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View Full Version : Is Bruce Arians a better head coach than Mike Tomlin?



zulater
09-14-2014, 03:22 PM
Loses his starting qb and goes into Giants stadium (or whatever it's called these days) and comes away with a win. This after already losing arguably his best defensive player before the season started. Never been his biggest fan, but I got to admit he seems to be doing one helluva good job.

polamalubeast
09-14-2014, 03:25 PM
Bruce Arians is 21-9 as Head Coach.(9-3 with the colts,12-6 with the Cards)

Nadroj 20
09-14-2014, 03:27 PM
He gets the job done that's for sure. I guess I can't decide if he is better than Tomlin though. We've struggled in recent years and that superbowl Tomlin won seems to be ages ago. This is more his team now then ever and we always seem to play .500 ball.

Steelerette
09-14-2014, 03:35 PM
Arians always had a good football mind. The problem with him at OC was that he gameplanned for the players he wished he had, instead of the ones he actually had.

As HC he's going to have more control over personnel and scheme, and his coordinators are going to have to deal with what he passes down to them. Nothing about his failures as an OC really translated into him not being able to do the job at HC. Just don't let your hindsight get too blurry. He may well have done fine as HC here but the timing wasn't right so we'll never know. He still didn't really work as our OC with Tomlin and Colbert up top.

X-Terminator
09-14-2014, 04:53 PM
Wait...weren't you one of the leaders of the "Fire Arians" brigade? And weren't you also one of those who mocked the very suggestion that he could be a good head coach, as suggested once-upon-a-time by Marianne? And now you are singing his praises???

GBMelBlount
09-14-2014, 05:46 PM
Hire Arians!

Count Steeler
09-14-2014, 05:47 PM
Seriously?

Shoes
09-14-2014, 05:52 PM
Hire Arians!


:chuckle:

muncher
09-14-2014, 06:18 PM
both those other coaches have coached up mediocre talent, tomlin has coached ours down

fansince'76
09-14-2014, 06:27 PM
Yep, guess that explains Whiz's stellar 46-52 regular season and 50-54 overall record as a NFL HC...

Texasteel
09-14-2014, 06:33 PM
I believe I can hear Marianne laughing right now.

GBMelBlount
09-14-2014, 06:38 PM
both those other coaches have coached up mediocre talent, tomlin has coached ours down

But Muncher, you can't be serious?

Dwinsgames
09-14-2014, 06:42 PM
it doesn't matter we have who we have ....

that being said in my opinion he should be considered on the hot seat ( even though he will not actually be on it because we wont be firing him ) he will get a pass because of his Lombardi in the trophy case and we do not fire guys who bring home the hardware ...

lackluster performances / seasons when you have a " franchise QB " should cost you your job and in many cities it does , just not here

- - - Updated - - -


But Muncher, you can't be serious?


at first glance I seen Butt Muncher :toofunny:

86WARD
09-14-2014, 07:23 PM
But Muncher, you can't be serious?

http://cdn.meme.li/instances/50569419.jpg

Godfather
09-14-2014, 08:31 PM
I'd put them all about the same. Wiz made it within minutes of a Lombardi when he had a borderline Hall of Famer at QB. When he had to make do with those other guys he fell on his face. Tomlin gave us our sixth Lombardi when Troy/Clark/Deebo/Diesel/Big Snack were in their prime. Arians is making some early noise at his current gig.

None of them are going to make chicken salad out of chicken manure. But they're all capable of winning big if they have a good roster. That puts them ahead of guys like Garrett who ice their own kicker.

Butch
09-14-2014, 08:54 PM
You know it's funny, I didn't want B.A. as our OC and I was glad to see him leave...still am. He did very good as an OC. in other places I just didn't care for him here, and his record as an HC is impressive. There are many coaches who are Great at being coordinators and not very good at being an HC ie... Dick LeBeau as well as some others. Maybe the opposite is true of B.A., if it is then good for him. Does he look like a better H.C. than Tomlin yeah he does.

Count Steeler
09-14-2014, 09:14 PM
But BA had Pagano's players and Whiz's players.

muncher
09-14-2014, 09:17 PM
so you guys sucking tomlin's sack think the other 2 teams rosters are more talented than ours?

Texasteel
09-14-2014, 09:42 PM
Muncher, Would you like to rewrite you post just a little maybe?

steelreserve
09-14-2014, 10:02 PM
so you guys sucking tomlin's sack think the other 2 teams rosters are more talented than ours?


Muncher, Would you like to rewrite you post just a little maybe?


:toofunny: I fully support that post.


On topic: I didn't like Arians as an OC, still don't, but he seems to have what it takes to be a head coach. Maybe he's like the reverse Norv Turner.

If we're comparing him to Tomlin, I don't think there's much of a comparison. Arians has taken over in two situations that could have gone either way, and done better than expected. Tomlin took over a Super Bowl winning team and has overseen a steady decline. Yeah, yeah, I know, we had certain things working against us because we were trying to "keep the core together for one more run," but he's not exactly done much to show that he's on top of it and mercilessly marching us back to the top. In fact, he barely even looks like he's in control of the team at all. That, as much as any of the on-field results from the past three seasons, makes me worried as hell.

zulater
09-14-2014, 10:13 PM
Wait...weren't you one of the leaders of the "Fire Arians" brigade? And weren't you also one of those who mocked the very suggestion that he could be a good head coach, as suggested once-upon-a-time by Marianne? And now you are singing his praises???

I asked a question. .Didn't suggest there was one answer above all others now did I? Also open minded people can change their mind as facts and information change. .Try it sometime.

Regardless I stand by what I said at the time. I gave him praise and blame equally as deserved. Or as I believed anyway. I never took it personally one way or the other. Some of you did, as if you were Bruce's children. Never quite figured that one out? And those of us who dared believe Bruce fell out of favor with the Rooney's, that the press didn't just make it up when they said he was almost fired were proven correct over time. You guys really liked telling us how stupid we were when the Steelers changed their mind and lied after the fact.
That is until the Steelers changed their minds again, and lied about it after the fact. :lol:


Also I'm the guy who voted for Tomlin on the poll, for whatever that's worth.


I post what I believe will make interesting topics. Thought this would provide for some interesting conversation.

JayC
09-14-2014, 10:33 PM
i never liked BA because i thought he was stubborn but i have begun to think it's more of an organizational stubbornness of the Steelers than individual. i don't know what tomlin has been trying to do the past 3 years. this team has a bad habit of being unprepared and they love to put themselves into a huge hole or blow whatever lead they have. they don't even seem to make adjustments throughout the game.

i'm starting to think Tomlin is not a good coach at all. He is all talk and no substance. So at this moment in time BA > Tomlin. I was not saying that 3 years ago. Winning/losing changes everything.

zulater
09-14-2014, 10:36 PM
Bruce is really having a helluva retirement in Arizona. :heh:

Lambert_Loonie
09-14-2014, 11:03 PM
Loses his starting qb and goes into Giants stadium (or whatever it's called these days) and comes away with a win. This after already losing arguably his best defensive player before the season started. Never been his biggest fan, but I got to admit he seems to be doing one helluva good job.

You know the Giants are playing like shit right now, right (and that they usually have been in the first half of the season for several years now)? No win in the NFL is easy. But let's not act like the Cards went to Seattle and beat them 70-3.

Bruce drove me bonkers as OC but I'll give him his due in Arizona. Going 10-6 in the most competitive division in the NFL with a team that's regarded by the majority of football fans to be compiled of hasbeens and never-was's (with the exceptions being Larry Fitzgerald and Patrick Peterson, of course) is pretty impressive considering his limited Head Coaching experience. He's definitely showing he has a pretty good idea how to get the most out of his players. But I think it's too early in his tenure to determine whether he's better at his job than Tomlin or Whiz.

zulater
09-14-2014, 11:05 PM
You know the Giants are playing like shit right now, right (and that they usually have been in the first half of the season for several years now)? No win in the NFL is easy. But let's not act like the Cards went to Seattle and beat them 70-3.

Bruce drove me bonkers as OC but I'll give him his due in Arizona. Going 10-6 in the most competitive division in the NFL with a team that's regarded by the majority of football fans to be compiled of hasbeens and never-was's (with the exceptions being Larry Fitzgerald and Patrick Peterson, of course) is pretty impressive considering his limited Head Coaching experience. He's definitely showing he has a pretty good idea how to get the most out of his players. But I think it's too early in his tenure to determine whether he's better at his job than Tomlin or Whiz.

Actually Eli was playing pretty well today. I don't think that was quite the tap in putt you're making it to be.

Lambert_Loonie
09-14-2014, 11:20 PM
Actually Eli was playing pretty well today. I don't think that was quite the tap in putt you're making it to be.

I'll admit I didn't watch that game today, just saw a box score and a couple highlights.

I'm not trying to take anything away from Bruce's work with the Cardinals. Winning with ANY backup quarterback nowadays, let alone one that hasn't taken a regular season snap since 2010, is impressive. But... its the Giants. They're eons from the cellar but they're just as far from from the penthouse.

Craic
09-15-2014, 01:29 AM
I can't even read through this thread . . . won't even try. Irony of it on a Steelers website is so thick that it'd choke me.

That, and I'm sure somewhere in the ever-beyond, Suit is crying in laughter.

fansince'76
09-15-2014, 02:28 AM
so you guys sucking tomlin's sack think the other 2 teams rosters are more talented than ours?

As opposed to sucking Whisenhunt's sack when he is 46-52 lifetime as a head coach?

fansince'76
09-15-2014, 03:01 AM
Tomlin took over a Super Bowl winning team and has overseen a steady decline.

A Super Bowl-winning team that was seriously flawed to begin with and eked out an 8-8 record (after a 2-6 start) the year immediately preceding his arrival. There really isn't much arguing the point that the 2008 Steelers won the Super Bowl with by far the worst OL of any Super Bowl winner to date and which also damn near cost them the Super Bowl that year (looking at you, Hartwig). As I recall, you were none too fond of the Steelers' #1 RB at the time either. And as much as Hines meant to the team, when he is the best WR from a talent perspective that your team puts on the field, then your receiving corps isn't exactly gangbusters either.

zulater
09-15-2014, 05:05 AM
I can't even read through this thread . . . won't even try. Irony of it on a Steelers website is so thick that it'd choke me.

That, and I'm sure somewhere in the ever-beyond, Suit is crying in laughter.


Aren't we superior then? :coffee:

Nothing wrong with the thread or the vast majority of answers that have been presented yet. If you came down off your high horse and read a few you might be surprised at some of the insight offered.

Mojouw
09-15-2014, 10:29 AM
BA is doing well in Arizona, but he also has oodles of young talent (the benefit of all those years they stunk with Whiz at the helm) to work with. Peterson and Mathieu form the core of one of the best young secondaries that doesn't play in Seattle. I think most of it is suspended or injured right now, but there are some good ILB on that team - not so much on the outside. I believe they have a couple of Pro Bowl level talents on the D line. On offense they have a couple of talented young backs in Ellington and Taylor. They have a ton of talent at WR - Floyd and Fitzgerald are as good as any duo in the league. They seem to have fixed their OL issues.

So I look over their roster and I have about 6-8 guys that are Pro Bowl talents. Do they same on the Steelers roster. Let me know what you come up with. I get about 4-6 with only one on Defense.

GBMelBlount
09-15-2014, 10:47 AM
BA is doing well in Arizona, but he also has oodles of young talent (the benefit of all those years they stunk with Whiz at the helm) to work with. Peterson and Mathieu form the core of one of the best young secondaries that doesn't play in Seattle. I think most of it is suspended or injured right now, but there are some good ILB on that team - not so much on the outside. I believe they have a couple of Pro Bowl level talents on the D line. On offense they have a couple of talented young backs in Ellington and Taylor. They have a ton of talent at WR - Floyd and Fitzgerald are as good as any duo in the league. They seem to have fixed their OL issues.

So I look over their roster and I have about 6-8 guys that are Pro Bowl talents.

Do they same on the Steelers roster. Let me know what you come up with. I get about 4-6 with only one on Defense.

I will argue that the Steelers have 6-8 guys with Pro Bowl talent too.

Problem is they aren't coached to practice or play that way.

Shoes
09-15-2014, 11:17 AM
I will argue that the Steelers have 6-8 guys with Pro Bowl talent too.

Problem is they aren't coached to practice or play that way.

But we have four coaches with head coaching experience on the team. The one in place now is a master in BS.

Craic
09-15-2014, 12:05 PM
Aren't we superior then? :coffee:

Nothing wrong with the thread or the vast majority of answers that have been presented yet. If you came down off your high horse and read a few you might be surprised at some of the insight offered.

Nope.

Not at all. I just remember the utter vitriol against the guy and find it supremely ironic to see this thread now. To be honest, Zu, I can't even remember whether you were a "I hate him, he needs to go" person or a "Meh, he can stay, he can go, I don't care," person. And, by the end, that's pretty much the only two camps there we concerning him. So don't take this as a personal attack against you, if that's how you're thinking of it.

one side only
09-15-2014, 12:24 PM
I voted for Arians, because I think Tomlin is in way over his head, and because what Arians did with the Colts. I don't think our opinion of Arians or Whisenhunt when they were coordinators has anything to do with what all 3 guys have done as head coaches. Our opinions are skewed because I don't think any of us has the time or inclination to follow the Cardinals as much as the Steelers, so we know a lot more about Tomlin as a head coach than Arians. Sample size is much different as well.

Tomlin appears a disinterested observer to me at times. I think his game and clock management skills are below average. I don't think he is a great evaluator of talent. I don't think he has strong personal relationships with players in the same way Cowher did, or as Arians did.

All of this, as we everything we see, is from 30,000 feet. The person I know who works in the front office serves in an administrative capacity and only sees things from that perspective. She reports Tomlin (and Colbert) appear to be adopted Rooney sons and their respective seats are decidedly room temperature. File that in the for what it's worth department.

smokin3000gt
09-15-2014, 12:45 PM
Hire Arians!

lmfao!

muncher
09-15-2014, 02:27 PM
As opposed to sucking Whisenhunt's sack when he is 46-52 lifetime as a head coach?

seeing that 'fans' have graded every tomlin draft as an A or A- and laughed at all of the other nfl teams drafts, it would be logical to say that tomlin has had far more superior talent than whiz or arians has had.
whiz going a little below .500 with terrible drafts and tomlin having a great record(because of cowhers players) and having his own great drafts, then OBVIOUSLY whiz is doing more with less

polamalubeast
09-15-2014, 02:35 PM
I'm not saying that Ken Whisenhunt is better than Tomlin, but no coach would have had success with the QB that Whisenhunt has had between 2010 to 2012.

Dwinsgames
09-15-2014, 02:38 PM
before we stray to far off course here let me say this ....


draft grading is 100% guess work based off college tape ( not pro tape )

any true draft grade has to be done 5 years later because only then do you have a true impression of who was drafted ...


carry on

X-Terminator
09-15-2014, 02:57 PM
seeing that 'fans' have graded every tomlin draft as an A or A- and laughed at all of the other nfl teams drafts, it would be logical to say that tomlin has had far more superior talent than whiz or arians has had.
whiz going a little below .500 with terrible drafts and tomlin having a great record(because of cowhers players) and having his own great drafts, then OBVIOUSLY whiz is doing more with less

I can't tell if this is sarcasm, or if you're actually serious. Please do not tell me that you honestly think the fans' evaluation of draft talent has any relevance on whether or not Tomlin, Arians or Whisenhunt are good or bad coaches. Because if you do, then that is easily the dumbest thing I've ever read in my life.

HollywoodSteel
09-15-2014, 03:06 PM
I asked a question. .Didn't suggest there was one answer above all others now did I? Also open minded people can change their mind as facts and information change. .Try it sometime.

Regardless I stand by what I said at the time. I gave him praise and blame equally as deserved. Or as I believed anyway. I never took it personally one way or the other. Some of you did, as if you were Bruce's children. Never quite figured that one out? And those of us who dared believe Bruce fell out of favor with the Rooney's, that the press didn't just make it up when they said he was almost fired were proven correct over time. You guys really liked telling us how stupid we were when the Steelers changed their mind and lied after the fact.
That is until the Steelers changed their minds again, and lied about it after the fact. :lol:


Also I'm the guy who voted for Tomlin on the poll, for whatever that's worth.


I post what I believe will make interesting topics. Thought this would provide for some interesting conversation.

To be fair to both of you, I've seen you both adjust your take on things as the situation warrants rather than stick to your guns in order to be "right."

X was probably one of the biggest Tomlin defenders last year and has admitted as much when criticizing him this year. I'm not saying he was right or wrong about either take, only that he doesn't blindly stick to any guns either. He just says what he thinks and why. I respect that about both of you.

fansince'76
09-15-2014, 03:25 PM
I'm not saying that Ken Whisenhunt is better than Tomlin, but no coach would have had success with the QB that Whisenhunt has had between 2010 to 2012.

Which was largely his own fault. He mismanaged the QB situation in Arizona in a manner that would have made his idol Cowher proud. Hell, he had Matt Leinart (a bust by every measure of the word) and Kurt Warner (a borderline HoFer) "sharing" the QB position at one point.

X-Terminator
09-15-2014, 03:29 PM
To be fair to both of you, I've seen you both adjust your take on things as the situation warrants rather than stick to your guns in order to be "right."

X was probably one of the biggest Tomlin defenders last year and has admitted as much when criticizing him this year. I'm not saying he was right or wrong about either take, only that he doesn't blindly stick to any guns either. He just says what he thinks and why. I respect that about both of you.

That's because, as I've said, I have a natural distaste for the typical knee-jerk reactionary Steelers fan who wants everyone fired whenever they lose a game. That hasn't changed. However, if there's one thing I can't tolerate is lack of preparation, focus and attention to detail, and that is why I am souring a bit on Tomlin. He needs to step up his game, along with Dick LeBeau. Todd Haley should simply be a clipboard holder with a headset at this point.

Mojouw
09-15-2014, 03:36 PM
I will argue that the Steelers have 6-8 guys with Pro Bowl talent too.

Problem is they aren't coached to practice or play that way.

Cards Roster - http://www.azcardinals.com/team/depth-chart.html

I have Fitzgerald, Ellington, Floyd on offense and Peterson, Mathieu, Campbell, Minter, Washington (suspended?), and Cromartie as players who either have or could
make a Pro Bowl.

For the Steelers I have Ben, Antonio Brown, Decastro, Pouncey, and Bell on offense. On the D I have Timmons. Maybe Troy P - gotta see what he has left in the tank. On that side of the ball Jones, Worilds, Shazier, Heyward, and Tuitt could all concievably enter that converstation. But not as of yet.

Right now the Cards have a more talented roster. Long run, I like Pittsburgh's roster much better.

fansince'76
09-15-2014, 03:43 PM
seeing that 'fans' have graded every tomlin draft as an A or A- and laughed at all of the other nfl teams drafts, it would be logical to say that tomlin has had far more superior talent than whiz or arians has had.
whiz going a little below .500 with terrible drafts and tomlin having a great record(because of cowhers players) and having his own great drafts, then OBVIOUSLY whiz is doing more with less

:rofl2: :rofl2: :rofl2:

HollywoodSteel
09-15-2014, 03:53 PM
That's because, as I've said, I have a natural distaste for the typical knee-jerk reactionary Steelers fan who wants everyone fired whenever they lose a game. That hasn't changed. However, if there's one thing I can't tolerate is lack of preparation, focus and attention to detail, and that is why I am souring a bit on Tomlin. He needs to step up his game, along with Dick LeBeau. Todd Haley should simply be a clipboard holder with a headset at this point.

I know, and I respect that. For the record I never wanted Tomlin fired and still don't because I think it will do more harm than good. I like him, and want to like him even more. I just can't figure out what he's good at exactly (besides his temperament and charisma).

- - - Updated - - -


Cards Roster - http://www.azcardinals.com/team/depth-chart.html

I have Fitzgerald, Ellington, Floyd on offense and Peterson, Mathieu, Campbell, Minter, Washington (suspended?), and Cromartie as players who either have or could
make a Pro Bowl.

For the Steelers I have Ben, Antonio Brown, Decastro, Pouncey, and Bell on offense. On the D I have Timmons. Maybe Troy P - gotta see what he has left in the tank. On that side of the ball Jones, Worilds, Shazier, Heyward, and Tuitt could all concievably enter that converstation. But not as of yet.

Right now the Cards have a more talented roster. Long run, I like Pittsburgh's roster much better.

How dare you? HEATH!!!!!!!

I don't care if he doesn't hold onto everything anymore. He's still HEATH!!!!!!!!

muncher
09-15-2014, 05:37 PM
I can't tell if this is sarcasm, or if you're actually serious. Please do not tell me that you honestly think the fans' evaluation of draft talent has any relevance on whether or not Tomlin, Arians or Whisenhunt are good or bad coaches. Because if you do, then that is easily the dumbest thing I've ever read in my life.


wouldnt it make sense that if a team has 7 years of A or A- drafts while the other teams have had C drafts, then that one team should be far superior than all the others?

X-Terminator
09-15-2014, 05:41 PM
wouldnt it make sense that if a team has 7 years of A or A- drafts while the other teams have had C drafts, then that one team should be far superior than all the others?

Who has said they've had A or A- drafts the last 7 years? Or are you just talking out of your ass again? I don't recall a single person ever saying the Steelers had A or A- drafts. Not even this year's draft. In fact, most people I've talked to or read have taken the organization to task for poor drafting during Tomlin's tenure.

So I think B is the answer, and that you're just talking out of your ass.

HollywoodSteel
09-15-2014, 06:33 PM
Who has said they've had A or A- drafts the last 7 years? Or are you just talking out of your ass again? I don't recall a single person ever saying the Steelers had A or A- drafts. Not even this year's draft. In fact, most people I've talked to or read have taken the organization to task for poor drafting during Tomlin's tenure.

So I think B is the answer, and that you're just talking out of your ass.

On this board, the 2014 draft got 2 As and 7 A-s. I wouldn't consider that to be a lot, but regardless, as you pointed out nobody can really rate a draft until a few years later and most Steelers fans would not give great scores to our drafts under Tomlin in retrospect.

http://www.steelersuniverse.com/forums/poll.php?pollid=186&do=showresults

zulater
09-15-2014, 06:49 PM
Which was largely his own fault. He mismanaged the QB situation in Arizona in a manner that would have made his idol Cowher proud. Hell, he had Matt Leinart (a bust by every measure of the word) and Kurt Warner (a borderline HoFer) "sharing" the QB position at one point.


In fairness when he inherited Leinart he was a recent top ten pick who hadn't disproved himself yet. Obviously the franchise had a lot invested in him ( remember this is before the new CBA) so that's a lot of money to tie up in a bust. I think most any incoming coach would have initially given Leinart the inside track.


If you want to torch Whiz about a qb decision it would be for trading a 2nd round pick for Kevin Kolb and wasting 3 years trying to make it work :doh:


:heh:

Dwinsgames
09-15-2014, 06:53 PM
ok I officially have a headache

tube517
09-15-2014, 07:07 PM
Nobody is giving Denny Green props since Whis won with Denny Green's players? Or are they who we thought they were?

:chuckle:

Godfather
09-15-2014, 07:41 PM
We need to address the REAL question when it comes to comparing Tomlin, Wiz, and Arians:

What do you do if you have to bang one, marry one, and kill one?

zulater
09-15-2014, 08:04 PM
We need to address the REAL question when it comes to comparing Tomlin, Wiz, and Arians:

What do you do if you have to bang one, marry one, and kill one?B


Bang Whis. Remember he's a former "tight end".:bananadoggywow: Kill Arians, hell the Steelers tried and failed to retire him, so kill him for his insolence. :wink02: Marry Tomlin. Once hired a Steeler coach doesn't leave until they want to. :pin:

HollywoodSteel
09-15-2014, 08:05 PM
We need to address the REAL question when it comes to comparing Tomlin, Wiz, and Arians:

What do you do if you have to bang one, marry one, and kill one?

Easy. You kill yourself first and avoid the other two questions. :)

Lambert_Loonie
09-15-2014, 08:25 PM
We need to address the REAL question when it comes to comparing Tomlin, Wiz, and Arians:

What do you do if you have to bang one, marry one, and kill one?

Fuck Tomlin because his coaching has fucked over our playoff chances since 2011.
Marry Arians because he comes across as big softie.
Kill Whiz because... well, I had to pick somebody.

Dwinsgames
09-15-2014, 09:07 PM
D) none of the above

I don't roll that way so not gonna " do" or Marry any of them

and none of them is worth me spending a moment in prison let alone the cost of the lead

X-Terminator
09-15-2014, 09:31 PM
On this board, the 2014 draft got 2 As and 7 A-s. I wouldn't consider that to be a lot, but regardless, as you pointed out nobody can really rate a draft until a few years later and most Steelers fans would not give great scores to our drafts under Tomlin in retrospect.

http://www.steelersuniverse.com/forums/poll.php?pollid=186&do=showresults

OK, well then I stand corrected on this year's draft, at least here. I am not really a draftnik, so I don't pay attention to that kind of stuff. I just check out who we drafted, get as much info as I can about them and then go from there. I don't "rate" or "grade" drafts - it's a waste of time when no one will know how this draft class will fare for at least 3 years. The draft is like being a meterologist - being right some of the time makes you look like a genius. Just ask Mel Kiper, Jr.

Dwinsgames
09-15-2014, 10:45 PM
OK, well then I stand corrected on this year's draft, at least here. I am not really a draftnik, so I don't pay attention to that kind of stuff. I just check out who we drafted, get as much info as I can about them and then go from there. I don't "rate" or "grade" drafts - it's a waste of time when no one will know how this draft class will fare for at least 3 years. The draft is like being a meterologist - being right some of the time makes you look like a genius. Just ask Mel Kiper, Jr.



Aaron Curry is a no miss prospect and the most NFL ready as I have seen in years ~Mel Kiper Jr.~

less than 4 years later he is washed out of the league and never had a statement making play that was a positive

just goes to show you how easily one can be wrong when trying to judge college talent and then insert them into the next level to play against the best of the best .... Stars from College are more often than not wash outs at the next level ...

306,221 Senior HS football players

5.7% of those will make a College squad

1% of those college players will play in the nfl

0.08% HS to Pro ......

and many of those wash out before they ever begin

so saying its a crap shoot is not close to an under statement

http://www.collegesportsscholarships.com/percentage-high-school-athletes-ncaa-college.htm

Texasteel
09-16-2014, 11:35 AM
OK, well then I stand corrected on this year's draft, at least here. I am not really a draftnik, so I don't pay attention to that kind of stuff. I just check out who we drafted, get as much info as I can about them and then go from there. I don't "rate" or "grade" drafts - it's a waste of time when no one will know how this draft class will fare for at least 3 years. The draft is like being a meterologist - being right some of the time makes you look like a genius. Just ask Mel Kiper, Jr.

Since this seemed to be a claim involving the whole board I think you need to look at the whole poll.
In 2014 the voting went,,,,, B+ 34%, B 34%, A- 20%
In 2013 B+ 32%, B 23%, A- 18%

NCSteeler
09-17-2014, 11:16 AM
Ok , so pretty much we can replace Tomlin with a random word generator at this point. Response to ? about tackling

“Often times is about a plan or an approach and having a hard-core plan and recognizing the positions that your position puts you in, the manner which you approach the ball from a variety of positions on the field and having a plan to execute fundamental tackling accordingly,” said Tomlin. “I think the more that you play, the more you are in positions on footballs and you are approaching the ball inside out, you learn to maintain that consistency, or you learn to chew up the free grass associated with a guy who has to cover great distances. All of those things can be done in a practice setting without actually tackling, and we have been emphasizing that. We’ll continue and we’ll expect the tackling to improve because of it.

“It’s just about improving on a day to day basis and some fundamental things individually and collectively.”

GBMelBlount
09-17-2014, 02:30 PM
Ok , so pretty much we can replace Tomlin with a random word generator at this point. Response to ? about tackling

“Often times is about a plan or an approach and having a hard-core plan and recognizing the positions that your position puts you in, the manner which you approach the ball from a variety of positions on the field and having a plan to execute fundamental tackling accordingly,” said Tomlin. “I think the more that you play, the more you are in positions on footballs and you are approaching the ball inside out, you learn to maintain that consistency, or you learn to chew up the free grass associated with a guy who has to cover great distances. All of those things can be done in a practice setting without actually tackling, and we have been emphasizing that. We’ll continue and we’ll expect the tackling to improve because of it.

“It’s just about improving on a day to day basis and some fundamental things individually and collectively.”

Absolutely made my day!

:rofl2:

zulater
09-21-2014, 06:12 PM
I want to change my vote. :chuckle: ( I voted for Tomlin.) Damn beats San Fran with a back up qb. I also thought he handled the Dwyer situation about as well as you could handle it. So it's no knock on Tomlin if you think Bruce is the better head coach. Because right now there aint a whole lot of guys you'd put before him.

And yes you can color me surprised that he's this good.

tube517
09-21-2014, 07:16 PM
Meh, he's winning with Whisenhunt's team. :chuckle:

Texasteel
09-21-2014, 07:23 PM
Cards are looking pretty good right now aren't they.

I didn't want him to leave in the first place, particularly seeing what we replaced him with. but could understand why some did. Glad that BA is doing so well. How ever, I watched Chuck struggle, I watched Bill struggle, and not ready to give up on Mike because we are struggling right now.

fansince'76
09-21-2014, 07:28 PM
Meh, he's winning with Whisenhunt's team. :chuckle:

OK, "muncher." :lol: :lol: :lol:

X-Terminator
09-21-2014, 11:54 PM
I want to change my vote. :chuckle: ( I voted for Tomlin.) Damn beats San Fran with a back up qb. I also thought he handled the Dwyer situation about as well as you could handle it. So it's no knock on Tomlin if you think Bruce is the better head coach. Because right now there aint a whole lot of guys you'd put before him.

And yes you can color me surprised that he's this good.

And then Mike turns around and does the same thing despite Gilbert sucking ass as usual, Todd Haley sucking ass as usual, and 3 players injured on defense.

At any rate, at least this win keeps the vultures from circling over Tomlin's head for a week.

fansince'76
09-22-2014, 12:00 AM
At any rate, at least this win keeps the vultures from circling over Tomlin's head for a week.

I'm hoping it keeps two trolls in particular at bay for the next week, at least.

Lambert_Loonie
09-22-2014, 12:16 AM
Meh, he's winning with Whisenhunt's team. :chuckle:

And there's a good portion of Steelers on that team...

Good Lord, Arians is winning with Cowher's & Tomlin's players and he's not even coaching the Steelers. :P

polamalubeast
09-28-2014, 03:52 PM
.....

86WARD
09-28-2014, 04:21 PM
Anyone.

st33lersguy
09-28-2014, 06:09 PM
How about who's a better NFL head coach, Mike Tomlin or Barry Switzer?

ALLD
09-28-2014, 07:40 PM
I think we would have done better with Wiz and Russ Grimm, but would have missed two out of the three biggest plays in Super Bowl history as the Cards would have never gone.

polamalubeast
10-14-2014, 07:43 PM
Instead of driving him out of town, perhaps #Steelers should have made Bruce Arians the Head Coach

https://twitter.com/WilliamsonNFL

86WARD
10-14-2014, 08:17 PM
How about who's a better NFL head coach, Mike Tomlin or Barry Switzer?

Same difference?

zulater
10-14-2014, 08:31 PM
Arians beats the teams he's supposed to beat virtually every time. You do that and you're always in the hunt.

zulater
11-16-2014, 06:21 PM
Anyone forget to vote? :heh:

polamalubeast
11-16-2014, 06:24 PM
9-1 with a team with many injuries(Palmer,Dockett,etc)


Unbelievable!!!!

He is now 28-10 as HC

Dwinsgames
11-16-2014, 06:32 PM
to answer the question in the OP ... it sure as hell looks like it

st33lersguy
11-16-2014, 06:35 PM
Definitely think Arians has found his true calling. Much better head coach than offensive coordinator

polamalubeast
11-16-2014, 06:35 PM
Definitely think Arians has found his true calling. Much better head coach than offensive coordinator

But he is also the OC in Arizona

st33lersguy
11-16-2014, 06:40 PM
But he is also the OC in Arizona

No he isn't. Harold Goldwin is their OC, just looked it up. Apparently he was hired by Steelers in 07 (don't remember him) and he has followed Arians everywhere he went

polamalubeast
11-16-2014, 06:44 PM
No he isn't. Harold Goldwin is their OC, just looked it up. Apparently he was hired by Steelers in 07 (don't remember him) and he has followed Arians everywhere he went

But it's Arians who call the plays

GBMelBlount
11-16-2014, 06:58 PM
I think becoming a good nfl coach is like becoming a good nfl player....it takes time....a lot more time to develop as a coach than a player in fact.

Tomlin is still one of the youngest headcoaches in the NFL.

I will give him another year or two to get his head in the game and grow a set.

I do however feel a lot of the apathy that has been evident to me the last few years and shitty performances against shitty teams is largely on Tomlin.

ALLD
11-17-2014, 01:56 PM
It's all about putting a hat on a hat and defending every blade of grass. You are what your record says you are. BA is better, he has an ax to grind and was not gifted anything.

Mojouw
11-17-2014, 02:44 PM
It's all about putting a hat on a hat and defending every blade of grass. You are what your record says you are. BA is better, he has an ax to grind and was not gifted anything.

He was "gifted" one of the best defenses in football. Not saying that Arians hasn't proven to be a hell of a coach, but that Arizona team had a ton of talent on the defensive side of the ball even before Arians took over and helped improve it.

Figured that they would be fine on offense. Arians made Kelly Holcomb a 4,000 yard passer!

The Bark
11-17-2014, 08:57 PM
At halftime of this Titans game, I'm just about ready to give up watching the Steelers period until Tomlin is gone. I'm that f'n disgusted with his coaching.

zulater
11-17-2014, 08:57 PM
I think becoming a good nfl coach is like becoming a good nfl player....it takes time....a lot more time to develop as a coach than a player in fact.

Tomlin is still one of the youngest headcoaches in the NFL.

I will give him another year or two to get his head in the game and grow a set.

I do however feel a lot of the apathy that has been evident to me the last few years and shitty performances against shitty teams is largely on Tomlin.


He's young and stupid and incompetent.

st33lersguy
11-17-2014, 09:02 PM
I think becoming a good nfl coach is like becoming a good nfl player....it takes time....a lot more time to develop as a coach than a player in fact.

Tomlin is still one of the youngest headcoaches in the NFL.

I will give him another year or two to get his head in the game and grow a set.

I do however feel a lot of the apathy that has been evident to me the last few years and shitty performances against shitty teams is largely on Tomlin.

He's had 8 years to grow a set. Time to pull the plug on him

GBMelBlount
11-17-2014, 09:06 PM
He's young and stupid and incompetent.

So who do you blame for the 4 turnovers on offense last week and only 6 points on offense tonight?

Tomlin?

zulater
11-17-2014, 09:18 PM
So who do you blame for the 4 turnovers on offense last week and only 6 points on offense tonight?

Tomlin?

I blame him for a team that has no clue how to play a road game. How's that?

- - - Updated - - -

They score here this one is over.

- - - Updated - - -

I love ya GB. But please don't try to defend Tomlin tonight. Maybe tommorow. But not tonight the way this team is playing.

st33lersguy
11-17-2014, 09:23 PM
Here's a more appropriate question, who's a better head coach Mike Tomlin or Chuck Noll's predecessor Bill Austin?

dislocatedday
11-17-2014, 09:36 PM
That's a TD. No huddle and the team moves the ball and scores......send Haley to the locker room for the rest of the evening please (I know Ben did make some poor throws in the first half, so he contributed to the team going in this hole, but I have not seen Haley adjust his play calling for the blitz all night).

GBMelBlount
11-17-2014, 09:37 PM
I blame him for a team that has no clue how to play a road game. How's that?

- - - Updated - - -

They score here this one is over.

- - - Updated - - -

I love ya GB. But please don't try to defend Tomlin tonight. Maybe tommorow. But not tonight the way this team is playing.

My point is simply that Ben is as big a factor in whether we win or lose.

When he has a chip on his shoulder and something to prove he wins.

When he doesn't...well you do the math...

dislocatedday
11-17-2014, 09:37 PM
That's a TD. No huddle and the team moves the ball and scores......send Haley to the locker room for the rest of the evening please (I know Ben did make some poor throws in the first half, so he contributed to the team going in this hole, but I have not seen Haley adjust his play calling for the blitz all night).

Sorry..wrong thread. I thought I was in the Game Day thread...DOH!!