View Full Version : Report: Antonio Brown confronted Todd Haley on sidelines
vader29
09-18-2013, 09:10 AM
Offensive coordinator Todd Haley's combative, in-your-face style concerned plenty of folks in Pittsburgh, especially since the man he replaced, Bruce Arians, was tight with the franchise quarterback Ben Roethlisberger. And while Haley and Big Ben had their ups and downs in 2012, it was hard to argue with the results through nine games: The Steelers were 6-3, Roethlisberger threw for 17 touchdowns vs. 4 interceptions, he had a passer rating near 100, and people were talking about him as a legitimate MVP candidate.
But an injury against the Chiefs ended all that, and the Steelers limped to an 8-8 finish. And now, nine months later, they still haven't recovered. They're 0-2, the offense is anemic, and at least one player is unhappy with his role in the ineptitude. Details via the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette's Ed Bouchette.
"Wide receiver Antonio Brown confronted Haley (on the sidelines during the Monday night game against Cincinnati)," Bouchette wrote Wednesday. "Brown angrily complained to the coach that not enough pass plays were called for him, several sources told the Post-Gazette.
"Specifics of the argument were hard to come by but sources say that Haley was upset by Brown's actions and that the two were still seething about it Tuesday. Brown's complaint to Haley was harsh enough and the reaction to it along the sideline volatile to the point that many people there noticed, although it was not shown nor apparently caught on camera by anyone, including ESPN, which broadcast the game."
Make of this what you will, but Haley has a history of getting into it with his players, and he doesn't discriminate. Targets include pain in the asses like Terrell Owens and boy scouts like Kurt Warner.
Read more: http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/23714311/report-antonio-brown-confronted-todd-haley-on-sidelines
zulater
09-18-2013, 09:26 AM
I'm no fan of Haley's at this point, but Antonio Brown is coming off like a diva me first wide receiver here. And coming of the season he just completed he should keep his bitching out of the public eye, or better yet, go out and earn your targets.
NJarhead
09-18-2013, 09:41 AM
I'm no fan of Haley's at this point, but Antonio Brown is coming off like a diva me first wide receiver here. And coming of the season he just completed he should keep his bitching out of the public eye, or better yet, go out and earn your targets.
Yep. He's not the first though and he won't be the last. This isn't on Haley IMO.
Moose
09-18-2013, 09:55 AM
Losing creates this type of attitudes. I bet there is now, and will be more bickering, name calling and finger pointing in the house until the winning starts.
st33lersguy
09-18-2013, 10:38 AM
:doh: The very last thing an 0-2 team needs is confrontation within the team
NJarhead
09-18-2013, 10:43 AM
:doh: The very last thing an 0-2 team needs is confrontation within the team
Yep, but like Moose said, losing creates that very environment. Winning cures it.
zulater
09-18-2013, 10:46 AM
Yep, but like Moose said, losing creates that very environment. Winning cures it.
As they say, "winning is the best deodorant."
86WARD
09-18-2013, 12:23 PM
Young Money!!
The WR Bible!
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Dwinsgames
09-18-2013, 12:36 PM
ya know its easy to get down on Brown for this , however we do not know what was said and or how it started ....
Haley is a Fiery guy who has kept his cool since coming here but who is to say a mild remark didn't set him off and things got out of hand ?
we simply do not know ....
Brown may have said ... Todd I have been running the same hook route over and over and the defender is close to jumping it , if we fake that same hook and take it deep I think I could beat him badly , and Haley being the guy he is ( add in the frustrations of things not going well ) lets brown have it and then Brown gets pissed ......
I could see that happening ......
I could be 100% wrong too but the point is we just do not know what started it , or what was said or by whom ... all we know is their is an issue ..
so laying blame is kind of a bad idea IMO ... just sayin
st33lersguy
09-18-2013, 02:00 PM
Yep, but like Moose said, losing creates that very environment. Winning cures it.
Yeah, but it takes a team coming together to turn things around and start winning, this bickering will only perpetuate losing
Master Blaster
09-18-2013, 02:18 PM
It is everything that you guys have stated it is.
I see this as a negative cause and affect reaction by a very proud and competitive young receiver, with high expectations, on a team that has been the model of consistent success for decades. I like that he's venting his frustration over losing. I'd be worried if he wasn't angry about losing. I also hope that the rest of the team feels the same way and as a consequence, they are highly motivated to make the changes, individually and collectively, to start winning again.
Count Steeler
09-18-2013, 04:14 PM
Tomlin should be confronting Haley, albeit behind closed doors. Some of the play calling from the sidelines was absolutely dumbfounded. I think if was the first possession after the Moye TD and Ben was getting in a groove. Next 2 calls? Run up the middle. Reverse with COTCHERY!!!!!. I think it was about 3rd and 17. Dumb.
And these idiotic WR screens. Does anyone in the NFL not know when that play is coming? The Bengals CBs were all over that play. Usually for negative yardage to a 2 yard gain. Wow.
Craic
09-18-2013, 04:38 PM
Tomlin should be confronting Haley, albeit behind closed doors. Some of the play calling from the sidelines was absolutely dumbfounded. I think if was the first possession after the Moye TD and Ben was getting in a groove. Next 2 calls? Run up the middle. Reverse with COTCHERY!!!!!. I think it was about 3rd and 17. Dumb.
And these idiotic WR screens. Does anyone in the NFL not know when that play is coming? The Bengals CBs were all over that play. Usually for negative yardage to a 2 yard gain. Wow.
Makes you laugh when people still desire Cowherball, doesn't it. Run, run, pass, punt.
steeldawg
09-18-2013, 05:29 PM
It is everything that you guys have stated it is.
I see this as a negative cause and affect reaction by a very proud and competitive young receiver, with high expectations, on a team that has been the model of consistent success for decades. I like that he's venting his frustration over losing. I'd be worried if he wasn't angry about losing. I also hope that the rest of the team feels the same way and as a consequence, they are highly motivated to make the changes, individually and collectively, to start winning again.
Except he wasn't upset over losing he was upset over his targets. Personally it doesn't bother me because this offensive system sucks and anything to ruffle the feathers of haley I applaud, But he was upset because he wasn't getting the ball enough not because we were behind on the scoreboard.
Craic
09-18-2013, 05:35 PM
Except he wasn't upset over losing he was upset over his targets. Personally it doesn't bother me because this offensive system sucks and anything to ruffle the feathers of haley I applaud, But he was upset because he wasn't getting the ball enough not because we were behind on the scoreboard.
Let's see.
P1. Antonio Brown has been our most consistent and best WR since Hines Ward.
P2. Antonio Brown is the best open field runner on this team.
C1. The ball in Antonio Brown's hands is the best chance of advancing this team upfield.
P1. The ball in Antonio Brown's hands is the best chance of advancing this team upfield.
P2. This team has problems advancing upfield.
C2. The ball should be in Antonio Brown's hands more often.
P1. The ball should be in Antonio Brown's hands more often so we can advance the team upfield.
P2. In order to put points on the board, we must advance upfield.
C3. Putting the ball in Antionio Brown's hands is the best way to advance the team upfield so that we can score points.
Conclusion: Antonio Brown not getting the ball enough and the team behind on the scoreboard is the same issue.
Thank you, that is all.
vader29
09-18-2013, 05:40 PM
Steelers' Brown acknowledges sideline confrontation with Haley
Steelers wide receiver Antonio Brown said today that he sought out Todd Haley along the sideline in the second half Monday night in Cincinnati to "see what he can do to get you involved" in the game.
Brown confirmed that he had gone to Haley on the sideline during the game to discuss his involvement in the passing game. The Pittsburgh Post-Gazette reported that he angrily confronted the Steelers' offensive coordinator about not getting enough passes thrown to him.
"Being a hungry play-maker on the team, I did what any good player around should do," Brown said. "You talk to the person who controls the scheme of the game and see what he can do to get you involved, or see what you can do to get things going ...
"I didn't think it was a big issue. We just have to find a way to win. I guess this is what happens when you lose."
He said he went to Haley not out of selfishness but as a way to help the Steelers win, although they dropped to 0-2 with their 20-10 loss to the Bengals.
"That's why I did it the right way," Brown said today after practice. "But you take it to the person who has control' and working together with the offensive coordinator is definitely a positive ...
"I asked him what is he seeing? I tried to go over thoughts' what he's thinking, to see if we could develop a repetition and get things going for our team."
Read more: http://www.post-gazette.com/stories/sports/steelers/steelers-brown-acknowledges-sideline-confrontation-with-haley-703861/#ixzz2fHqx0Tyr
Count Steeler
09-18-2013, 05:41 PM
Makes you laugh when people still desire Cowherball, doesn't it. Run, run, pass, punt.
Cowherball had it's day. Time to get innovative. I can say our offense lacks imagination and creativity. Pretty damning when Ben and sandlot outscores the "gameplan".
steeldawg
09-18-2013, 06:15 PM
Let's see.
P1. Antonio Brown has been our most consistent and best WR since Hines Ward.
P2. Antonio Brown is the best open field runner on this team.
C1. The ball in Antonio Brown's hands is the best chance of advancing this team upfield.
P1. The ball in Antonio Brown's hands is the best chance of advancing this team upfield.
P2. This team has problems advancing upfield.
C2. The ball should be in Antonio Brown's hands more often.
P1. The ball should be in Antonio Brown's hands more often so we can advance the team upfield.
P2. In order to put points on the board, we must advance upfield.
C3. Putting the ball in Antionio Brown's hands is the best way to advance the team upfield so that we can score points.
Conclusion: Antonio Brown not getting the ball enough and the team behind on the scoreboard is the same issue.
Thank you, that is all.
Tell yourself whatever you have to. He is not getting open, he is only open when ben breaks the pocket or extends the play. He doesn't have a downfield threat on the other side and defenses are taking away his intermediate routes. Its not like he is not getting looks, he has 16 targets through 2 games and it has translated to nothing. Trying to target one guy is foolish in a quick hitting offense the passes will go according to the defense, so the ball is going to be spread around.
Craic
09-18-2013, 06:29 PM
If it makes you feel better, but since when has Putting the ball in Antonio browns hands put points on the scoreboard?
Ahh, illogic-san, you again miss point. Never did I say he puts points on board. Logic dictates move ball down field by Brown. Closer to endzone, more chance of points on board by whomever on field.
Try again illogic-san, it shall come eventually.
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Cowherball had it's day. Time to get innovative. I can say our offense lacks imagination and creativity. Pretty damning when Ben and sandlot outscores the "gameplan".
Lord, ain't that the truth. Sadly however, I'm almost to the point that I'D welcome Cowherball back over what he have currently, even though I know that's a dead-end street.
Dwinsgames
09-18-2013, 06:35 PM
Lord, ain't that the truth. Sadly however, I'm almost to the point that I'D welcome Cowherball back over what he have currently, even though I know that's a dead-end street.
I keep hearing that sort of talk but I just do not buy it ...
bottom line is if you possess the football for the majority of the game the opponents opportunities are limited and your defense is fresh to make stops ....
you do not have to score 40 points in this league to win games , you just have to score 1 more than the opposition does ....
look no further than Seattle last week 19 pass attempts with just 8 completions and they whipped the 49ers 29-3 ....
Solid Def and a good running game will NEVER go out of style if you have the people in place to make it happen , no its not " flashy " and if you get behind quick it is tough to recover from but it does work as well today as it did 20 years ago and will continue to work moving forward as long as someone is willing to use it ....
steeldawg
09-18-2013, 07:01 PM
Ahh, illogic-san, you again miss point. Never did I say he puts points on board. Logic dictates move ball down field by Brown. Closer to endzone, more chance of points on board by whomever on field.
Try again illogic-san, it shall come eventually.
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Lord, ain't that the truth. Sadly however, I'm almost to the point that I'D welcome Cowherball back over what he have currently, even though I know that's a dead-end street.
Not illogical, hes been getting looks and our offense is inept and no I don't buy the idea that the answer to our offensive woes is to throw more passes to Antonio brown unless their is some unstoppable version of the bubble screen we have yet to unveil.
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Ahh, illogic-san, you again miss point. Never did I say he puts points on board. Logic dictates move ball down field by Brown. Closer to endzone, more chance of points on board by whomever on field.
Try again illogic-san, it shall come eventually.
- - - Updated - - -
Lord, ain't that the truth. Sadly however, I'm almost to the point that I'D welcome Cowherball back over what he have currently, even though I know that's a dead-end street.
Not illogical, hes been getting looks and our offense is inept and no I don't buy the idea that the answer to our offensive woes is to throw more passes to Antonio brown unless their is some unstoppable version of the bubble screen we have yet to unveil.
- - - Updated - - -
Ahh, illogic-san, you again miss point. Never did I say he puts points on board. Logic dictates move ball down field by Brown. Closer to endzone, more chance of points on board by whomever on field.
Try again illogic-san, it shall come eventually.
- - - Updated - - -
Lord, ain't that the truth. Sadly however, I'm almost to the point that I'D welcome Cowherball back over what he have currently, even though I know that's a dead-end street.
Not illogical, hes been getting looks and our offense is inept and no I don't buy the idea that the answer to our offensive woes is to throw more passes to Antonio brown unless their is some unstoppable version of the bubble screen we have yet to unveil.
Seven
09-18-2013, 09:24 PM
I agree with Brown. If you have replay, go back and watch the game again focusing on Antonio. The coaches view will give you a good look at the receivers. He had a pretty decent day by our current standards. I don't think making him a higher read on more plays will solve all of our problems, but there were some plays where Ben never even got to him and he was beating his man. I don't think this is him being a "diva." I think he was trying to help.
Tell yourself whatever you have to. He is not getting open, he is only open when ben breaks the pocket or extends the play. He doesn't have a downfield threat on the other side and defenses are taking away his intermediate routes. Its not like he is not getting looks, he has 16 targets through 2 games and it has translated to nothing. Trying to target one guy is foolish in a quick hitting offense the passes will go according to the defense, so the ball is going to be spread around.
He is not open because the safety is cheating to his side. HE IS THAT MUCH OF A THREAT!!!! If we gave more attention to the short passing game...we would make the defenders respect their zones or they would pay the price with quick hits to Cotchery, Sanders, the Tight end or to the safety valve in the flat. Once they have to fall back into their zones it does two things. 1) actually opens lanes for the run game 2) allows Brown to go one on one with a CB and I'll take that matchup most of the time.
Craic
09-18-2013, 11:37 PM
I keep hearing that sort of talk but I just do not buy it ...
bottom line is if you possess the football for the majority of the game the opponents opportunities are limited and your defense is fresh to make stops ....
you do not have to score 40 points in this league to win games , you just have to score 1 more than the opposition does ....
look no further than Seattle last week 19 pass attempts with just 8 completions and they whipped the 49ers 29-3 ....
Solid Def and a good running game will NEVER go out of style if you have the people in place to make it happen , no its not " flashy " and if you get behind quick it is tough to recover from but it does work as well today as it did 20 years ago and will continue to work moving forward as long as someone is willing to use it ....
The problem is that we always lost in the AFCCG with it because we met a team that had the ability to use what little clock time gave them to drive and score, and we could never react to that. Further, we met teams that had defenses that could stop the run. That is why it's a thing of the past. I'm not saying a good running game wouldn't help us. Heck, I'd love to see us go out in the fourth quarter and eat up twelve minutes of clock time with a run, run, run, drive . . . as long as we drove the field and scored. What I am saying though, is that come playoffs, we will eventually meet a team that will shut down the run and leave us with nothing. THAT was the problem with Cowherball, and that was why Ben was able to push us over the hump.
Matter of fact, (and I think you said this yourself) if you look at those playoff games, what really happened was that Ben passed, passed, passed until we got a lead, and then we took the air out of the football. It makes the stats look skewed because we ran so much in the last part of the third quarter and fourth quarter, but we did it because Ben had already put us up by 10 or 14 points.
steeldawg
09-19-2013, 05:54 AM
He is not open because the safety is cheating to his side. HE IS THAT MUCH OF A THREAT!!!! If we gave more attention to the short passing game...we would make the defenders respect their zones or they would pay the price with quick hits to Cotchery, Sanders, the Tight end or to the safety valve in the flat. Once they have to fall back into their zones it does two things. 1) actually opens lanes for the run game 2) allows Brown to go one on one with a CB and I'll take that matchup most of the time.
They are not playing zones against us they are playing press man coverage and stacking the box. You expect the defense to just fall back into a zone so you can complete some passes you have to make them and right now we don't have a guy who can do that. Brown is a good short yardage receiver but he is no threat to defenses . Gave more attention to the short passing game??? That's all we have been doing, that is our whole offensive scheme. Im not saying brown is a bad receiver Im just saying he doesn't provide enough of a threat down the field to back any defenses off.
zulater
09-19-2013, 06:57 AM
If Mike Wallace was part of this team today does anyone really believe their record wouldn't be 0-2? ( besides steeldawg, who of course most likely thinks we'd be 2-0 right now. :chuckle:)
NCSteeler
09-19-2013, 08:16 AM
It is everything that you guys have stated it is.
I see this as a negative cause and affect reaction by a very proud and competitive young receiver, with high expectations, on a team that has been the model of consistent success for decades. I like that he's venting his frustration over losing. I'd be worried if he wasn't angry about losing. I also hope that the rest of the team feels the same way and as a consequence, they are highly motivated to make the changes, individually and collectively, to start winning again.
I agree, easily a young guy not handling his frustration correctly, doesn't make him a diva or me first cry baby.
BTW, a little tidbit from CBS
ESPN analyst and former Steelers running back Jerome Bettis offered up a plan Tuesday to fix this mess.
"They have a lot of work to do in a lot of different areas in order for them to become a playoff team," Bettis said on SportsCenter. "If I was Mike Tomlin, the first thing I would do was address the offense. And I'd blow up the offense. I'd say, Here's what's going to happen, guys. I'm going to go with this no-huddle offense because I want to do two things:
1. I want to keep the ball in the best player's hands. And that's Ben Roethlisberger. I want to give him every opportunity to win the football game. Because I can win and lose, and that's fine, as long as my best player is deciding the outcome of the game.
2. Slow down that pass rush."
Hell, it's worth a try.
NJarhead
09-19-2013, 08:21 AM
I agree, easily a young guy not handling his frustration correctly, doesn't make him a diva or me first cry baby.
BTW, a little tidbit from CBS
I see what Jerome's saying and Lord knows, I'm ready for a win, but we still need to be able to run the ball and I don't want Ben taking all of those hits.
zulater
09-19-2013, 08:31 AM
My favorite play call of the game was the 3rd and 2 run to Redman. :sarcasm:
steeldawg
09-19-2013, 09:27 AM
My favorite play call of the game was the 3rd and 2 run to Redman. :sarcasm:
Out of the shotgun with no fullback made it even better
Moose
09-19-2013, 11:22 AM
bottom line is if you possess the football for the majority of the game the opponents opportunities are limited and your defense is fresh to make stops ....
you do not have to score 40 points in this league to win games , you just have to score 1 more than the opposition does ...
Solid Def and a good running game will NEVER go out of style if you have the people in place to make it happen , no its not " flashy " and if you get behind quick it is tough to recover from but it does work as well today as it did 20 years ago and will continue to work moving forward as long as someone is willing to use it ....
My thought's exactly ! Couldn't have said it any better....thanks !
They are not playing zones against us they are playing press man coverage and stacking the box. You expect the defense to just fall back into a zone so you can complete some passes you have to make them and right now we don't have a guy who can do that. Brown is a good short yardage receiver but he is no threat to defenses . Gave more attention to the short passing game??? That's all we have been doing, that is our whole offensive scheme. Im not saying brown is a bad receiver Im just saying he doesn't provide enough of a threat down the field to back any defenses off.
Uh...no. There isn't a team in the league that plays pressman on every play. And even when they do, the Free Safety often doesnt have a WR, but rather has the responsibilty to look for the run OR provide deep coverage in their "zone" or area.
To be specific. The slant...fade...hitch.. and option..are all 3 step routes. Every other route breaks between 12-15 yards. The CB were reading the 3-step and if there is was no break...they looked for the post...dig...flag... and the comeback (especially if Ben comes out fo the pocket). So when Antonio didnt break at 3, the safety was looking for two things: He got ready for the double move if he broke at 12-15 and covered high just in case the CB got burnt.... or if he didnt see the break, he turned and ran, because it was going long and they made Ben throw into double coverage.
The safety "cheated" very often because they didnt respect our ability to run and because we never established a short passing game.
That , my friend, is a breakdown of fundamentals...not an argument based solely on the fact that you wish we would have kept Wallace.
steeldawg
09-19-2013, 04:55 PM
Uh...no. There isn't a team in the league that plays pressman on every play. And even when they do, the Free Safety often doesnt have a WR, but rather has the responsibilty to look for the run OR provide deep coverage in their "zone" or area.
To be specific. The slant...fade...hitch.. and option..are all 3 step routes. Every other route breaks between 12-15 yards. The CB were reading the 3-step and if there is was no break...they looked for the post...dig...flag... and the comeback (especially if Ben comes out fo the pocket). So when Antonio didnt break at 3, the safety was looking for two things: He got ready for the double move if he broke at 12-15 and covered high just in case the CB got burnt.... or if he didnt see the break, he turned and ran, because it was going long and they made Ben throw into double coverage.
The safety "cheated" very often because they didnt respect our ability to run and because we never established a short passing game.
That , my friend, is a breakdown of fundamentals...not an argument based solely on the fact that you wish we would have kept Wallace.
Who said every play? For the most part that's we are seeing on first and second downs which is why we cant establish a running game. Its also why you saw ben trying to throw deep down the sidelines he was trying to back the safeties up. Our whole offense is predicated on the short passing game no need for safeties to cheat over the top. Teams will not allow us to establish a short passing game or a run game because they know they stack the box and blitz, they don't respect our receivers. Brown was not running option routes out there he was running slants and hitches and when those were taken away they went to the bubble screen. There is a reason when the steelers go down the field its usually to sanders and not brown. You can talk about route fundamentals all you want but Im talking about what was happening during the game.
Who said every play? For the most part that's we are seeing on first and second downs which is why we cant establish a running game. Its also why you saw ben trying to throw deep down the sidelines he was trying to back the safeties up. Our whole offense is predicated on the short passing game no need for safeties to cheat over the top. Teams will not allow us to establish a short passing game or a run game because they know they stack the box and blitz, they don't respect our receivers. Brown was not running option routes out there he was running slants and hitches and when those were taken away they went to the bubble screen. There is a reason when the steelers go down the field its usually to sanders and not brown. You can talk about route fundamentals all you want but Im talking about what was happening during the game.
I'm talking about what was happening during the game also and "trying" to explain to you why and when the safety cheated to Antonios side. THATS the part that you seem to either not understand or you are over simplifing the game to the point of being inaccurate.
Breaking down a game is much more than "Brown couldnt get open".
The inability of Cotchery and Sanders to regularly pick up yards in the short game and the ineptness of our O-line to sustain blocks, ALLOWS teams to "cheat" the safety to the Z reciever side.
Very basic. Its the way its been since the beginnning of time.
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