Kemoeatu demoted and Legursky made starter

[chenzzo]

Bouchette just tweeted this. What do you think? I think it gives us at least one less dumb penalty per game.

http://twitter.com/#!/EdBouchette

[slippy]

i was unhappy when Kemo reentered the starting lineup after his injury. this demotion is a few weeks late IMHO. glad to see tomlin taking a proactive approach. i love ward and hoke, but it's a win NOW (as in this week) league.

i think ward will have a big moment or three before the end of the year, but cotchery is only 30!

[86WARD]

Merry Thanksgiving to us!!!!

[tube517]

Merry Thanksgiving to us!!!!

:rofl2:

[zulater]

i was unhappy when Kemo reentered the starting lineup after his injury. this demotion is a few weeks late IMHO. glad to see tomlin taking a proactive approach. i love ward and hoke, but it's a win NOW (as in this week) league.

i think ward will have a big moment or three before the end of the year, but cotchery is only 30!

Legursky was injured, so they really had no option but to start Kemo up until this last game.

And prior to the Bengal game Kemo had a couple acceptable games, not good games, but acceptable.

But Kemo stunk in the Bengals game. Not only was his pass blocking again below par, his run blocking was mediocre at best as well.

All that said I'm really not that enthused about Legursky starting. Doug gives you all he's got, and he's not going to beat you due to stupidity like Kemo often will./ But he's not all that good either. Neither is Foster for that matter ( though improving), the Steelers really need to upgrade themselves at guard next offseason.

By the way I love having Legursky on the roster, but as a sub for all three interior line positions.

[pepsyman1]

Legursky was injured, so they really had no option but to start Kemo up until this last game.

And prior to the Bengal game Kemo had a couple acceptable games, not good games, but acceptable.

But Kemo stunk in the Bengals game. Not only was his pass blocking again below par, his run blocking was mediocre at best as well.

All that said I'm really not that enthused about Legursky starting. Doug gives you all he's got, and he's not going to beat you due to stupidity like Kemo often will./ But he's not all that good either. Neither is Foster for that matter ( though improving), the Steelers really need to upgrade themselves at guard next offseason.

By the way I love having Legursky on the roster, but as a sub for all three interior line positions.

And as a fullback on 3rd and goal!

[7willBheaven]

In a way I'm shocked but yet not shocked on this move. I remember when Legs was starting while Kemo was out he did pretty good...much better than he did at RG. While I do not think he is the long term answer...I think he could finish the year better than Kemo would. His stupidity is what kills him...he's a big mauler looking guy...but just isnt too bright. He's had some awesome games over the last couple years...but he's WAY to up and down...and has become the weakest link on the OL at this point. And I too think that they should use a high draft pick on a new OG (particularly LG). Would I cut Kemo after the season? Maybe not...however if they keep him...they MUST restructure his deal...he's making almost 5 mil a year and if he's going to be a backup then he needs to make a whole lot less. Shoot i wouldnt mind seeing him at RG (his college position i think). But his knee issues worry me...so i dunno. Heres to Legs playing above where Kemo has been.

[Chidi29]

Zu basically said all that needed to be said.

Kemoeatu's struggles are well-doucmented but Legursky isn't exactly going to be a life saver either.

[slippy]

i'm not looking for spectacular splash plays from our o-line (aside from pouncy), just some solid consistant play. kemo does not provide that. legs is not great, but i'll take C to C+ on every play from the left guard.

[tube517]

Zu basically said all that needed to be said.

Kemoeatu's struggles are well-doucmented but Legursky isn't exactly going to be a life saver either.

We don't need lifesavers but we don't need drive killers like Kemo's dumb penalties. The Big Legursky is a solid backup but definitely not a full time starter.

I am wondering if Kemo is gone next year.

[st33lersguy]

Glad to see we do not have to put up with Chris Kemo hitting people late and costing the Steelers 15 yards

[Chidi29]

We don't need lifesavers but we don't need drive killers like Kemo's dumb penalties. The Big Legursky is a solid backup but definitely not a full time starter.

I am wondering if Kemo is gone next year.

My bigger issue with Kemoeatu aren't actually the penalties. It's his trouble, really incomptency, in pass protection. Legursky really won't be much of an upgrade there though he is moe fundamentally sound. He's just so limited moving laterally and his short arms allow DTs to get into his body too easy.

[The Duke]

awesome news!

good for Leg too

[steelreserve]

Kemo's play has been far from the worst I've seen out of our offensive line in recent years. But not good enough to put him above competition either, even among this group. Like someone else said, shocking but not shocking.

[oneforthetoe]

We don't need lifesavers but we don't need drive killers like Kemo's dumb penalties. The Big Legursky is a solid backup but definitely not a full time starter.

I am wondering if Kemo is gone next year.


I think he will be gone next year. The question is who replaces him? Leg is not the answer. If the Steelers trusted Colon's health. next year really would be the year to finally move him to guard. Guard is also one of the few positions where a rook can probably start for the Steelers.

[steelerdude15]

I think he will be gone next year. The question is who replaces him? Leg is not the answer. If the Steelers trusted Colon's health. next year really would be the year to finally move him to guard. Guard is also one of the few positions where a rook can probably start for the Steelers.
I hope the Steelers draft a guard next year.

[steel striker]

There was a time I thought Kemo was going to be a big part of the o-line til this year's performance. I thought he was a good run blocker but, need work in the passing game. Like mentioned above too many stupid flags as well.

[SteelerEmpire]

Now maybe Kemo-eat-u will start taking his job seriously.

[BigNastyDefense]

At least there won't be any more dumb penalties. He seems to account for at least 4 person foul penalties a season, not to mention multiple false starts. He's often an excellent run blocker, but he's never developed much as a pass blocker.

When it comes to play on the field, I don't think there is going to be much upgrade if any in Legursky. However we get a smart player who won't have the dumb personal foul or false start penalties.

Hopefully in the first or second round we get a guard. I would love to see that guard from Georgia on the interior of our offensive line.

[Steeldude]

i agree with this move, but it doesn't solve the guard problems for the future. legursky is a work horse and an intelligent player, but i feel he is better suited as a backup than a full-time starter. either way i hope he destroys the DL.

[Austin87]

I think Kemo is gone next year, I actually hope they give him a look at RG. He should be better suited there.

I love that Legursky is starting, but I have to agree with you all. He isn't really starter material.

[ALLD]

Why are we still talking about fixing the OL, since Fanacea left? This problem must be addressed in the iff-season.

[86WARD]

One less Offensive penalty a game...I'll take it...lol.

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Is he gonna see Glenn Dorsey across from him most of the game? My biggest problem with Legursky is that he doesnt get much push in the run game. He generally stalemates the D Lineman or gets pushed into the backfield. Not a bug fan of the move, but Kemo has been playing sub par for sure.

[GBMelBlount]

i agree with this move, but it doesn't solve the guard problems for the future. legursky is a work horse and an intelligent player, but i feel he is better suited as a backup than a full-time starter. either way i hope he destroys the DL.

I love Legursky's attitude. He works very hard and has improved and I feel in another year or two he could be a satisfactory starter.

[zulater]

I love Legursky's attitude. He works very hard and has improved and I feel in another year or two he could be a satisfactory starter.

You can't teach size and athletic ability. Doug's ceiling is that of a mediocre to lower tier starter imo.

[GBMelBlount]

You can't teach size and athletic ability. Doug's ceiling is that of a mediocre to lower tier starter imo.

...and you can't always motivate those with size and athletic ability. We could debate gentetics vs. heart all day long with no clear cut winner.

Is Legursky what I would IDEALLY like for our starting line right now. No. But he is young and has upside IMO and with how little attention we have paid to the line in the last 5 years I am happy with "mediocre" and "satisfactory" at this moment as compared to how our offensive looked when the season began.

That's all.

[Chidi29]

Legursky doesn't have upside. He has been around long enough for the team and fans to see what kind of player he is. He's a valuable swingman and capable of making a spot start, but put him in a starting position over a period of time, and you start to see his flaws.

[zulater]

Legursky doesn't have upside. He has been around long enough for the team and fans to see what kind of player he is. He's a valuable swingman and capable of making a spot start, but put him in a starting position over a period of time, and you start to see his flaws.

Our opponents certainly will. When you have more film on a player, know he's going to start, his weaknesses will be exposed and exploited, and usually at the worst possible times. No one game plans a reserve. That's why a back up will often outperform a starter in a relief role.

[Chidi29]

Our opponents certainly will. When you have more film on a player, know he's going to start, his weaknesses will be exposed and exploited, and usually at the worst possible times. No one game plans a reserve. That's why a back up will often outperform a starter in a relief role.

And now there's enough footage of Legursky from the past two years. So while he is coming in from a backup role, it won't be the same situation from last year.

[zulater]

And now there's enough footage of Legursky from the past two years. So while he is coming in from a backup role, it won't be the same situation from last year.

I think Kemo's knee is a big part of this decision too. He's not the same player he was in 2008. Maybe a couple weeks off will get his knee right, and the benching will get his head right, so if he's given another chance later in the season he'll more resemble the player he was in 2008? One can hope anyway. Because he really was a good starter for a while there.

[Chidi29]

I think Kemo's knee is a big part of this decision too. He's not the same player he was in 2008. Maybe a couple weeks off will get his knee right, and the benching will get his head right, so if he's given another chance later in the season he'll more resemble the player he was in 2008? One can hope anyway. Because he really was a good starter for a while there.

That's a good point zu. He's probably been playing in pain for the past two years. I still remember a post-game interview last season where he said it was the first time he suffered knee and ankle sprains in the same game. And then he obviously missed time in camp because of a knee problem.

The guy is tough, I'll give him that.

[Craic]

You can't teach size and athletic ability. Doug's ceiling is that of a mediocre to lower tier starter imo.
NO, but they CAN be overcome.

I say it all the time, but if you ever want to see how determination and heart overcomes skill and ability, check out the Sutter brothers in Hockey. I know, it's hockey, not football. But the point is the same, if you have the talent to make a team, heart and determination can make you the best on the field, or the ice. It's how the Sutters could always outskate players that were faster than them. It's how Heinz Ward can out jump DB's that are more athletic than him. Of course, there's a limit... but unless you've tapped the limit just getting into the league, then the limit on heart vs. ability really isn't going to be reached most of the time (for an example of when it is, see 180LB DB on Pats* TE).

[Edman]

Put Doug Legursky's Head in Kemoeatu's body and you have a starting Guard.

[Craic]

Put Doug Legursky's Head in Kemoeatu's body and you have a starting Guard.

Kemo's? Imagine his head in Max Starks's body

[Psycho Ward 86]

Kemo's? Imagine his head in Max Starks's body

you missed the point?

[steelerdude15]

Looking at some scouting reports, David DeCastro of Stanford looks to be the best guard right now. He is good a pass protection and can open up holes for rushers. The only thing about Kemo is that he is our best pulling guard for the run. That's one thing were losing with sitting him out, but we are putting in a player who works extremely hard. I guess we'll see what happens Sunday night.

[GBMelBlount]

NO, but they CAN be overcome.

I say it all the time, but if you ever want to see how determination and heart overcomes skill and ability, check out the Sutter brothers in Hockey. I know, it's hockey, not football. But the point is the same, if you have the talent to make a team, heart and determination can make you the best on the field, or the ice. It's how the Sutters could always outskate players that were faster than them. It's how Heinz Ward can out jump DB's that are more athletic than him. Of course, there's a limit... but unless you've tapped the limit just getting into the league, then the limit on heart vs. ability really isn't going to be reached most of the time (for an example of when it is, see 180LB DB on Pats* TE).

Great post Preach...I agree.

On a side note....I also agree, Max Starks amazing size and ability coupled with Legursky's heart and intensity would be a great combination.

Although admittedly, having watched "Young Frankenstein," this head body / stuff does not always turn out as expected...:chuckle:

[XxKnightxX]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYU-yxG9nhs&feature=related

This is what basically put Kemo on my shit list. Absolute laziness and lack of focus, and he hasnt garnered any positive points this season at all. I wish what would of happened if he had signed with the Jets and maybe we would of been doing more to upgrade our line. Next one is Willie Colon. Not of when hes getting canned or to see if hes gonna be a foundation or just a burden on the upgrading of the O line.

[Chidi29]

NO, but they CAN be overcome.

I say it all the time, but if you ever want to see how determination and heart overcomes skill and ability, check out the Sutter brothers in Hockey. I know, it's hockey, not football. But the point is the same, if you have the talent to make a team, heart and determination can make you the best on the field, or the ice. It's how the Sutters could always outskate players that were faster than them. It's how Heinz Ward can out jump DB's that are more athletic than him. Of course, there's a limit... but unless you've tapped the limit just getting into the league, then the limit on heart vs. ability really isn't going to be reached most of the time (for an example of when it is, see 180LB DB on Pats* TE).

Sorry Preach, but we know what we're getting in Legursky. We're not talking about a guy we've only seen in college or just in the preseason. He's gotten an extensive amount of starting time. Knowing that he isn't the most athletic, I find it unlikely we're going to see some great big turnaround from Bronko.

[GBMelBlount]

Give up Preach.

How could you be so foolish to think that with Legursky's intelligence, hard work ethic and great attitude that there could still possibly be room for significant improvement.

He is physically handicapped and that is all there is to it.

..and as pointed out he has played a number of games and is in his third year....let's face it, he has hit his ceiling and could never be a solid starter. :chuckle:

[Chidi29]

Give up Preach.

How could you be so foolish to think that with Legursky's intelligence, hard work ethic and great attitude that there could still possibly be room for significant improvement.

He is physically handicapped and that is all there is to it.

..and as pointed out he has played a number of games and is in his third year....let's face it, he has hit his ceiling and could never be a solid starter. :chuckle:

I love Legursky and his blue-collar attitude and give the guy all the credit in the world because he's had to work for everything he's earned ten fold that of anyone else, but let's take off the black and goal glasses for a moment.

There's nothing I've seen in his game to tell me that he will become a much better player than he is now. He's a hard worker, lunch-pail guy who is valuable off the bench, but personally, I've seen enough out of him to feel like I have a pretty good read. Of course, that isn't concrete but again, no reason to think this stint will be much different than the last.

[Craic]

you missed the point?
Not at all, I think maybe you did... IMO, Starks has better physical tools than Kemo. Starks also does not know how to play mad.

[Craic]

I love Legursky and his blue-collar attitude and give the guy all the credit in the world because he's had to work for everything he's earned ten fold that of anyone else, but let's take off the black and goal glasses for a moment.

There's nothing I've seen in his game to tell me that he will become a much better player than he is now. He's a hard worker, lunch-pail guy who is valuable off the bench, but personally, I've seen enough out of him to feel like I have a pretty good read. Of course, that isn't concrete but again, no reason to think this stint will be much different than the last.

See, I'm just not so sure about that. There is one thing that keeps getting at me which no one has been able to answer. Why is it that Legursky is one of the strongest men on the team (according to weight lifting, which isn't completely transitional, I admit), but cannot get a good push off the LOS? To me, that screams technique. I feel like there is something there that he, the O line coach, and the other players are missing when they watch film on him. What it is, I have no idea. But 2 and 2 are not adding up to 4 for me.

[Psycho Ward 86]

Not at all, I think maybe you did... IMO, Starks has better physical tools than Kemo. Starks also does not know how to play mad.

And thats one of the strong speculations about him from Kugler's interviews as to why he was cut in the offseason. Not just his weight, but his lack of a mean streak. Kugler loves those guys. And Starks is playing his best right now so theres not really any reason to care about grit and scrappiness from him. Very easy to say that Starks has better physical tools, well duh, anyone would say that this season. Going back a season and a half before he went on IR though, i think we all know who the mauler is and he (Kemo) even used to get some serious love from analysts on NFL playbook all the time.

And Preach i dont think it was you being down on Colon so this isnt directed to you at all, but there are so many people on this board that completely forgot how well he was playing before he went on IR two years running. I know longer expect him to play like he used to, but it's just sad that if he never gets healthy enough to play like he did in the heydays that people will remember him as a turd of a lineman and a "false start" machine. Good god, that would just be awful.

[Craic]

And thats one of the strong speculations about him from Kugler's interviews as to why he was cut in the offseason. Not just his weight, but his lack of a mean streak. Kugler loves those guys. And Starks is playing his best right now so theres not really any reason to care about grit and scrappiness from him. Very easy to say that Starks has better physical tools, well duh, anyone would say that this season. Going back a season and a half before he went on IR though, i think we all know who the mauler is and he (Kemo) even used to get some serious love from analysts on NFL playbook all the time.

And Preach i dont think it was you being down on Colon so this isnt directed to you at all, but there are so many people on this board that completely forgot how well he was playing before he went on IR two years running. I know longer expect him to play like he used to, but it's just sad that if he never gets healthy enough to play like he did in the heydays that people will remember him as a turd of a lineman and a "false start" machine. Good god, that would just be awful.

Yeah, that definitely wasn't me. I've thought that Colon was our best lineman in the second half of the decade. He always showed up for a game, he always played mad, and he always worked his rear-end off. My only point about Starks, was that I think he's been a waste of talent and gift.

That doesn't mean I think he's horrible. It means I think he has sold himself out very short. With Leg's heart and head, Starks could possibly have been one of the best in the NFL.

[Psycho Ward 86]

My only point about Starks, was that I think he's been a waste of talent and gift.
That doesn't mean I think he's horrible. It means I think he has sold himself out very short. With Leg's heart and head, Starks could possibly have been one of the best in the NFL.

Agreed. At least he's starting to look more like the player that shutdown Jared Allen and Elvis Dumervil in '09, and less like the one that got destroyed by washed up nobodies....also in '09 lol

[GBMelBlount]

Originally Posted by Chidi29

I love Legursky and his blue-collar attitude and give the guy all the credit in the world because he's had to work for everything he's earned ten fold that of anyone else, but let's take off the black and goal glasses for a moment....

Legursky doesn't have upside. He has been around long enough for the team and fans to see what kind of player he is.....


And now there's enough footage of Legursky from the past two years. So while he is coming in from a backup role, it won't be the same situation from last year.

Black & Goal glasses? Legursky has NO upside? LOL.

While you may be right to say that a player who is only in his third year of pro ball with only a handful of starts has no upside, it seems a bit narrow minded.

Things like speed, quickness, lateral movement, agility, balance, skill, technique, strength, mistakes and flexibility can be improved upon year after year through hard and thoughtful work.

...and there are many players who work very hard and continually improve and do not peak until their late 20's and even 30.

So I will choose to wait and see as the one thing you cannot measure is the size of his heart and his will to succeed.....as sometimes that will overcome apparent "physical limitations."

That's all.

[Chidi29]

See, I'm just not so sure about that. There is one thing that keeps getting at me which no one has been able to answer. Why is it that Legursky is one of the strongest men on the team (according to weight lifting, which isn't completely transitional, I admit), but cannot get a good push off the LOS? To me, that screams technique. I feel like there is something there that he, the O line coach, and the other players are missing when they watch film on him. What it is, I have no idea. But 2 and 2 are not adding up to 4 for me.

You're saying his technique is off?

If so, I'd have to disagree. For a guy like him to be successful, with so much stacked against him in terms of physical limitations, he has to be nearly flawless with the little things. And from what I've seen, his technique doesn't look bad like Kemo's. Part of the hard work Legursky puts in likely comes from learning all he can to be the best player he can be.

It's just that the best player in him isn't very special.