If Ben can't go against the Ravens ?

[zulater]

Should we consider starting Brian Hoyer?

I know it sounds crazy. But scale down the game plan ( remember KISS keep it simple stupid) And just the fact that he's not old and completely shot physically might give you a better chance than Leftwich or Batch?

[tube517]

Yes

[Devilsdancefloor]

I havent seen him ever pl;ay in the NFL, but at MSU he was a really good QB, but that always doesnt translate to the NFL. I am not giving u on chuck, but we cant throw the ball al davis style with him that is not his strong suit. If the steelers can find a RB that will not fumble the ball or stick with one or 2, then i dont see a problem with chuck

[zulater]

If nothing else maybe we can determine if Hoyer is worth keeping around next year? Obviously Batch and Leftwich both are gone next season, so we need someone to compete for the back up spot. That being said I want them to either draft a developmental qb or better yet sign a back up who can play. Maybe a Chad Henne, or Matt Moore type player who has some NFL cred, without being totally over the hill and injury prone.

[plenewken]

This guy can't be worse than what Botch showed us yesterday, so I'd say yes.

[zulater]

Here's an imaginary locker room speech I could hear Tomlin giving this week.

"Ok guys, we're playing one more game without Ben. Anyone here who thinks we can't win in Baltimore without Ben, just clear out now! I don't want losing attitudes goint into the game! Do I make myself clear?"

A few throats are cleared, then some chairs are heard to scratch the floor, within seconds, one veteran gets up and leaves, then another, then the avalanche ensues until finally one player is left. It's Charlie Batch.

Tomlin says.

"Well Charlie I'm glad at least you believe in yourself!"

To which Batch replies.

"Uh not really coach, I can't seem to find my cell phone. Oh here it is, see you later coach!"

Back in the room, Tomlin sighs and clears the podium when suddenly looking up he sees someone he missed before sitting in the room. It's Plaxico. To which Tomlin says.

"Glad to see you're buying in Plax!"

Responds Burress, "uh what's that you say coach? And hey I'm sorry about being a little late to the meeting just now. So what's up?"



:wink02:

[zulater]

I havent seen him ever pl;ay in the NFL, but at MSU he was a really good QB, but that always doesnt translate to the NFL. I am not giving u on chuck, but we cant throw the ball al davis style with him that is not his strong suit. If the steelers can find a RB that will not fumble the ball or stick with one or 2, then i dont see a problem with chuck

Honestly I never heard of him before last week. But in limited playing time with the Patriots he played respectfully. And he wasn't the 3rd string qb, he was the Pats primary back-up for two years. So I guess Bellicheat thought he had some game?

Anyway he's not old and broke down like Lefty and Batch, and who knows, whip up a simple game plan, commit to the run, and maybe you can give the Ravens a game?

Anyone got any youtube's of Hoyer throwing or a scouting report you can post?

[Nadroj 20]

I don't see how it can be much worse so I say yeah give him a shot. Batch couldn't even throw a 5 yard out route without leaving it 4 yards short. He just doesn't have any zip on his ball.

Put a young guy in there that can at least make the short throws and give our offense SOMETHING to work with.

[steelerdude15]

I wouldn't mind seeing the new guy play.

[oneforthetoe]

Normally I would blast an idea like this as stupid, but I have to agree .... it seems Charlie doesn't have the arm any more. I'd probably start Charlie and see how it goes early. I think we can run against the Ravens. Oddly enough the Browns probably have a better d that the Ravens at this point. If Charlie struggles early, make the move. Besides people say Hoyer doesn't know the offense, but with two years under Belicheat, I just assume he has seen film of every offense in the league.

[steelreserve]

I'm a big believer in the idea that it couldn't be worse than what happened last time, so why the hell not give him a try. That was what happened with Leftwich, and Batch was just as bad, so ... next.

[BlastFurnace]

It's not only that Charlie can't throw anymore, but it also is apparent that Tomlin has absolutely no confidence in him.

Without Ben, they aren't beating Baltimore anyway. Why not give the new guy a shot.

Just don't put Legursky at guard trying to block Ngata.

[zulater]

Wow, I can't believe I haven't got anyone calling me stupid yet today for posting this thread! :heh:

[Dwinsgames]

if Ben can not go , I must consider missing my first Steeler game in 42 years , Just not sure I can put myself through another game like we witnessed the past 2 weeks .. I am not getting any younger you know and time is becoming more and more precious as the years go by why waist it on supreme disappointment and anguish and frustration ... besides I am not ready to buy yet another TV ........ http://draftsteel.com/ff/images/smilies/thinking.gif

[86WARD]

I don't see how it can be much worse so I say yeah give him a shot. Batch couldn't even throw a 5 yard out route without leaving it 4 yards short. He just doesn't have any zip on his ball.

Put a young guy in there that can at least make the short throws and give our offense SOMETHING to work with.

This. Can't hurt.

[Seven]

Hoyer is a very good quarterback prospect. I'd have a hard time starting him since we just signed him, but what the hell - why not. At least he has an arm.

[Psycho Ward 86]

No. enough knee jerk reactions.

[zulater]

No. enough knee jerk reactions.

How's it knee jerk? The last two games have proved to us that Batch and Leftwich aren't viable options. If the kid has a live arm, and understands the game well enough to have been the Patriots number 2 qb for two seasons why must we assume he can't do slightly better than they have? A good offensive coordinater should be able to pare down the play book, work in a couple specific things Hoyer does well, and crank up the running game.

[DarthSpartans20]

Start Batch. Remember that yesterday we were without our best receiver, our best run blocking O-lineman, and Burress was on the field only a week after being picked up. Batch only had one week of practice with the first team offense and it didnt help that the RB's were giving away the ball like it was government cheese. Start Batch, limit the dumb holding calls, and work Heath Miller in the gameplan more. Batch gives the Steelers the best chance to win right now.

[SteelerFanInStl]

Hoyer couldn't be any worse than Batch. Batch couldn't get the ball to anyone yesterday. He's done.

[pepsyman1]

Batch made it apparent that he doesn't have enough arm anymore. He was inaccurate most of the day and severely under threw a number of throws. He's done

[43Hitman]

Might as well see what the kid has. I think Ben will play this week though, even though he probably shouldn't.

[siss]

If Ben can't go...we should put him on IR and go for a top 10 pick!

[Dwinsgames]

If Ben can't go...we should put him on IR and go for a top 10 pick!


http://draftsteel.com/ff/images/smilies/vomit.gif

[Craic]

How's it knee jerk? The last two games have proved to us that Batch and Leftwich aren't viable options. If the kid has a live arm, and understands the game well enough to have been the Patriots number 2 qb for two seasons why must we assume he can't do slightly better than they have? A good offensive coordinater should be able to pare down the play book, work in a couple specific things Hoyer does well, and crank up the running game.

See - this is what I said in the last thread. Starting the day after a game, I'm usually agreeing with a majority of your posts.

You're exactly right. This isn't knee-jerk. If Batch was getting sacked because he had to hold on to the ball, if he was being intercepted because the wide receivers just weren't caring, if the center was muffing snaps, then I'd say keep Charlie in and give him another shot. That's not what happened though.

Charlie was not able to throw the long ball. He bounced the football off defender's heads a good five yards or so behind the receiver. He put the ball in the dirt. He threw behind Wallace, which caused the INT (they both get fifty percent of the blame for that INT). He changed the plays into run plays that would get two yards at most.

I am not one for knee-jerk reactions. I think that's probably a pretty widely known thing around here about me. However, Zu is absolutely right this time. When a player just doesn't have the ability to play at the NFL level anymore, then it's time for him to retire, and time for a younger QB to come in and back up Ben. More specific to this thread, it's time to put Batch on the Bench and raise the new kid up to the primary backup position.

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If Ben can't go...we should put him on IR and go for a top 10 pick!

Hey, there you go, then we trade out of the first round with it, picking up a low first round pick and a first round pick for next year. We keep bumping those picks throughout the first part of this decade until we have to draft a replacement for Ben, and use them to get up into the number 3-9 spot! I love it! Let's do that!

:chuckle: Oh, and the obligatory :sarcasm: (not directed towards you, siss - just having fun this morning).

[oneforthetoe]

I think it is time to give our emergency QB a shot. Heath Miller drops back and finds Heath Miller in the flat, Heath Miller picks up a block from Heath Miller and scores. Unfortunately, Heath Miller picks up a 15 yard penalty for celebrating with Heath Miller. No worries though, with Heath Miller running down the field to cover kickoffs.

Heath Miller = The "Bill Braskey" of the Pittsburgh Steelers 2012 season.

[Crow-Magnon]

At this point, I would say start him. Leftwich and Batch are not going to beat Baltimore at home. The Patriots couldn't with Brady.

[zulater]

If Ben can't go...we should put him on IR and go for a top 10 pick!

Never never never! Not the Steelers way. Good players come to good teams no matter where they draft. Operate your team like losers and that's what you become no matter where you draft.

[zulater]

The offense hasn't been able to do much without Roethlisberger. In 29 drives without the franchise's leading passer, the Steelers have produced two offensive touchdowns. And you can't even give all of the credit to the offense for those touchdowns because both were set up by defensive pass interference penalties.

Batch was "Checkdown Charlie" against the Browns, completing 20 of 34 passes for 199 yards and three interceptions. He struggled mightily on third down, where the Steelers couldn't convert on eight of nine opportunities (11 percent).

Even though offensive coordinator Todd Haley stuck with the short passing game, the weak-armed Batch couldn't capitalize on the few times he went downfield. According to ESPN Stats & Information, Batch completed two of 11 (18.2 percent) passes with two interceptions on throws more than 10 yards downfield, including zero of five with an interception targeting Wallace.

Asked about Batch's performance, Tomlin said succinctly, "Not good enough."

http://espn.go.com/blog/afcnorth/post/_/id/59785/steelers-in-big-trouble-without-big-ben

[siss]

Never never never! Not the Steelers way. Good players come to good teams no matter where they draft. Operate your team like losers and that's what you become no matter where you draft.
I actually saw a post that suggested this back in Oct. I rolled my eyes than!

Oh and I was being sarcastic in my post!

[Psycho Ward 86]

How's it knee jerk? The last two games have proved to us that Batch and Leftwich aren't viable options. If the kid has a live arm, and understands the game well enough to have been the Patriots number 2 qb for two seasons why must we assume he can't do slightly better than they have? A good offensive coordinater should be able to pare down the play book, work in a couple specific things Hoyer does well, and crank up the running game.

i can stop you at the words "two games" because most of us were in Chicken Little mode after our d getting torn up by the broncos, raiders, and titans. How many of us would have thought we would be 4th in scoring defense, 1st in yards allowed, 1st in pass defense, and 5th in rush defense after those 3 showings? Only 1 of those interceptions was all on charlie (the outroute to plax). The quick slant to wallace was behind but catchable and definitely shouldnt have been anything close to an interception. The hail mary to wallace, once again, was necessary, though underthrown. He didnt have much of a choice that late in the game but to say "f*ck it" and give it a whirl. Dont put this game Charlie. You are kidding yourself if you expect any quarterback in the NFL to lead a team to victory with 8 turnovers, with most of those not being his fault.

Can you honestly say with a straight face that we wouldve won with Hoyer in? The guy's been with us for a week. And of course he was the #2 with the patriots for so long. Like the colts, they had nothing but garbage behind their all-pro starting quarterback.

[43Hitman]

i can stop you at the words "two games" because most of us were in Chicken Little mode after our d getting torn up by the broncos, raiders, and titans. How many of us would have thought we would be 4th in scoring defense, 1st in yards allowed, 1st in pass defense, and 5th in rush defense after those 3 showings? Only 1 of those interceptions was all on charlie (the outroute to plax). The quick slant to wallace was behind but catchable and definitely shouldnt have been anything close to an interception. The hail mary to wallace, once again, was necessary, though underthrown. He didnt have much of a choice that late in the game but to say "f*ck it" and give it a whirl. Dont put this game Charlie. You are kidding yourself if you expect any quarterback in the NFL to lead a team to victory with 8 turnovers, with most of those not being his fault.

Can you honestly say with a straight face that we wouldve won with Hoyer in? The guy's been with us for a week. And of course he was the #2 with the patriots for so long. Like the colts, they had nothing but garbage behind their all-pro starting quarterback.

yeah I'm pretty sure I was one of those in "the sky is falling" mode, but to lazy at the moment to look it up. As far as Hoyer goes, who know what would have happened. Hard for the team to play much worse than they did yesterday though. Defense excluded.

[Psycho Ward 86]

yeah I'm pretty sure I was one of those in "the sky is falling" mode, but to lazy at the moment to look it up. As far as Hoyer goes, who know what would have happened. Hard for the team to play much worse than they did yesterday though. Defense excluded.

lol i was one of the people considering the change to the 4-3 :lol:

[Craic]

i can stop you at the words "two games" because most of us were in Chicken Little mode after our d getting torn up by the broncos, raiders, and titans. How many of us would have thought we would be 4th in scoring defense, 1st in yards allowed, 1st in pass defense, and 5th in rush defense after those 3 showings? Only 1 of those interceptions was all on charlie (the outroute to plax). The quick slant to wallace was behind but catchable and definitely shouldnt have been anything close to an interception. The hail mary to wallace, once again, was necessary, though underthrown. He didnt have much of a choice that late in the game but to say "f*ck it" and give it a whirl. Dont put this game Charlie. You are kidding yourself if you expect any quarterback in the NFL to lead a team to victory with 8 turnovers, with most of those not being his fault.

Can you honestly say with a straight face that we wouldve won with Hoyer in? The guy's been with us for a week. And of course he was the #2 with the patriots for so long. Like the colts, they had nothing but garbage behind their all-pro starting quarterback.

I can say that we would have had just as good of a chance to win at the very least, because my guess is that Hoyer at least has the arm strength to get the ball fifteen, twenty yards downfield fast enough to make safeties respect it and not just crowd the LoS.

One thing I will say for Batch however, he did move around better in the pocket than I expected him too.

[Count Steeler]

Pretty tall task to ask Hoyer to play against the Ravens for his first appearance. They probably know the offense better than he does at this point.

How long is Lefty out for? If he didn't get injured against the Ravens, we probably would have won yesterday.

[Nadroj 20]

No. enough knee jerk reactions.

How is this a knee jerk reaction? What did Batch do yesterday that gives you confidence in him?

Hoyer literally can't be any worse than Batch.

[steeldawg]

I think you have to start hoyer on arm strength alone over batch. Batch cant make throws anymore that are essential to moving the ball in the nfl.

[Psycho Ward 86]

Hoyer literally can't be any worse than Batch.

because it was 1 start. and apparently based on 1 start charlie cant get the job done. 8 fumbles, 5 of them lost makes it almost impossible to score points for any team. 3 picks yes, but 1 one of them shouldnt have even come close to being an interception (the slant pass), and the other was just a necessary shot down the field to have even a chance at winning the game.

This whole "he can't be any worse" theory reminds me of the jets situation with sanchez and tebow. "Tebow can't be any worse". Yes, yes he can. He's THAT bad. Hoyer just got here, we're going to have to have a grossly scaled down and simple playbook in order to start him and thats probably not going to end well.

[zulater]

because it was 1 start. and apparently based on 1 start charlie cant get the job done. 8 fumbles, 5 of them lost makes it almost impossible to score points for any team. 3 picks yes, but 1 one of them shouldnt have even come close to being an interception (the slant pass), and the other was just a necessary shot down the field to have even a chance at winning the game.

This whole "he can't be any worse" theory reminds me of the jets situation with sanchez and tebow. "Tebow can't be any worse". Yes, yes he can. He's THAT bad. Hoyer just got here, we're going to have to have a grossly scaled down and simple playbook in order to start him and thats probably not going to end well.

Actually that could be just what the doctor ordered for this offense. It seems to me guys are trying to do too much. We're possibly overthinking the equation. Simplify it streamline it, and maybe it improves regardless of who's at the helm? The lack of commitment to the running game the past two weeks is ridiculous. And start by commiting to a sensible backfield rotation while you're at it. And if the guy you deemed to be your best back fumbles, pat him on the backside, tell him to focus harder, and give him the first carry on the next series!!!!

[steeldawg]

because it was 1 start. and apparently based on 1 start charlie cant get the job done. 8 fumbles, 5 of them lost makes it almost impossible to score points for any team. 3 picks yes, but 1 one of them shouldnt have even come close to being an interception (the slant pass), and the other was just a necessary shot down the field to have even a chance at winning the game.

This whole "he can't be any worse" theory reminds me of the jets situation with sanchez and tebow. "Tebow can't be any worse". Yes, yes he can. He's THAT bad. Hoyer just got here, we're going to have to have a grossly scaled down and simple playbook in order to start him and thats probably not going to end well.

Im not blaming batch for the loss, but watching him he just cant make the throws so whats the point even if he knows the offense.

[Nadroj 20]

because it was 1 start. and apparently based on 1 start charlie cant get the job done. 8 fumbles, 5 of them lost makes it almost impossible to score points for any team. 3 picks yes, but 1 one of them shouldnt have even come close to being an interception (the slant pass), and the other was just a necessary shot down the field to have even a chance at winning the game.

This whole "he can't be any worse" theory reminds me of the jets situation with sanchez and tebow. "Tebow can't be any worse". Yes, yes he can. He's THAT bad. Hoyer just got here, we're going to have to have a grossly scaled down and simple playbook in order to start him and thats probably not going to end well.

But did you see some of the throws Batch simply could not make? I have no clue what Hoyer will bring but I think he could hit someone in the flats.

And it's not like Batch has ever been great any other start he has had has he?

[SteelMayhem72]

In all honesty guys I would sit ben. This game really(just barely) doesnt mean a whole lot...ravens are gonna win the division so shoot for the wild card and keep ben healthy/recovering one more week then make our run to win out and get hot at the right time!!!!

[steeldawg]

In all honesty guys I would sit ben. This game really(just barely) doesnt mean a whole lot...ravens are gonna win the division so shoot for the wild card and keep ben healthy/recovering one more week then make our run to win out and get hot at the right time!!!!

The game is important for the wild card slot too.

[SteelMayhem72]

Also remember that Indy has to play the texans twice I think and we need to beat cincy then I think we will have the 6th seed I think thats our only shot but you know Ben will rush back and the ravens will try and knock him out because they are the ravens!!

[Psycho Ward 86]

In all honesty guys I would sit ben. This game really(just barely) doesnt mean a whole lot...ravens are gonna win the division so shoot for the wild card and keep ben healthy/recovering one more week then make our run to win out and get hot at the right time!!!!

if this is a submission to being swept by the ravens again, you also have to make the assumption that theres a high chance we have to win out our last 4 games to get in the playoffs. and even then, theres no guarantee. If we want to control our own destiny, we have to at least try to win. Yeah, the ravens are always great at home, but we can win with Ben. We're 2-1 since 2008 (when this rivalry started) with ben starting against the ravens at M&T bank stadium

[SteelMayhem72]

The game is important for the wild card slot too. I know that but I think we need to sit Ben if hes not 100 percent!

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if this is a submission to being swept by the ravens again, you also have to make the assumption that theres a high chance we have to win out our last 4 games to get in the playoffs. and even then, theres no guarantee. If we want to control our own destiny, we have to at least try to win. Yeah, the ravens are always great at home, but we can win with Ben. We're 2-1 since 2008 (when this rivalry started) with ben starting against the ravens at M&T bank stadium I understand we need to win out no matter what but losing to the ravens is not the end and hope we dont lose Ben then we are completely done...let him heal one more week and start hoyer!!

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I know that but I think we need to sit Ben if hes not 100 percent!

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I understand we need to win out no matter what but losing to the ravens is not the end and hope we dont lose Ben then we are completely done...let him heal one more week and start hoyer!!

I would hate to be the coach and make this decision...lol

[Psycho Ward 86]

I know that but I think we need to sit Ben if hes not 100 percent!

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I understand we need to win out no matter what but losing to the ravens is not the end and hope we dont lose Ben then we are completely done...let him heal one more week and start hoyer!!

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I would hate to be the coach and make this decision...lol

according to Chris Mortensen, doctors said the rib has healed to the point that it isnt at risk for further damage. Then again, this is reporting from BSPN

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if we start hoyer and by some ridiculous chance in hell win the game, im curious to see how many teams in nfl history have started 4 fucking quarterbacks and made the playoffs :lol:

(assuming we make the playoffs)

[Dwinsgames]

according to Chris Mortensen, doctors said the rib has healed to the point that it isnt at risk for further damage. Then again, this is reporting from BSPN

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if we start hoyer and by some ridiculous chance in hell win the game, im curious to see how many teams in nfl history have started 4 fucking quarterbacks and made the playoffs :lol:

(assuming we make the playoffs)

I read that too but find it hard to conceive here is why ....

before he got hurt he was at no risk of that happening to him yet it did , now it is still a fresh injury bone does not heal fully in a couple weeks so it is still the weak link in that region so how is he at no greater risk now than he was prior to it being injured ??

kind of a dumb comment for a doctor to make IMO

[SteelMayhem72]

As a matter a fact an analyst on nfl network just said the same thing...not tooting my own horn but I agree totally with sitting ben this week!

[SteelMayhem72]

I read that too but find it hard to conceive here is why ....

before he got hurt he was at no risk of that happening to him yet it did , now it is still a fresh injury bone does not heal fully in a couple weeks so it is still the weak link in that region so how is he at no greater risk now than he was prior to it being injured ??

kind of a dumb comment for a doctor to make IMO

something tells me this injury to his ribs occured a few weeks back to be honest....a rib doesnt heal that quick...ive had broke ribs and it took a month!

[stillers4me]

something tells me this injury to his ribs occured a few weeks back to be honest....a rib doesnt heal that quick...ive had broke ribs and it took a month!

It was a dislocated rib, not a fracture.

[SteelMayhem72]

something tells me this injury to his ribs occured a few weeks back to be honest....a rib doesnt heal that quick...ive had broke ribs and it took a month! On top of that I didnt know at the time I had broke ribs...just a slight pain 3 weeks later and felt knots on my ribs!

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It was a dislocated rib, not a fracture. Usually a rib doesnt dislocate without being fractured at some point

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On top of that I didnt know at the time I had broke ribs...just a slight pain 3 weeks later and felt knots on my ribs!

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Usually a rib doesnt dislocate without being fractured at some point Thats why I say this occured a little while back

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On top of that I didnt know at the time I had broke ribs...just a slight pain 3 weeks later and felt knots on my ribs!

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Usually a rib doesnt dislocate without being fractured atThats why I think the found the rib like that when they found the strain



Thats why I say this occured a little while back

[Shoes]

I'd start him....it would give us a good look to see if he's worthy of back-up spot next season. The worst he could do is lose.... Chuck and Lefty have already done that....in an ugly way.

[JayC]

i'd be shocked if it happened but i say a big fat YES. batch makes me not even watch the games (i watched nfl redzone all day sunday instead). i think i'd watch the whole game if hoyer plays if ben is too hurt

[43Hitman]

i'd be shocked if it happened but i say a big fat YES. batch makes me not even watch the games (i watched nfl redzone all day sunday instead). i think i'd watch the whole game if hoyer plays if ben is too hurt

Not sure if Hoyer would be any better, but I'm sure he can throw a ball farther than 20 yards without it looking like a wounded duck. He probably has better feet as well, although I thought Botch moved well for a geriatric.

[Moose]

Ben is 50/50 for the rat's game. So evidently he's not 100%, with that being known Ben shouldn't play at all. That leaves Batch as the starter. Hopefully the coaches have had Hoyer throwing since he's signed and know what he's capable of. I think they should naturally start Batch as he's our #3, ( ugh), and after 1st quarter if the game is heading to the sewer, then what the hell....put in Hoyer and see what he can do. I have to agree with a lot of you all, I've never heard of or seen this guy. He's definitely not talked up on any sports channels, but he may be a angel in disguise so to speak. What do we have to lose, that's what he's signed for right ?

[86WARD]

It actually doesn't really matter who starts...they'll probably lose and then it's on to hoping for a 10-6 record to get the WC spot.

[smokin3000gt]

I think Batch is all used up but if he were to start against the ravens I don't think he'll be as bad as he was against the browns. Haley will probably do a few things different as well.

[Dwinsgames]

this is still football , this is still a contact sport ( for now anyways ) ...

anything can happen , hell for all we know Harrison may hit Flacco on the first series and he may miss the rest of the game and that leaves the Ravens with what exactly at QB ?

Tyrod Taylor that's who ... who is he you ask ? well he is a 2nd year pro who has a grand total of 5 NFL passes for 48 yards and has been sacked twice for his efforts ... not exactly an all pro

[GoSlash27]

Absolutely not. Hoyer doesn't know the system. Even if Hoyer is a better QB in all respects, Batch gets the nod for that reason alone.

[Dwinsgames]

I hated Charlie Batch's Phil Niekro impersonation. Trying to throw against the Cleveland Browns' secondary on Sunday (http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2012112501/2012/REG12/steelers@browns), the Pittsburgh Steelers (http://www.nfl.com/teams/pittsburghsteelers/profile?team=PIT)' backup quarterback really resembled the Atlanta Braves' famous knuckleball pitcher (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phil_Niekro). I'm happy the Browns (http://www.nfl.com/teams/clevelandbrowns/profile?team=CLE) finally beat the Steelers (http://www.nfl.com/teams/pittsburghsteelers/profile?team=PIT), but Pittsburgh did everything possible to lose the game, from playing Batch to fumbling the ball. If the Steelers (http://www.nfl.com/teams/pittsburghsteelers/profile?team=PIT) don't make the playoffs this year, it will be because they kept Batch and Byron Leftwich (http://www.nfl.com/player/byronleftwich/2505673/profile), who have both seen better days, as their backup quarterbacks ....... Michael Lombardi on Twitter @michaelombardi (http://twitter.com/michaelombardi/).

http://draftsteel.com/ff/images/smilies/truedat.gif

[zulater]

Absolutely not. Hoyer doesn't know the system. Even if Hoyer is a better QB in all respects, Batch gets the nod for that reason alone.

Any OC worth his salt should be able to simplyfy his game plan enough to accomadate an NFL expeirenced qb within a couple weeks on the roster. In my opinion talent should trump marriage to a system. Basically all teams runs the same plays with different names and slight derivations in formations. It's not like Hoyer is a rookie. If the Steelers applied themselves and dummied it down a little they could probably put together an effective game plan around Hoyer.

I think it would be easiar to do that than make a game plan around a qb who can't get the ball to open receivers all day. Or can't throw the ball more than 10 yards downfield with any accuracy.

[GoSlash27]

Any OC worth his salt should be able to simplyfy his game plan enough to accomadate an NFL expeirenced qb within a couple weeks on the roster. In my opinion talent should trump marriage to a system. Basically all teams runs the same plays with different names and slight derivations in formations. It's not like Hoyer is a rookie. If the Steelers applied themselves and dummied it down a little they could probably put together an effective game plan around Hoyer.

I think it would be easiar to do that than make a game plan around a qb who can't get the ball to open receivers all day. Or can't throw the ball more than 10 yards downfield with any accuracy.

Clearly they disagree with you. Can you think of any instance where an NFL team picked up a QB off the wire and tossed him out under center?

[zulater]

Clearly they disagree with you. Can you think of any instance where an NFL team picked up a QB off the wire and tossed him out under center?

Off the top of my head no. But I also can't remember the last time an NFL team trotted out a guy behind center who can't complete a pass more than 9 yards past the line of scrimmage either! :lol:

Later I'll do a little research, maybe there's a couple examples out there?

But overall you're right. No matter how futile it may appear the plan seems to be to stick with Charlie until Ben proves he's ready to play again.

[Dwinsgames]

Clearly they disagree with you. Can you think of any instance where an NFL team picked up a QB off the wire and tossed him out under center?


Josh McCown 2011 Chicago Bears http://draftsteel.com/ff/images/smilies/ok.gif

Cutler went down , Haine failed and McCown ( who was picked up from walking the streets To be the backup to Haine ) started vs the Packers last December

[zulater]

How much more of the offense would T.J. Yates have had mastered when he was inserted last year by the Texans than Hoyer would have now? Yates was a rookie who wasn't being groomed to play. All he probably ever did was run the scout team so he wouldn't really even be that immersed in the Texan's offense when circumstances dictated he played. As I remember they scaled down their offense to the bare bones for him and he won a couple games for them and kept them competitve in the others.

I really don't see where a 3 year NFL veteran like Hoying couldn't be brought up to the same level of preparedness that Yates was?

Hell, a better example yet would be all the rookie's who played last year at the start of the season despite no OTA's and a very helter skelter training camp where free agency was more or less jumbled into training camp and preseason.

Again, assuming that Hoying has something resembling an NFL arm ( which sadly Batch no longer does) I don't see how a well coached team couldn't put together a simple game plan that could be operated effeciently enough to be competitive.

[Count Steeler]

Again, assuming that Hoying has something resembling an NFL arm ( which sadly Batch no longer does) I don't see how a well coached team couldn't put together a simple game plan that could be operated effeciently enough to be competitive.

The spotlight is definitely on some of the coaches this week. Can they recover and have a good game against the Ravens? I think they can.

[GoSlash27]

Off the top of my head no. But I also can't remember the last time an NFL team trotted out a guy behind center who can't complete a pass more than 9 yards past the line of scrimmage either! :lol:

Later I'll do a little research, maybe there's a couple examples out there?

But overall you're right. No matter how futile it may appear the plan seems to be to stick with Charlie until Ben proves he's ready to play again.

FWIW Labs and Mike agree with you, and I'd also agree... next week.
http://www.steelers.com/video-and-audio/videos/Agree-to-Disagree----Baltimore/42c41d43-8548-4c55-b0d1-8065ec096cec

[zulater]

4. Jason Campbell, Charlie Batch and Byron Leftwich might make NFL teams rethink the value in having a veteran backup quarterback.

A veteran backup QB is, generally speaking, someone else’s failure. He’s someone another team decided it couldn’t win with. The QB is so important to an NFL team’s success that I now believe every team should draft a QB in the first three rounds every year.

A veteran who can digest an entire playbook is an asset to the offensive coordinator. Making life easy on the offensive coordinator is not the key to winning games in the NFL. Having someone who can make plays from under center is the key to winning games.

Mike Shanahan looks smart for drafting RG3 and Kirk Cousins.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/jim-harbaugh-alex-smith-colin-kaepernick-lie-could-haunt-49ers-coach-nfl-truths-112712

[Seven]

Josh McCown 2011 Chicago Bears http://draftsteel.com/ff/images/smilies/ok.gif

Cutler went down , Haine failed and McCown ( who was picked up from walking the streets To be the backup to Haine ) started vs the Packers last December

I believe McCown had previously been with the Bears, though, therefore he was familiar with the offense.

While I do still agree with my prior post in this thread, I feel like as the week has gone on I've decided it would still be best to start Batch. If Dwyer can carry the ball as effectively as he did last outing against the Ravens we really shouldn't lose. Defense has been playing LIGHTS OUT. Best back to back performances I've maybe ever seen from a defense. If we didn't gain a yard last week and just had gone three and out instead of having the turnovers I think we would have won. I don't see any reason that shouldn't hold true this week, too.

Give it to Dwyer, take what that bad Ravens defense gives you points wise, and leave the rest up to our defense and Flacco-the-inept.

[86WARD]

The offense they run in NE is very similar to Haley's offense. One of the major reasons that was stated by Tomlin as to why they chose Hoyer over Kafka. So it's not that far fetched that Hoyer could come in and run the offense...and like Zu said, any good OC can slim it down or streamline it so that Hoyer understands.

[zulater]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8690852/ben-roethlisberger-pittsburgh-steelers-pain-arm-strength-problem

Looking more and more like Ben is out for the Ravens. Which really doesn't bother me too much. But what does bother me is that it seems less and less likely that Ben will be ready to play against the Chargers. If we lose that game, combined with the assumed Raven loss, and you can stick a fork in the season, and there's really no reason for Ben to come back at all this year.