off season...

[86WARD]

$20+ to any team that has cap space. Steelers will pay. The team's bigger issue will be when Bell's rookie contract is up. If they were smart they would give him and AB new contracts if there is room.

They'll be in a similar boat that the Cowboys are in now with Murray and Bryant.

[steelreserve]

He should get more than $20M. You would "back load" it and give a nice bonus to give some extra cap relief this year (2015) and next (2016) and then hopefully by 2017, the cap hit isn't so bad and is manageable. He should wind up being the highest paid QB once his deal is done...until The next Elite Guy gets a deal. He should obviously wind up being the biggest contract of the off season...


If the going rate is $20M, I don't see why he should get more. There is a plateau there for a reason - probably because much more than that starts becoming impossible for your salary cap no matter how good the QB is - and I don't see the need to get into a race to the top, especially since we would be basically racing against ourselves.

As for backloading - fuck that. If we don't need to do it, we shouldn't do it, because that's how you get yourself into trouble. Backloading and hoping you get bailed out by a salary cap increase - we've done that before, and look where it got us. $20 million over the cap every year, that's where. You also tend to backload a contract when it's easy to get out of the last couple years, or when you're likely to re-extend the player later, and neither of those seem likely.

The only reason to backload it significantly would be if it specifically helps us sign a free agent we're after, or retain someone we're in danger of losing. Otherwise, this is a rare opportunity to get a big-money deal done without screwing ourselves in the present or going through any kind of convoluted bullshit in the future. It probably makes sense to take modest steps up, like a 5-year deal at $18M, $20M, $21M, $22M, $22M, because we should be able to count on at least a moderate salary cap increase making the "value of money" a bit less in the future. But I'd rather put as much of the "real" amount as possible into this year and have a flat cap hit ... not a lot of big-time free agents to re-sign this offseason, but coming up in the next 2 years we've got the Heyward contract, the DeCastro contract, the Bell contract, the Beachum contract, the Jones decision, and possibly new deals for S. Thomas and Wheaton, in addition to hopefully bringing in some help at DB.

Anyway .. I do not want to see any of that bullshit where he has a $6 million cap hit next year, then $12 million, then $24M, then $30M, then $36M and you cut him to save half of it and eat $9M in dead money for two seasons. That would be shooting ourselves in the foot just when the rest of the team ought to be reaching its peak; we could use Ben then more than eating the ass end of a formerly cap-friendly deal.

[steelreserve]

$20+ to any team that has cap space. Steelers will pay. The team's bigger issue will be when Bell's rookie contract is up. If they were smart they would give him and AB new contracts if there is room.

The smart thing to do on that is wait another year for sure. Right now if we gave Bell/Brown new contracts, we would be paying both of them based on a career season being their most recent performance. If they both have career years again, it doesn't change much. If either of them falters or misses 4 games, we save a boatload of money.

At any rate, big-name RBs don't tend to bounce around much because other teams are reluctant to make them a big offer, due to the prevailing idea that "arr, this is a passing league now, we don't need running backs, just draft one whenever!" So the home team's offer and the job security that comes with it will get taken if it's reasonable. And Brown is under contract through the end of 2017 at a rate that's very fair to everyone, so not much point in messing with that.

[86WARD]

If the going rate is $20M, I don't see why he should get more. There is a plateau there for a reason - probably because much more than that starts becoming impossible for your salary cap no matter how good the QB is - and I don't see the need to get into a race to the top, especially since we would be basically racing against ourselves.

As for backloading - fuck that. If we don't need to do it, we shouldn't do it, because that's how you get yourself into trouble. Backloading and hoping you get bailed out by a salary cap increase - we've done that before, and look where it got us. $20 million over the cap every year, that's where. You also tend to backload a contract when it's easy to get out of the last couple years, or when you're likely to re-extend the player later, and neither of those seem likely.

The only reason to backload it significantly would be if it specifically helps us sign a free agent we're after, or retain someone we're in danger of losing. Otherwise, this is a rare opportunity to get a big-money deal done without screwing ourselves in the present or going through any kind of convoluted bullshit in the future. It probably makes sense to take modest steps up, like a 5-year deal at $18M, $20M, $21M, $22M, $22M, because we should be able to count on at least a moderate salary cap increase making the "value of money" a bit less in the future. But I'd rather put as much of the "real" amount as possible into this year and have a flat cap hit ... not a lot of big-time free agents to re-sign this offseason, but coming up in the next 2 years we've got the Heyward contract, the DeCastro contract, the Bell contract, the Beachum contract, the Jones decision, and possibly new deals for S. Thomas and Wheaton, in addition to hopefully bringing in some help at DB.

Anyway .. I do not want to see any of that bullshit where he has a $6 million cap hit next year, then $12 million, then $24M, then $30M, then $36M and you cut him to save half of it and eat $9M in dead money for two seasons. That would be shooting ourselves in the foot just when the rest of the team ought to be reaching its peak; we could use Ben then more than eating the ass end of a formerly cap-friendly deal.

The going rate is more than $20M. It's gonna be higher than that...which he should be paid. They can't take that cap hit all in one season like that. Extending him and back loading is going to allow the signing of those guys you mentioned. Take the bulk of the cap hit up front, you're not going to be able to sign the guys you want to...

[steelreserve]

The going rate is more than $20M. It's gonna be higher than that...which he should be paid. They can't take that cap hit all in one season like that. Extending him and back loading is going to allow the signing of those guys you mentioned. Take the bulk of the cap hit up front, you're not going to be able to sign the guys you want to...

No, it's not. The going rate is $20M, actually slightly less on average:

http://overthecap.com/position/quarterback/

So no reason to go beyond that.

Ben's cap hit was already $18M this season. Distribute a new contract of $20M a year evenly and it will not affect our salary cap situation positively or negatively. Backload it and we are borrowing against the future.

Of course, I'm under no illusion that we'd make it a completely flat contract; obviously we will push some money toward the later years depending on what we think we need to be competitive this offseason. If we need $4M or $5M to sign a decent corner, I'm all for it. What I do not want is some bullshit where we're taking $30M cap hits toward the end of it. Talk about shooting yourself right in the nuts.

[Lady Steel]

Ben Roethlisberger On Offseason Contract Negotiations: ‘I Love Being Here With This Family’



PITTSBURGH (93-7 The FAN) – Coming off the Steelers 30-17 playoff loss at the hands of the Baltimore Ravens, quarterback Ben Roethlisberger joined “The Cook and Poni Show” for his weekly “Ben Roethlisberger Show” in which he recapped the loss, the season as a whole and talked about his future with the Steelers as he enters the offseason with just one year remaining on his contract.



http://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2015/01/06/ben-roethlisberger-on-offseason-contract-negotiations-i-love-being-here-with-this-family/

[smokin3000gt]

With guys like Flacco, Ryan, Kaepernick, and Cutler getting $18-20m I can see Ben(rightfully so IMO) getting north of 20. He's worth at least a couple million more than those clowns.

[86WARD]

No, it's not. The going rate is $20M, actually slightly less on average:

http://overthecap.com/position/quarterback/

So no reason to go beyond that.

Ben's cap hit was already $18M this season. Distribute a new contract of $20M a year evenly and it will not affect our salary cap situation positively or negatively. Backload it and we are borrowing against the future.

Of course, I'm under no illusion that we'd make it a completely flat contract; obviously we will push some money toward the later years depending on what we think we need to be competitive this offseason. If we need $4M or $5M to sign a decent corner, I'm all for it. What I do not want is some bullshit where we're taking $30M cap hits toward the end of it. Talk about shooting yourself right in the nuts.

That was the going rate about 2 years ago. It's going to be more than $20M now...he may even wind up, being he highest paid QB in football until the next guys deal comes along...it's how it works. I would love to see Ben signed for only $20M a season, but that's probably not the case, he's going to get more and he should. I'm thinking $22 to $24.

When I say backloaded I'm not talking about everything on the end. In think it will be "evenly distributed" but a bit heavier on the back end to, like I said, provide cap,relief in 2015, 2016, be a more manageable number with the cap increases in 2017, 2018. And he's gonna get a nice bonus. That's just what I would do.

[TMC]

No, it's not. The going rate is $20M, actually slightly less on average:

http://overthecap.com/position/quarterback/

So no reason to go beyond that.

Ben's cap hit was already $18M this season. Distribute a new contract of $20M a year evenly and it will not affect our salary cap situation positively or negatively. Backload it and we are borrowing against the future.

Of course, I'm under no illusion that we'd make it a completely flat contract; obviously we will push some money toward the later years depending on what we think we need to be competitive this offseason. If we need $4M or $5M to sign a decent corner, I'm all for it. What I do not want is some bullshit where we're taking $30M cap hits toward the end of it. Talk about shooting yourself right in the nuts.

I agree with you that Ben won't see a massive contract increase. Aaron Rodgers signed his deal and it was touted as the largest per year deal for any QB at $22 million a season. The thing is, he signed it with 2 years left which means that per year average is less than the touted $22 million. His cap hit barely crosses $20 million. I think the Steelers can get Ben for near the $20 million a season mark and, in some of the statements Ben has made, I am not so sure he won't pull a Brady or Manning, meaning he might come in less than market value.

Manning signed a 5-year deal for $96 million. When Manning was with the Colts and Irsay was pushing to extend him, Irsay fought to push his salary up because Manning stated several times, he did not need to be the highest paid guy. In fact, he rejected a 5 year, $100 million deal and signed for 5 years, $90 million. Here is his statement after signing:
"While I appreciate Jim Irsay offering to make me the highest-paid player," Manning told The Indianapolis Star, "I told him I'd rather he save that money and keep whoever it is ... (running back) Joe Addai, (left tackle) Charlie Johnson ... whoever that may be. I'm willing to take less than they've offered if they are going to take that money to keep players we need to keep and go get other players. All I want is for them to have the cap and the cash to keep the players they want to keep and to sign other players."

Brady did the same thing. I think Ben will recognize what these guys are doing to help the team, prolong their careers, and retain valuable players. Brady's cap hit, for the remainder of his contract, never goes over $16 million. That is a huge help to the Patriots.

Ben has already collected over $100 million in his career. Not saying he will, but what if he extended for 5 years at $16 million per season. That is STILL $80 million more he will collect. I believe it will be closer to $90 million, maybe $95, but I certainly do not think Ben will push for $120 million over 5 seasons, which would be a $24 million average. The difference between $24 million and $19 million a season would be enough to sign Kelvin Beachum to a contract extension.

That is how I would present it to Ben. If you are willing to not push to be the highest paid player ever, we can retain most of those five guys in front of you, the guys you turn to when you score, the guys you take out to dinner, the guys that are your friends.

I really think he looks at it like that, and his wife is from the area, has family there. His father and stepmother also live in Pittsburgh now. He has put down some roots here.

[steelreserve]

I don't think Ben is going to take a deal that's far below market value; remember, he's severely limited in endorsements and other earning potential outside of football for the same reason you still can't wear his jersey to a sports bar without some intellectual shouting "Hey #7! So you're a rapist, huh?" Fair or not fair, that's the way it is. So we certainly won't see a Brady/Manning/LeBron type of deal where these guys have so much money coming in from everywhere that a couple million from their actual contract is insignificant.

We might get him for $18M a year if he's feeling generous, but I'm thinking 5 years, $100M is about where it will land. Hopefully Colbert and Khan learned their lesson about backloading and restructuring from the Woodley shitshow and will keep the funny money and accounting gymnastics to a minimum, since we can afford it.

I also think Ben himself would be pushing for more of a flat contract this time around. After all, it was the massive restructuring and backloading that made his cap hit and dead money so high that we couldn't afford to give him a new deal last March. That probably cost him $6 or $8 million this season by not getting the new deal. Wouldn't want to do that again if I were him.

[TMC]

Not so sure that his lack of endorsements will be an issue. In 2013, ESPN ran an article on all the players that had signed NFL contracts valued over $100 million dollars. Of all those players, only one had topped $70 million in money earned from that contract and that player was Ben. Forbes estimates his net worth at more than $32 million. I just do not know if the difference between $90 million and $120 million on that final contract will matter as much to his bottom line as what it would to the team's cap, and I think Ben is smart enough to realize that.

He stated in an interview in 2013, when asked about the big contracts other QBs were getting paid:
"Congratulations to them! Good for them, good for their families. For me, it's about this team."

"My goal has always been to win one more Super Bowl than anybody ever — I know what that means and that's what I have to do. Five Super Bowl titles, that was always my goal.''

"Every quarterback wants to throw the ball all over the field. But I want to win games, and in order to do that, you have to run the ball effectively and throw it effectively. I like what we have in terms of balance to win.''

He also said that he knows this final contract will set him up for life. If he gets near $100 million and his net worth climbs accordingly (he moved roughly 1/3rd of his last contract into net worth), then he would have a net worth over $60 million when he retires.

I also believe if you push the year average up too much, then once you top 35, you still have to continue to perform. Higher back end salaries increase the chance of older players getting released. To me, I would rather reduce my total contract demands, get more up front, lower my back end cap hits, and get every penny on the deal instead of jacking up a big contract and seeing half.

[TMC]

Let me add this about endorsements as well, I just did some quick research and found an article from last off season that listed the top 5 NFL QBs in endorsement money. Drew Brees just topped Manning as the #1 guy, getting $11 million a year. Manning is at $10 million. Tom Brady is next at #7 million. Aaron Rodgers is 4th at $6 million. Russell Wilson is 5th. He is estimated to have deals between $3-$5 million (talk is Manning dropped a couple million in endorsements as they jumped on the Wilson bandwagon).

Ben is said to have $1 million in endorsement deals. I guess my point is this, I do not know if Ben, even without his off-the-field issues, would have ever been as big as guys like Brees, Manning, Brady, and Rodgers. They seem to be the chosen ones for most NFL talking heads. Even prior to Ben's issues, he was not a guy that was talked up on most sports channels. So, I do not see him topping any of those guys, even if he was squeaky clean. Flacco hasn't. Eli Manning hasn't (he has 2 rings too). Rivers hasn't. So, at best, I think Ben might have been near $4-$5 million. I just do not know if those numbers are factors when players sit down to negotiate contracts. I would be willing to bet, for most, it is how they fit in the hierarchy of the competition. And, when you are top tier, like Manning and Brady, I really don't think you give a shit about that. I see Ben with more of that attitude. I think he truly wants to win.

Not saying he will play and sell hotdogs for spare change during halftime, but I think the difference between $18-$20-$24 million against the cap is enough that he can recognize lower may help him slide more gold on his fingers.

[Lady Steel]

Flip Side: How Much to Pay Big Ben?



http://www.wsbtv.com/videos/sports/flip-side-how-much-to-pay-big-ben/vC9F6X/

[Psycho Ward 86]

Take it with a grain of salt since it's coming from the douchebag to end all douchebags Ian Rapoport, but if Russell Wilson gets paid as much as he says, I hope were working on Ben's contract in a hurry....

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000456017/article/seahawks-to-make-russell-wilson-highestpaid-qb

[polamalubeast]

Andrew Luck could have its big contract also in this offseason

[steelreserve]

Take it with a grain of salt since it's coming from the douchebag to end all douchebags Ian Rapoport, but if Russell Wilson gets paid as much as he says, I hope were working on Ben's contract in a hurry....

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000456017/article/seahawks-to-make-russell-wilson-highestpaid-qb


Funny thing, when they do pay him, watch his production dry up like Colin Kaepernick's.

Mobile QB + "Protect Your Big Investment" = No Running = Shitty Production

At least it'll be nice to see Seahawks fans blubbering around wondering why they're suddenly 8-8, as if the answer isn't right there in front of them.



Andrew Luck could have its big contract also in this offseason


I have doubts about that, since they have a club option for 2016 that they will almost certainly exercise and is in line with one year's salary on a megadeal. No sense getting into that a year early and making it harder to build a team around him. They still have several big holes.

[polamalubeast]

Funny thing, when they do pay him, watch his production dry up like Colin Kaepernick's.

Mobile QB + "Protect Your Big Investment" = No Running = Shitty Production

At least it'll be nice to see Seahawks fans blubbering around wondering why they're suddenly 8-8, as if the answer isn't right there in front of them.

.


I do not think that a big contract to Wilson will destroy the seahawks


Many thought the same thing with the Ravens with Flacco but it is not the case

[fansince'76]

At least it'll be nice to see Seahawks fans blubbering around wondering why they're suddenly 8-8, as if the answer isn't right there in front of them.

Well, if it's not that, they'll be blubbering about something else, guaranteed.

[steelreserve]

I do not think that a big contract to Wilson will destroy the seahawks


Many thought the same thing with the Ravens with Flacco but it is not the case


It's not the same thing. People thought Flacco's contract would destroy the Ravens because of the salary cap. (And watch, with the way they backloaded it, in the next 2-3 years, it just might!)

I'm saying Wilson's contract will destroy the Seahawks because they'll force him to be more careful on the field, which of course means changing from a running.playmaking QB to a "true pocket passer." That takes away one of their biggest offensive weapons, and as soon as they do it, he's going to struggle. I'll bet you $20 million a year on that.

[Psycho Ward 86]

It's not the same thing. People thought Flacco's contract would destroy the Ravens because of the salary cap. (And watch, with the way they backloaded it, in the next 2-3 years, it just might!)

I'm saying Wilson's contract will destroy the Seahawks because they'll force him to be more careful on the field, which of course means changing from a running.playmaking QB to a "true pocket passer." That takes away one of their biggest offensive weapons, and as soon as they do it, he's going to struggle. I'll bet you $20 million a year on that.

he's already demonstrated in past seasons that he can get it done without running. he just happens to be a good pocket passer that can run if he needs to. and im sure shipping out percy harvin and having crap receivers has something to do with him having to run more often for the time being

[Dwinsgames]

he's already demonstrated in past seasons that he can get it done without running. he just happens to be a good pocket passer that can run if he needs to. and im sure shipping out percy harvin and having crap receivers has something to do with him having to run more often for the time being

I could be wrong but will go out on a limb here a little bit , but the threat of him running is almost as good as him actually running ...

meaning the defense has to account for the possibility that he may in fact run and in doing so they have a man or series of men dependent upon formation watching him , spying if you will ... 1 less man for coverage

take away the runs , defenses then take away the spy , gaining a man in coverage somewhere on the field making it a little more difficult to throw ...

will it matter much ? hard to say but we might find out

[Psycho Ward 86]

I could be wrong but will go out on a limb here a little bit , but the threat of him running is almost as good as him actually running ...

meaning the defense has to account for the possibility that he may in fact run and in doing so they have a man or series of men dependent upon formation watching him , spying if you will ... 1 less man for coverage

take away the runs , defenses then take away the spy , gaining a man in coverage somewhere on the field making it a little more difficult to throw ...

will it matter much ? hard to say but we might find out

in a manner of speaking, the way most people outside of the seahawks fanbase talk about russell wilson reminds me of big ben when he was young. its going to be a long ass time before russell gets REAL respect, and it will be because he has a good defense and run game. god forbid a quarterback is very good and isnt discredited because of the rest of his team. i felt that he was a flash in the pan his rookie season but these past 2 seasons have convinced me otherwise. There have been games where his protection is shoddy and lynch isnt able to get going and he still succeeds. RW has played about as well as anyone can ask of their quarterback in their budding years in the NFL

big ben seriously had to do it all to get respect, and even then he probably still doesnt get the respect he deserves from most people. with ben, it seemed like the more accolades and come back wins he led, the quicker people were to dismiss those accomplishments. its wilson's turn now

[86WARD]

Ben still doesn't get the respect he deserves. Look at this season alone...he should've at least been mentioned by some people with the likes of Rodgers and Watt for MVP...

[Dwinsgames]

in a manner of speaking, the way most people outside of the seahawks fanbase talk about russell wilson reminds me of big ben when he was young. its going to be a long ass time before russell gets REAL respect, and it will be because he has a good defense and run game. god forbid a quarterback is very good and isnt discredited because of the rest of his team. i felt that he was a flash in the pan his rookie season but these past 2 seasons have convinced me otherwise. There have been games where his protection is shoddy and lynch isnt able to get going and he still succeeds. RW has played about as well as anyone can ask of their quarterback in their budding years in the NFL

big ben seriously had to do it all to get respect, and even then he probably still doesnt get the respect he deserves from most people. with ben, it seemed like the more accolades and come back wins he led, the quicker people were to dismiss those accomplishments. its wilson's turn now


you will get no disagreement from me on this , but until he proves it over a span of years some will continue to question ... its the nature of the beast

when he gets his payday and is told to be more disciplined and take less chances with his health , we shall see just how good he is / can be .... until then we will continue to see people question it

- - - Updated - - -


Ben still doesn't get the respect he deserves. Look at this season alone...he should've at least been mentioned by some people with the likes of Rodgers and Watt for MVP...

this

[polamalubeast]

The health of Wilson is really not a problem since the beginning of his career and that's even if he had more than 800 rushing yards in the last season, so there is no reason to change your style even if you have a big contract, since Wilson is very good to protect himself